One inconsistency RPGs, including the TES series have is that a humanoid player can out run a bear, wolf or some other animal. I want certain enemies to be pretty much face, run hoping they loose interest before they catch you or die. The fastest a human that has been clocked ran 32mph, that would have been something to see, but my point is yea maybe out run things if your speed is 90+ and your athletics about the same otherwise be careful not to attract unwanted attention. This could be balanced with animals not necessarily instantly chasing you when they become aware of you. Perhaps only attacking if they are hungry, territorial or worried about young. Maybe add some type of climbing or something to help you get away. Also a bit more with sound could be done to "warn" the player that a mountain lion is nearby.

Second, I know the flying Pterosaurl(sp) creatures were not popular in Morrowind, but flying creatures, friendly and non friendly I would have liked to see them in Oblivion and hope to see them in TES V

I'd like quick enemies to be more easily able to catch you. I'd also like those eternal chases to be less likely; a wild animal isn't going to be on your heels three miles out of its territory, a bandit isn't going to follow you right to a guard station. I'd also like for armor and encumbrance to have a larger effect on speed and mobility. A lighter, stealthier character could get in and out of trouble more quickly, or dart around someone's sides and shank them because they can't twist about in heavy plate as easily.

I've got no problem with flying creatures, but I'd prefer for them to actually behave as such, instead of behaving exactly like a walking creature with levitation like Morrowind's cliff racers, or a walking creature with invisible legs, like Oblivion's imps. Some may be capable of hovering, but most would be quick and attack with swoops that they make large turns to recover from, instead of just planting themselves on your face. I want totally different creatures to be a different experiences to deal with, not the same experience with different models. They'd be harder to hit, but with good physics you could nail a wing with an arrow and watch it plummet and die on impact...also different from how normal land battles end.

The one important thing to balance though with realism is not making the game really slow.

This was one of the things I didn't like about Morrowind. If I wasn't a stealth character, I seemed to be running in slow motion in the early levels.

So, yes, a wolf should be able to catch up with you, but that doesn't mean the character should run in slow motion even if athletics or speed aren't their main skills.

Walk speed should not make me want to put a fist through the screen
Run speed should be fast, but degrade to a reasonable jogging speed over time.

No outrunning an athletic 4 legged creature.

Keep Oblivion's run speed. Or at least make the hero run faster than a walking human in a hurry (~4.5 mph).

Over the long haul, a character attempting to flee SHOULD get away. There's actually a scientific hypothesis that humans are nature's BEST long-distance runner because of our ability to shed heat, etc. (Indeed, there are tribes where chasing animals to death used to be the traditional method of hunting some animals)

Over the course of a SHORT chase, let the Mountain Lion kick my butt. But if I keep running, it should eventually fall behind and let me go. It's realistic (animals generally won't chase a person for the distances seen in Oblivion) and pragmatic gameplay (Chancing on a mountain lion at low-level shouldn't equal auto-death if it sees you), and there's a distinct explanation for why it's even realistic over distance that you would outrun it.

We need more critters, so I'd like flying ones. But they need to be NOT CLIFF RACERS.
Think of the birds in Borderlands. Only with more varieties. In more places, and not all wanting to eat my guts. In fact, birds in general should avoid coming near you. Also, please don't consider us "in combat" against a bird 500 feet up.

Also, make some of the animal's physical features count when they attack. Wolves should bite, not shake their heads back and forth and cause damage somehow. A large flying enemy should be able to knock a PC down upon swooping for him out of sheer force of wingbeat, assuming that there would be large flying enemies. I'm thinking about the size of the Nazgul's flying mounts from LOTR. Perhaps massive bats in the cave's of Skyrim's mountains?

You've just desribed Morrowind. It had a perfect running speed.

Regardless of what people say, it isn't stupidly slow. The only reason I could run slow in Morrowind is beause of carrying too much for my strength. Strap a 50kg weight to your back. I guarantee you will run slower. I could outrun wolves at about 90 speed and 40 Athletics on my Scout. People who complain about Morrowind's running speed tend to not have played Morrowind throughouly. Look at This random video from youtube. The guy is a level 1 Imperial with no speed bonuses. What is wrong with that? I mean, that speed will be vastly improved over the game. Also, I highly doubt that Mounts won't be in TESV. Mounts are supposed to have a purpose. I should never be able to outrun one without 100 speed and Athletics. If you want to go fast USE A HORSE. Common sense.

There is nothing wrong at all with Cliff Racers. They should be back. The problems in Morrowind are easily fixable, and are oversights by the devs. Cliff Racers simply need less spawns and a faster descend rate.


I vote tougher to outrun, and a mixture of flying creatures.

No, I'm pretty sure that when I said it was slow, I really meant "I tow an actual ton of stuff around work faster than my Redguard can run".



Nah, Morrowind was slow in the first ten minutes, too. I remember really leaving the first town and thinking "This takes for-freaking ever, doesn't it?"



Is completing several factions, the Main Quest, and Bloodmoon complete enough for you?



Try it with a Redguard. Slow.



I just would like running to feel like when I actually run. Not when I walk large loads around at work.



Let's see... Cliff Racers vs. Something new and different? I'll take the latter. A flying creature that looks like a dinosaur, or something that doesn't? Latter. The fact of the matter is that Cliff Racers have been done. The implementation svcked, and we don't need to have another four to eight years of people complaining that "Cliff Racers were better in Morrowind because they didn't have these new-fangled behaviors". Retire them and create something new and unique to Skyrim.

Well, you definitely should be able to outrun some creatures, some creatures should outrun you, some might follow you blindly and almost forever, some may tire after a while. More diversity is important. Also you should see the effects your speed has as well as athletics, encumberence and wight of the armour/clothing you have on. I would also like to see something similar to a rush as it was made in Dark Messiah. You can sprint very fast for a short time, but you loose a lot of stamina (fatigue) by this. Adn if we get mounts, hopefully they will be faster then humans. I hated the fact that in Oblivion I walked faster than a horse

Predatory generally animals don't launch their attacks from 1 kilometer away. Any attack from a mountain lion(or any aggressive animal) will be launced from short range, and not something one will easily outrun.
I should be able to outrun bandits. A charging beast on four legs, not so much(unless I'm magically boosted)
Instead of turning player characters into a lightning bolt, I'd rather see the ability to climb trees, proper animal AI(most animals won't attack a human unless they're starved, threatened or rabid) and fun combat/evasive tactics.
And flying things would be neat. Even a relative of the blasted cliffracer would be welcome.

As of movement speed.. Morrowind was a bit on the slow side. You'd have to boost your speed and athletics quite a bit to get moving. Oblivion was over the top. Something in between. Higher speed at lower levels, lower speed at higher. Modified by load. Perhaps with fatigue(and I think running should put a drain on fatigue) as the equalizer?

I shouldn't be able to out-run deer and other fast critters.

A mix of aggressive and non-aggressive creatures in the air - as well as on land. Ideally, aggressive creatures =/= suicidally belligerent.

I'd much rather see a mix of faster and slower animals, with very few of them attacking "on sight". Many should have a "chance" of attacking on sight, but if you keep approaching after you're spotted, you'll eventually trigger an attack (making them more territorial). Others should go into some sort of "stalk" mode, where they begin to move indirectly toward the character, or try to slip around behind you un-noticed, then "pounce" from a short range (acting as predators). Still others should be relatively passive, unless provoked. A final group could be totally passive (prey).

Running speed for the character should be fairly decent (not as heavily affected by encumbrance as in MW), but fatigue should limit how long you can maintain that pace, and that SHOULD be encumbrance dependent. In most cases, creatures should have their own fatigue kick in and stop them from chasing you beyond a certain distance, generally a shorter distance than the player character can maintain, depending on the creature. Fatigue should NEVER regenerate while running, like it did in OB. Even walking should generate a tiny amount of fatigue, but your natural regeneration of fatigue should more than compensate for it, so you'd regain fatigue slightly faster by stopping than by walking.

Carried weight should cause you to lose fatigue by wallking, but typically at a slower rate than you regenerate it. If you carry less weight, you should regenerate fatigue more quickly while walking. At maximum encumbrance, you'd break even. If you carried slightly more than that, you'd occasionally have to stop to rest. Beyond a certain point (double your limit), you just couldn't move with all that weight. The current system has you walk normally up to a certain limit, and then adding one extra unit of weight to your pack leaves you rooted to the spot, with fatigue not even related to the amount of weight carried.

Cliffracers were a good idea, but we all know about "too much of a good thing", and Bethesda used WAY too many of them. At least with Morrowind Crafting, they're good for something, and with Connary's retexture, they're almost likeable.....but not quite.

I thought the run speed in Morrowind was fine. What would be better, in my humble opinion, is to have fatigue make a more dramatic difference. When your fatigue is full, you sprint, Oblivion speed or a tad slower. When your fatigue is out, you jog, Morrowind speed.
You should not be able to sprint for more than a few minutes. I liked Morrowind because that aspect was more realistic.

I agree. When you need to REALLY run and have the endurance for it, you should be able to full out sprint for short periods of time. However, I think a lot of the normal walking/running speed should depend on just how large the game world is. I mean, if we are talking JC2 size world slow walking/running speeds might drive you crazy just trying to go a short distance let alone across the map. If the world is more on the Oblivion size then slower speeds should not be a problem.

there are lots of games now that use more realistic running speed and couple it with sprinting. your not running faster than a car but you can sprint for short distances for those quick getaways. i think most animals should easily be able to outrun you. i think this does two things for gameplay. first it stops the i can from one location to another faster than the USS enterprise at warp speed effect, which is annoying to say the least. secondly, it would make mounts actually useful for long trips. i was really excited the first time i got shadowmare, but then realized that i ran just as fast as the horse and i was training athletics and also it got annoying having to get off and on the horse to fight all the time. i eventually just put here somewhere and every playthrough ive done since then i just stick her at one of the stables of just leave her at the fort i found her at.

as for how wildlife attacks about the only thing ive seen in oblivion that would attack you on site no matter what might be a bear. mountain lions are stalkers and would rather pounce on you from behind, if you armed and have a weapon and you wave it around more than likely they should leave you alone.

i actually liked cliffracers........just didnt like the number. i think if you have a few aggressive species that attack once in a while would be kind of nice and add a little scare factor here and there.

Yes, there is nothing wrong with Morrowind. It is perfect while Oblivion is horrible. Everyone who says anything is wrong with Morrowind is a liar. :rolleyes:

I don't remember reading anything in the official RPG rulebook about RPGs needing to be boring and "realistic", yet that's what some people seem to think makes up a great game(notice the G part of RPG?).

I think the running-walking-speed system needs overhauled. Speed as an attribute should be dropped. Characters should not vary that much in speed over the course of their lives. Most npcs and player characters should generally run about as fast as each other. Things like endurance would determine how far you can run, and things like agility would determine how fast. There should be a maxiumum speed for the races, and speed can only be temporarily increased by using spells or potions that do so. The races should be one of the slower creatures. They'd be able to outrun ogres and minotaurs, but not bears or trolls, for example.

I like a lot of ideas here especially those about creatures behavior differing from a charging bear to a stalking cat now that would freak the bleep out of me if suddenly a mountain lion attacked from behind their freaky snarl growl blaring in my rear speakers. Like the sprint ideas since I always, well 99%, have run toggled on my game. Have a short sprint mode that really moves you and otherwise a fast or regular walk. Otherwise mounts get you around quickly. And Beth could be the first to bring flying creatures that strike on a swoop instead of the fly overhead lower to player level and attack that has been the standard. Just make it so the can be knocked out of the air or wing away frightened, now that would be something fun to do with physics. Watch a cliff racer arch down to the grown as a raging fireball after encountering the fire ball you just tossed at it.

Sure, it might be realistic, but realism has to be balanced with fun. Running around Morrowind as a Nord Knight was not fun.

Besides, in Morrowind "running" seemed more like jogging, at least for combat types. This is why I almost always chose the Steed, otherwise I'd be slightly faster than a mudcrab.

Now, despite all that, Morrowind is still one of my favorite games of all time. But that doesn't mean everything in it was perfect.

There's should definitely be animals that are faster, and animals that are slower, than the player.

I remember my first morrowind character, walking through the woods, trying to find the run button, only to go into third person and discover that I was already running.

Ah, but it was in the beginning and I was untrained..<-- not an excuse, let's leave aside the fact that anyone with zero training would still be able to run faster than what was shown in morrowind. I'm opposed to the view that we are somehow weak when we start out. We go to a great deal of trouble to pick our character class, and stats, this means that when we get out, we are what would be normal for our class, not some weakling.

I like some of the suggestions in here, the run speed needs to get up, and we need a sprint function. This could give more purpose to speed and athletics, because they could increase the sprint distance as well as normal speed.

Yep, I agree. You could evade the creature though.

Part of the problem with runspeed is that they increase it on a 1-100 scale with the attribute, but they really need a higher low and a lower high speed.

This sounds pretty reasonable

Bring back reflexes from Daggerfall. That should make everyone happy. If Morrowind was reflexes at normal position. I would like to increase it one level.

Oh god no agressive flying creatures, I don't want cliff racers all over again.