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But what is nothing if everything is nothing? As all might be more, or infinite without interaction, everything is as much of nothing as it needs to be, right?
Cryptospeak=0
I really don't find any better way to ask this question, seriously.

What about a super string theory application? Or even the phenomenon of particles of matter and antimatter spontaneously coming into existence in our universe, if only for a brief moment before annihilating each other? Cool program on the Science Channel about Steven Hawking's work regarding Black holes; when those particles appear, half gets svcked into the black hole, and the other half then doesn't get destroyed. CooOooool.

Anyway, the Super String Theory aspect would be that you're 'creating' by taking it from another dimension.

...

Wait, scratch that. What if creating matter is really difficult if not impossible because it requires creatia or something? The daedric princes can't create, so they take the Mundus' creatia. Maybe creatia supply is finite... or, like matter and energy, creatia and magicka can be interchangeable, but only under extreme circumstances?

They took from Aether, not Mundus. Creatia is magicka, so those extreme circumstances are always. The source of creatia/magicka is infinite. Its been as long as time has and longer, and that is already forever.

The problem is...they're not theories. They're hypothesis, because none of those hypothesis and ideas can be currently tested, they cannot become theories. It's a very bad mislabel, one I have regularly nailed my psych professor on, because she had the habit of calling a hypothesis a theory.


If the Monomyth is correct, the daedric princes found some creatia and used that to make their realms. And like I said, magic is just pure potential, and when used is converted into another form. However, out of all the spells learned, none of them actually turn air into gold. Transmutations are possible, as seen in the Mehrunes Razor DLC from being able to turn iron to silver and silver to gold. But if given the amount of power of a prince, I bet they could create a solid object out of magicka.

Alchemy! :shocking:

Well we have changed a few elements into gold. Cost more money than the gold created though.

Poppycock! The daedra can so create! Keyword: can. The aedra and the daedra are the exact same thing; they just behave differently and represent different things and the former are less powerful than the latter. daedra and aedra are both et'Ada. The daedra just CHOOSE to not create because they don't want to sacrifice parts of themselves. But they could if they truly wanted to.

So what exactly is "creatia"? And what is this "another form" you speak of that magic gets turned into when you use it?

Hmm, so like, since Vedaa was created by all 16 daedra (and 2 aedra), she has their potential powers. And thus, she could turn air into gold. Right Hellmouth? I mean, really, gold, air, water, earth, fire, it's all atoms held together by energy. Everything is energy. And magic is the potential to change that energy into some other type of energy. So really, if Vedaa was smart enough, she could rearrange the properties of the subatomic particles in the air and turn Nirn into a solid gold oblate spheroid.

And don't you think you could change the natural laws with magic? I mean, how did the et'Ada create the natural laws in the first place? ya know, the earthbones and what not. Wasn't that all magic? Isn't all this creating of the et'Ada, the mundus, it's laws, etc... all done by magic? I mean, aren't the gods/spirits made out of the same thing as magic? .....potential to cause change

Creatia=Magic.

Yes, Vedaa can transform air into gold. This is magic and possible.


However, the Earth Bones are the foundation of Mundus, the mythic fabric. You can't transform the realm into something it isn't, without completely destroying it.

What makes you think that?

Mundus wouldn't be Mundus if it wasn't, would it? It has been destroyed in times past, however. Something's different each time, so maybe I'm wrong. Semantics.

True, if Mundus was something different, it wouldn't be Mundus. If I were Jackfrost, I wouldn't be Tes96 anymore. When was it destroyed in the past?

Uncounted times. http://www.imperial-library.info/obscure_text/aldudagga.shtml, the World-Eater, eats the world, every so often.

http://www.imperial-library.info/fsg/fc4article01.shtml

This is my interpretation of what magic does in the ingame spellcraft. However, it can be applied to any use you can think of for magic, but it is not definitive or canon. In fact, it needs a little updating really, particularly in the conjuration and Necromancy sections.

Wow, you actually wrote that? How'd you get it published on the website?

By ancient forms of scholarship now long dead. The power-symbols for such things have been lost and the headmaster's memories have been erased by the toils of life. Only reformation, revolution or rebellion may bring it back, and none with the power to care. Except the duckies, but they're preoccupied with fighting off the penguins. :toughninja:

:turtle:

What the hell are you talking about?

I mean they used to accept articles, now they don't. :hubbahubba:

:turtle:

You mean the webmasters?

The headmasters, yes. Those librarian folk that run around every now and again. -_-

:turtle:

okay, In oblivion in conjuror ruins, has anybody noticed those stone tables and lots of food and candles about? And lots of daedra...
I think there is some sort of ritual preformed in order to activate this magic. Just take Necromany for example.

Durp. I feel stupid. I freaking said "Breathing water" in the post!

Anyways, the book Infernal City, being a descriptive mechanism, helps to understand what I mean by that even further (especially since the schools are merely artificial constructs with the dual purpose of instructing beginners in magic and maintaining a usable game engine) in that you first need to make mental contact with the realm of pure possibility, remove the logic of Mundus and replace it with a different logic, therefore changing or creating something where there was either something else or nothing at all even though doing so is impossible according to normal logic. For example, lifting things across a great distance without physically touching it is, according to normal logic, impossible. remove that logic and replace it with your own and the impossible has become possible.

And also, the reason that doesn't make for bad storytelling is because it is apparently very difficult to reject reality with not only your conscious superego mind but your ego and id as well and replace it with your own. Which is why not everyone just conjures fire instead of using mundane tools for it.

Not really. :nerd: Kinda like wormholes, you jump out of this dimension and re-enter where the box is. Then you lift it, without you yourself actually moving.

I find those (real world) theories hard to believe, it doesn't have more ground than any religion ever had, and I like imagining the universe as actually being there, not some weird, inter dimentional stuff. For me time is then, now and in between of space's relative movement remembered by people, not some weird time-space mechanic, it might be an explanation to some things, but that would be like math, I don't believe that stuff really exists, only offers a way to calculate things.
Sorry for slipping off, and this is an ansver is totally irrelevant to the thread.

Well, yes. Of course. Magic isn't all about muttering a few words under one's breath and releasing a spell from one's fingertips. Certain spells and summonings are extremely powerful and take many regents and the participation of more than one sorcerer. This type of magic isn't often represented in the games, but it does exist.

One good example is the way the Mythic Dawk opened the Oblivion Gates into the world, which is explained here:

http://www.imperial-library.info/obbooks/liminal_bridges.shtml