Repairing the Cogs of Morrowind No. 17

Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 1:13 pm

That's the hardest problem in programming. If you pay me for 12 months work, then maybe it will happen. If that's too expensive I can make three extra threads that spin in circles all day, all four cores will be in use and no-one will be able to tell the difference.



To be honest, after thinking about this, we wouldn't want it to utilize all 4 cores anyway, 2 would be more than sufficient for the performance increase, and it would still allow 2 threads to control the OS and background services......anyways, just thinking in print.....I honestly don't have too much of an issue with morrowind performance as it stands, the only time I have an issue with performance is when using lots of mods and MGE and all its bells and whistles, which....is worth the tradeoff IMO.
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Bitter End
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:55 am

It can't take care of it with compressed textures, it really is up to the artist. Mipmaps are just one issue among many. Minified textures without mips use large amounts of extra memory bandwidth, a bottleneck which impacts framerates but relatively easy to avoid.


IMHO, Mipmaps are generated automaticly by Direct3D functions. So There is no need to provide them. Well, the loading time would improve, though.
The use of the DDS Texture format is more clever. DDS Textures are stored compressed in memory and this results in less memory usage and faster texture loading.
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Cccurly
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:36 pm

IMHO, Mipmaps are generated automaticly by Direct3D functions. So There is no need to provide them.

This is quite wrong.

Even if you forced it in your drivers the mipmap quality is low compared to doing it properly in the tool chain.
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Eliza Potter
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 4:14 pm

Alright, http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/1633/mouseprob.png is a screenshot clearly showing the problem. This only occurs whenever my character isn't wearing transparent armor or clothing.
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NAkeshIa BENNETT
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 12:08 pm

beta 5 is uploaded

- Armor hit sound volume should be all good now, still working on weapons volume.
- Rewrote two fixes to save space, 'show transparent clothes in inventory' and 'enchant glow in fog'. Please check they still work well, graphics cards can be fickle.
-clip-

@Hrnchamd

Testing results for 1.7beta5:
* Verified - 'Unrestrict menu size' patch works great; stats and magic menus fully resizable now.
* Confirmed - hit sound volume levels are working properly now; tested against light, medium, and heavy armors including shields worn by player and NPCs, with both striking using various weapons and hand-2-hand; tested with volume levels set at minimum, 10 ticks up from minimum, and half volume while master volume was kept at maximum.
* Verified - 'Show transparent clothes in the inventory' and 'Enchant glow in fog fix' patch updates working as expected; tested against nvidia 8800GT 512MB, display driver v195.62.

Haven't tested the other beta patches yet.


Inventory behavior issues
* While inventory menu open, player encumbrance is not immediately updated when dropping items; conversely, picking up an item with inventory open adds its weight to encumbrance immediately (as expected).

Haven't run into any other specific issues with adding/removing items yet. Will continue testing and report back if I find anything.
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koumba
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:19 pm

Hate to sound like a total dunce, but has the link for Beta 5 been uploaded yet?
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Cash n Class
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 2:01 pm

Hate to sound like a total dunce, but has the link for Beta 5 been uploaded yet?

Same location as previous betas - tesnexus MCP Skunk Works.

I don't think Hrnchamd ever puts the link to it on the OP since that location is only for beta test builds - look back a few pages in this thread for a link.
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chloe hampson
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 6:55 pm

Thanks :)
I just tried out the New beta and I'm afraid to report that the cursor issue I'm suffering from has not been solved. If it helps my graphics card is an Intel g33/g31 express chipset family.
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Alex Blacke
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 11:01 pm

Oh, I wasn't resetting the alpha test threshold, all fixed now. All that time ago when I first implemented it I wanted to use state blocks but MGE stubs them out *angryfist*. I have also found where fog of war is updated, maybe I can do something about that.

If you guys want the inventory screwups fixed please help reproduce it! It's not so easy to isolate.
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Jay Baby
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:36 pm

Quick question regarding textures: Is there a way to determine if a texture has been properly constructed? If improperly created textures do indeed cause a performance hit, being able to discern problem texture files would be most helpful.

Sorry for the semi-OT post, I'm just honestly curious.
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KRistina Karlsson
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 6:20 pm

It's hard sometimes to persuade people that the route to best performance requires you speed the slowest part of the bottleneck. For many, it's their on-board sound chip. Too many rigs these days don't have a proper sound card, but hive the work off to the CPU. I've demonstrated that a heavily modded Balmora can get an extra 5-10 fps if you put in a cheap, real, soundcard. No other change, just that.


Does that still apply if you are running dual or quad cores? Seeing as MW is only using one core does it force the same core to process the sound or is that handled by another core?

I've been doing some reviews on soundcards and see that not all of them do positional audio calculations in hardware, some offload them to the host system's CPU. Which is why I suppose the sound mods always killed me if I was using onboard sound :(

However if it was possible to send the sound processing to another core wouldn't that give us a performance gain?
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Stephy Beck
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 8:31 am

I wouldn't expect Morrowind to make use of multiple cores for sounds, too old.
That said, even if it did, there would still be overhead and bottlenecking on the processor buses and support infrastructure.
A quad core processor is not the same as a quad processor machine.
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Sasha Brown
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 12:29 pm

Quick question regarding textures: Is there a way to determine if a texture has been properly constructed? If improperly created textures do indeed cause a performance hit, being able to discern problem texture files would be most helpful.

You have to examine the models and textures together to be complete, since things like UV mapping, texel density and alpha settings do matter. If you just want to review textures try using a http://developer.nvidia.com/object/windows_texture_viewer.html. You can page through a folder with it, and check the mipmap count in the status bar. If it doesn't have mipmaps you should generate some. I wrote http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1035844-mip-mapping-explained/ about it a while ago.
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Ana
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 8:51 am

Precious little headway on those inventory issues here, but would anyone like to see toggle sneak included as a patch?
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Elizabeth Lysons
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 5:57 pm

toggle sneak included as a patch?

:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:
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Betsy Humpledink
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 6:25 pm

Precious little headway on those inventory issues here, but would anyone like to see toggle sneak included as a patch?

YES! :shocking:
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Austin England
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 1:55 pm

I wouldn't expect Morrowind to make use of multiple cores for sounds, too old.
That said, even if it did, there would still be overhead and bottlenecking on the processor buses and support infrastructure.
A quad core processor is not the same as a quad processor machine.



I'm going to have to disagree with this based purely on the near 2000% increase in bus speeds since morrowind was released, not to mention the significantly larger cache available to each core vs. what was on a standard p3 back then. Beyond that, onboard audio is vastly superior to what was available in 01-02, using less resources, and providing higher quality audio, HDaudio is the new standard, and almost all Mobo's cary an HDaudio processor that is nearly as capable as the aftermarket solutions, and normally have far fewer driver issues(I'm looking at you Creative Labs!!!!!!) Anyways, I have used both onboard and PCI-E boards with little to no difference in performance, I have trouble believing that you gained 5 fps in Balmora, though perhaps you had a better sound card with actually decent drivers.. :shrug:

P.S. remember when creative labs was the only sound option if you wanted good sound......:P

Edit: Sorry for going so far OT Hrnchamd
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Micah Judaeah
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 4:25 pm

Okay, beta 6 is out there. Toggle sneak, and the black outline around the mouse cursor should be gone.
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Laurenn Doylee
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 12:53 pm

Okay, beta 6 is out there. Toggle sneak, and the black outline around the mouse cursor should be gone.

Maybe I just downloaded it too quickly but the file currently up (it had 0 downloads) seems to be the same as beta 5.
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Lucie H
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 3:19 pm

:o :o :o :o
*faints*
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Robert Devlin
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 10:41 am

Well, that makes one of the mods I have unneeded now.
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Alex Blacke
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 10:57 am

About the soulgems not being filled... I can reproduce it myself, but I'm thinking that uploading a save probably wouldn't help in this case (if you want one though, just let me know). So... Not sure how much help this is :(

The soulgems are getting filled OK, it's just that the inventory display isn't updating to show it. Activating a container or similar makes the inventory update correctly. (And I did try soultrapping more creatures than I had gems - it didn't work.)

This doesn't happen when I hit the creature at all during combat, only when it's killed entirely with magic. Not sure that it matters, but IIRC I was using only touch spells. I definitely noticed this with summoned creatures, I think it was the same for normal creatures but I'm not completely sure now.

It's been a while since I've played, but I'm just getting a game together now so I'll check that again (and I'm looking forward to trying out your latest fixes too! :) ).
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des lynam
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:47 pm

I'd like to succesfully report that both the Sneak Toggle and Mouse Fix are working perfectly :)
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Marnesia Steele
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 3:51 pm

The soulgems are getting filled OK, it's just that the inventory display isn't updating to show it. Activating a container or similar makes the inventory update correctly. (And I did try soultrapping more creatures than I had gems - it didn't work.)

This is true for all the inventory bugs, actually.

This doesn't happen when I hit the creature at all during combat, only when it's killed entirely with magic. Not sure that it matters, but IIRC I was using only touch spells. I definitely noticed this with summoned creatures, I think it was the same for normal creatures but I'm not completely sure now.

That was very helpful, it only happens if you exclusively use touch spells. The data I was relying doesn't get updated when you do that, so I have to find another way.
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Carolyne Bolt
 
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Post » Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:25 pm

I redownloaded the file and now the new fixes are there. :)
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Adam Porter
 
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