I dont want to keep arguing with you, but thats the thing. Once you get past the hype and the fact that ME2 is no longer an RPG, your left with a run of the mill shooter like GOW. The same things in an RPG that bore the average shooter fan are the opposite things that bore me in a shooter as an average RPG fan, or perhaps not so average RPG fan.

Argh I type too slow. But on the brightside I rarely double post.



Yes Ill agree the term "RPG" has become kinda muddied. I would probably call most Bioware games "Limited" RPGs, but there are so many different kinds of RPG that theres no need to worry that there wont be any more classic RPGs. And honestly you cant call the gameplay mechanics of something like Morrowind "deep", if anything TES games and roleplaying amount to "Would my character take this quest?" and thats all there is. And yeh San Andreas does get pretty close to being an RPG, especially when its combat is about as deep as Morrowind(you can actually play a stealthy character, or a melee character, as opposed to just using a rocket launcher all the time).



I wasnt saying it has as much freedom of roleplay as a TES game or anything, but all those choices do is give you a general background. I would absolutely love to see even more choices but Id rather Bioware games have a half decent plot instead of the no progression like Oblivion has.



Yeh like I said before I agree about DA2. I was hoping DA and ME would be different franchises altogether, and it looked like thats what would happen when comparing DA:O to ME2, but then they went and sprayed a Dragon Age skin over another Mass Effect game. But Id still call ME and DA2 RPGs.

Well Ill risk a doublepost here. I can play and enjoy just about any kind of video game out there, so when they meld shooter into RPG or RPG into shooter I can hop right in.

Honestly I can enjoy Halo as much as I can enjoy Morrowind, and I did hit the 300 hour mark on a single Morrowind playthrough.

Skyrim will easily be the winner :celebration:

Unless Skryim turns into ArcaniA 4 (A.K.A Gothic 4) and completely ruin the series by making a very linear game and i mean VERY linear that you can finish in 3 hours and cannot explore previous areas..... that won't happen though its Beth and is not the first multi-platform game made by them

I would vote for Witcher 2... yea I know we will have to wait, see and play :wink_smile:

Its gonna be like Tyson vs. Ali. Personally I like both so when the time comes I will be buying both. I find it kinda hard to compare two RPGs from completely different genres. One is set in space in a futuristic time and the other is in more of a mid-eval era. One is a third person shooter and the other is a first person hack n' slash.Its gonna be a tough fight for both but i won't be bothered if one is above the other.

The main problem is that its more profitable to turn your RPG into an action/shooter than it is to keep it the same, or god forbid, make it even deeper. This is my number one fear about Skyrim. It used to be; put the time and effort into your game and you'll make money regardless of how long it takes(The Bethesda mentality), now its; lets find ways to appeal to more people, while finding every possible avenue to nickel and dime them (The EA/Bioware mentality). If Beth went the latter route, they would probably make even more money than they would if they kept it deep. Obviously they would ostracize everyone who liked TES for what it was, but it wont matter because they are making more money and we are now in the minority. If that happens, expect a thousand threads on who has a better ass, Dunmer or Imperials. That's not RPGs evolving, thats RPGs dying. If X RPG company wants to make an action game, then do it, but dont ruin our RPG franchises to do it.

Well I agree thats a bit of a touchy subject. Like taking what weve seen of Skyrims combat system, there are a lot of similarities to Fable games(I like Fable games, but Ill concede calling Fable 3 and RPG is a stretch). I mean, I dont think Bethesda should NOT use different game elements like that just because those other games arnt "RPGs" because that kind of combat system in a TES world looks totally awesome. It is far more actiony when comparing it to Morrowind, but I think theres a difference between genre advancement and genre changing.

And yeh Biowares a sellout, but Ill still play TOR because Im a KOTOR fan and I like MMOs. I dont really consider them Bioware games anymore myself, theyre EA games.

Mass Effect as much as I like it, isn't really that much of an RPG in my book. I like the lore and everything and gameplay is solid but RP wise not so much.

Skyrim wins.

Biased polls anyway in the Skyrim forums.

Competition is a good thing.

Check Witcher 2 vids (polish page, vids in English):
http://polygamia.pl/Polygamia/1,107165,9430237,Wiedzmin_2___10_minut_gry_na_filmach__I_nowe_obrazki.html?bo=1

Look mighty tasty.
Hopefully Skyrim will beat it.

mass effect has a different type of rpg. it's an RPG now that is focused on linearity and barely any customization at all. at least in the first one you could equip ammo types, gun ehancements, armor enhancements, change the armor of you and your party, allowed you to toggle your helmet on/off, let you drive a vehicle, and quite a few RPG elements.
mass effect 2 took basically ALL of the stuff that i listed that made the original mass effect more RPGlike. this 3rd one will take even more RPG elements out of the game.
the mass effect franchise was a decent RPG to begin with but now it is basically a 3rd person action shooter with customizable skills.
THE ELDER SCROLLS however has the most RPG elements i've ever seen! it has an OPEN world (bioware games = linearity), there are tons of weapons/armor to choose from (mass effect has like 4 gun types and about 3 in each), you can talk to every friendly NPC and have a chat with them (mass effect some NPCs just have the little "don't talk to me or some random bull [censored]"), you can ride a horse and maybe some more animals (mass effect took the vehicle out for the 2nd game), the story will hopefully be better than oblivion.
BASICALLY what i'm saying is that MASS EFFECT started out as a decent RPG franchise until it got rid of basically everything i like to do in RPGs. bioware also has a thing where their games are very linear. SKYRIM is a true RPG. you do what you want. you play how you want. whatever you choose however you will be a bad ass. in ES games you develop your character in ME games you basically play the same role every replay (with the exception of having a few different skills, but the same story).
I KNOW... i RANTED a lot! i just hate the route that BIOWARE has gone but loving the way BETHESDA is keeping their games how they've been and should be and should continue to stay!

i also will probably try TOR because i loved the KOTOR series and love MMOs! the fable series i wouldn't really consider an RPG but it has RPG elements.
fable and bioware basically are doing the same thing. they make an awesome original game with nice RPG elements then they cater it more to the masses and make barely any customization or freedom. fable/mass effect have become sellouts like you kind of said, they're there for consumer's money and it's TERRIBLE.

Please explain then what constitutes an rpg?

RPG = Role playing game

Features of a western RPG

- Character creation
- Level system
- Strong dynamic character interaction
- Strong story
- Freedom

Yes the leveling system in Mass Effect may be somewhat less than Skyrim, but it's still got character leveling.

Anyway both are great games, but I'd say Skyrim will win due to how scarce the series is so it's much more fresh than Mass Effect since this will be the 3rd Mass Effect game shown off since the last Elder Scrolls game was released.

need you even ask? anytime an elder scrolls game comes out it takes game of the year. and judging from what we have seen skyrim will be no different.

Oh yeah and what about Dragon Age? i loved the first one and its a great RPG, Mass Effect its more subtle in that aspect.

Want to know something? When i first got Mass Effect 2, I knew nothing about, I didn't even know it was an RPG. When I played it it felt exactly like every other shooter. Sad really that a guy who plays RPG's all the time can only tell that ME2 was an RPG by being told it was. The game feels NOTHING like an RPG.

I love Mass Effect, but TES is better. Bethesda and Bioware are both amazing.

On a different note, I want more KOTOR :sadvaultboy:

i beleive skyrim will win but mass effect 3 does have a fan base. TES just has a bigger one. They have hardly shown us a dang thing and Mass Effect will probably more of the same stuff. I'm sure there will be differences but since u play as the same person same time period and same place...sorta there will be less differences. Skyrim will be something totally new to everyone. We've never seen TES in skyrim since Arena with horrible graphics. now we will get a rendition of it that we can imagine realistically. i tihnk TES wins by sheer amazement factor that Mass Effect wont have.

DA2? Not even a RPG. It was a rushed sequel. If you're talking about Origins, then that's a good game, but it's older and couldn't win GOTY for 2011.

SIGN THE PETITION!

As a RPG, TES is far better, but for me they are about tied as my two favorite series. ME1 is an Action RPG, ME2 is a shooter with light RPG elements, ME3 looks to be a balance of the two, which seem just about right for the kind of game it is. I picked ME3 on here because I couldn't honestly choose which I want more and I knew ME3 would be the underdog.

No comparison. TES has no equal.

Not exactly a fair poll, considering the location. But Skyrim all the way!

Really? On a Skyrim forum?

Polls kinda biased, but it's a good conversation starter for WHY we all think Skyrim should win. I'm just a TES addict, and have never actually played Mass Effect (been too busy replaying Morrowind and Oblivion). :tes:

Doesn't matter.


The Witcher 2 will beat them both.

I'm really looking forwards to the Witcher 2. Bioware has only gone downhill since BG2. Dragon Age was okay, DA 2 svcks and don't even get me started on the Mass Effect series.

In fact, The Witcher was the only really good RPG that has come out recently. Oblivion svcked.

Deus Ex: Human Revolution takes the cake though. Deus Ex 1 was the best game ever created, and DX:HR looks to be quite good.