Ritual Scarring : The Elder Scrolls Series Discussion

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 2:46 pm

It seems to be quite common, in morrowind, for dunmer to have some sort of ritual scarring--most commonly little decorative dots around their forehead. Is this practice ever mentioned or explained in any books? Some sort of temple thing?

Examples of NPCs who have them;

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Image:MW-npc-Nels_Llendo.jpg

http://www.uesp.net/w/images/MW-NPCs-Jiub.jpg

http://www.uesp.net/w/images/MW_NPC_Addut-Lamanu.jpg

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:25 am

I'm not sure if they got them from rituals but other races don't seem to have them.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 12:11 pm

What you see is what you get, I believe. (chock up another one for Morrowind's poorly executed visual creativity)

You don't hear anything about Nordic tattoos either.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 8:15 am

In the 2920 series, a girl called Turala was branded as she was Redoran and slept with a Hlaalu. It might be, but I don't remember if the branding was on her face. If it wasn't, it might just be men that are branded on the face, assuming that this is 1) to do with house competition or 2) deliberate and not because of some cliff racer.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 3:44 pm

Nels just has tattoos, Jiub's scars are obviously not ritual, more accidental, and Addut just has wrinkles.

Dunmer seem to have tattoos in abundance, along with Nords. Since they have a history of warfare, it seems one probably copied the other to match the intimidation. The question is who copied who?

I think if any race had "scarring" it would be orcs. Tattoos seem too artistic for them, but I could see them decorating their bodies with carved prayers to Malacath.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 9:08 am

Dagon had pretty swirls on him.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 4:34 am

Dagon had pretty swirls on him.

My brother calls him "four armed Darth Maul on steroids."

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 9:52 am

Dagon had pretty swirls on him.

Of course, since Dagon is a Daedric Prince, however he appears does not need to follow any logic mortals use, so that doesn't really mean much.

In any case, scars like the one over Jiub's eye are obviously just normal scares, as to the dots some Dunmer seem to have on their foreheads? I don't know, are they even scars? It's difficult to determine what they are due to the low quality of Morrowind's graphics, and I don't recall any similar features in other games (though in Oblivion's case, this is not saying much, since no race has any sort of unique facial feature, it's all just generic textures every character of a race uses.)

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 7:51 am

Some women have markings that are pretty clearly patterned on African ones.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 6:19 am

The scars look pretty normal, but the women do seem to have a lot of the dot patterns similar to many Earth tribes.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 4:45 am

They don't really look like scars to me. More like some sort of face paint - one would think it'd be very hard to make perfect little dots by scarification. Of course, it's hard to tell with such low-res graphics.

Juib definitely has a scar, but I doubt something like that is ritual, unless "getting something sharp swung across your face" is a ritual.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 10:58 am

They don't really look like scars to me. More like some sort of face paint. Of course, it's hard to tell with such low-res graphics.

Juib definitely has a scar, but I doubt something like that is ritual, unless "getting something sharp swung across your face" is a ritual.

Well, I didn't mean the rather obvious eye scar; he has the little dots over his eyebrows.

I had always just assumed it was a decorative scar thing, drawing from African and ancient south American cultures, but it could certainly be something else; if it is never explained, the low-res graphics aren't much to go by.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 7:47 am

I know it sounds a little odd, but somehow I just always considered those little bumps to be part of their skin. No particular reason.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 3:00 am

You don't hear anything about Nordic tattoos either.

I always assumed those weren't tattoos on the Nordsmen, but some sort of ritualistic woad or war paint.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 12:45 pm

I always assumed those weren't tattoos on the Nordsmen, but some sort of ritualistic woad or war paint.

In that case it's high maintenance and smelly.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:33 am

Would be a bit silly for Olaf the Tavern Dweller to be fixing himself up with battle-woad all the time when he never does any fighting of his own.

But then again, maybe he just takes his drinking really seriously.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 3:31 pm

Just because you don't see Olaf the Tavern Dweller do any fighting of his own doesn't mean he doesn't. Maybe he's really a warrior spending his time at a tavern until he goes back to the battlefield. Nords being Nords, that sounds like something they'd do.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 3:49 pm

Or maybe, you know, there were just not a whole lot of head models and they just didn't put too much thought into who got which face.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:55 am

Way to spoil the mood.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:37 am

Maybe they are natural... but don't count on it.
Perhaps some are ritual some are face paint and others are battle scars.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 2:26 pm

I suspect they are familial face-paint patterns (similar to the "dot" seen so often in India) or scarring. Familial; possibly related to ancestor worship.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:27 am

That "dot" is called a tilaka. It's usually put on the forehead, though, but Dunmer being Dunmer, I could see them putting it on other facial features.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 2:12 am

That "dot" is called a tilaka. It's usually put on the forehead, though, but Dunmer being Dunmer, I could see them putting it on other facial features.

It doesn't really look like any sort of dye or clay, like a tilaka would be in India. Does make a lot of sense though; a lot of dunmer culture/religion is clearly based off of hindu mythology and such.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:10 am

The dots on their foreheads could be bony protrusions, or maybe the pockmarked scars of some disease.

» Sat Jul 03, 2010 4:15 am

They are pretty obviously tribal tattoos... There is no real lore about them or what they mean - which means they were an addition driven by the artists and game designers not the lore writers (this is what separates a series like lord of the rings from other fantasy works, lore driven design). There is some data given to us about khajit using tattoos so it is definitely a practice that is widespread in Tamriel.

The idea that they are paint or are non-permanent seems unlikely to me given the fact that you choose it on your face in the beginning.