Do you see any long flowing dresses with complex physics in Xbox360 games? I sure don't. Not even in PC games.

I think Charger said it all.
(If you don't know, With Vampire he means the game Vampire:The Masquerade Bloodlines)
And of course, every JRPG, even if the hair and clothes don't move physically correct, they are believable and dynamic.

EDIT:
I don't demand physically correct movement, just an approximation to reality.
It looks much more believable if hair isn't stuck to the body, especially long hair.

You are fogeting Star Wars: The Force Unleashed,and many other games that came out on both xbox360 and PC...

And as a matter of fact Dead or Alive 2 had very good cloth physics and it's a Dreamcast game from 2000...

Sure add cloth physics and crash my PS3. The hair can surely be discussed in the other topic.. No?

As I've said in a previous thread the hair does bother me, but The heavy/light armor hasn't bothered me yet, I'm actually quite impressed by it. I believe the robe we saw in the gameplay trailer looked pretty awesome in my opinion. I really want that robe to enchant!

Your super powerful ps3 will crash with something a Dreamcast handles pretty well ?

But at the cost of performance, ie framerate.

That was the thought I'd had.... I'd be interested in seeing the hardware requirements for, say, a medieval crowd scene with a couple dozen townsfolk in long robes/tunics/dresses. (And it'd have to be with all the other features people keep wanting turned on, not just cloth draping. You know, a "real world" test rather than a tech demo.)

I Think the game will be complex enough, Its not like its gonna be a linear affair like assasins crud

Next gen? The "tech" is over a decade old. I seem to recall games using it as far back as the Dreamcast, maybe even before that. I don't think anyone disputes that consoles are holding back game evolution but is this really a good example of that? Maybe so, things like cloth and hair physics probably would be standard in most games by now if games were actually developed to take advantage of current technology.

I'm talking about this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daZoXzBGea0

Of course, just because there was bad cloth/hair "physics" years and years ago (like, say, a loincloth with a three-segment "bone" in it that can be animated to do /\/ when you run), doesn't mean that those old techniques would suffice for the current gen. People would probably whine really hard about it, actually.

I think hair in games is one of the more difficult things to get right these days. Meanwhile all other graphical aspects have improved.

I agree, the OP is pointing to the warrior screenshot and saying 'looky here his hair looks awefull and doesn't move'! It is a SCREENSHOT! Besides that I would love to shove a helmet on your head and see how much your hair flows from under it, especially when it is matted with sweat!

Besides all of this I find it kind of funny, folks this guy is a troll, he has made numerous threads stating the same thing, over and over again.. most likely he was one of the guys complaining about the water, now that the new screenshot is out he needs to find something else to nitpick over! Its almost as though these guys sit there with their magnifying glass looking for any fault that they can complain about ! Once that is disproven they have this overwhelming need to find something else!

Relax, sheesh, the game looks fantastic, and until you see that warrior running in motion it is a bit hard to judge.

I always thought Gameplay was far more important than graphics, but hey, I guess I'm in the minority...

Out of interest though, for you manic perfectionists out there: would you still buy the game (or continue playing it) if the hair and clothing didn't look and move in the way you wanted it to (even though the game was amazing)? hmmmm....

Nice straw man, but I'll go ahead and answer anyway. Of course. The fact that we are spending time complaining about hair is a pretty good indicator they got a lot of other things going in the right direction. That doesn't mean that bad looking hair doesn't actually look bad. It doesn't mean we should just "not care" about the fact that it looks bad. It also doesn't mean we shouldn't point out things that look bad just because everything else looks good.

I am pretty sure that footage was from an earlier build so it should look better in the final version.

Of course gameplay is more important.
But to immerse into a digital world the graphics are also important. And IMO much more important are the animations. If the trees are moving in the wind and the characters hair is stuck on his/her head it shows you that you're not really in this world, it feels not right.
But I agree with you, Bethesda should implement the gameplay features first, then the graphical ones.

The hair isn't bad, everything else is just too good.

Now that you put it that way Obstructionist, I can understand where you're coming from, attention to detail can be important for immersion. But I have to admit that the other 'detail fanatics' don't share the same voice of reason as you do judging by their verbose postings... because after all, it is only hair and clothing. I don't want to take anything away from other peoples complaints as everyones entitled to their opinion, but do you not think that the developers should be concentrating on gameplay and storyline more than anything else to make this game as playable as possible.

can you fix your biased poll... and who's to say they didn't "try" with this? you make it sound as if you think they are just being lazy or something, and thats big talk coming from someone who is too lazy to use spell check...

I wouldn't mind it. I would at LEAST want the feature of PhysX in game so modders could design proper hair and clothing.

Every person you see in game. Every time you look at your character. Every time you sneak up on a bandit in a cave. Every time you roll the Annoying Dragonborn Fan down the 7000 steps. What do you see? Their face, their hair, and their clothing.

It is only hair and clothing? That like 95% of every character you are going to see in the game. I could ask folks why spend all that time creating those great looking skin textures and well muscled physiques when it will be covered in armor all the time? Not like you are going to see it anyway? See where I am going with that? :happy:

Yes, everyone would agree that gameplay is obviously the most important thing. That said, if that is all that was important we'd still be using MW graphics or stick figures, and I know I certainly wouldn't want that.

Of the screens we've seen most of it looks great, but when things stand out that don't we should point them out. Imagine playing Crysis and all the weapons look like they are from Doom. I think I'd complain about that.

This game has a ton of other things going on, cloth, and hair physics are not gonna be great, (although, they look fine to me) it woulk take too much processing power, and current gen platforms aren't up to the demand,

I recently finished AC Brotherhood, where Ubisoft has added a bunch of features since the first Assassin's Creed, after AC,B I went and played the original, and the difference in graphics, and cloth physics, was definately noticable. The first game had a more "real" looking quality to it, and the pc's robes acted more realistic, even just the texture quality is better on the first game.. (on 360 anyway)

AC 2 and Brotherhood are both great looking games but at close inspection you can see the comprimises the devs had to make in order to implement more features, and on the whole, I think the series is better for it..

So I for one am not gonna complain at all about cloth and hair in Sky Rim, to me it looks fantastic on the whole, and with everything that it sounds likt it will do, color me impressed if it all works and runs smoothly on all platforms..

With this generation of hardware, we have to pick and choose what we want in games, They can look and act very realistic, with limited features, or the devs can make comprimises on certain things and add more gameplay features.. Especially with games of this scope, Beth makes Huge games, and have been getting better and better looking on the same hardware for at least 3 games now, there is something to be said for that

Fixed. :tongue: It would be pretty trivial for most PC's today.