Unfound Guns is now up on the nexus!

I have updated my original post. Everything should work, I have only done a minimal amount of testing. I've also added the Extreme version, so that you can see the wasteland more how I envisioned it. bliviongate:

Please feel free to download and enjoy! :tops:

I've been playing with the FewerGunWieldingManiacs script and the overall Savage Wasteland configuration menu. My original concept was to add a book called Savage Wasteland to the PC inventory. Reading the book would pull up a menu where I would give the options for Low, Med, High and Extreme. I'm not sure that this is the way the final product will look, I may have to rethink the Low, Med, High and Extreme settings. For example, the Unfound Loot script and subsequent menu could allow for each point of Luck to add 1% to your chances of finding an item (currently the High setting) or 10% per point (currently the Low setting), or any whole number in between. (2%, 7%, 6%, ect.) Currently I have Unfound Loot split into item categories, Meds, Ammo, Food?, but the Menu could drill that down to individual items. So you could have; a Luck of 5 gives you a 5% chance to find Buffout, a 10% chance to find a Stimpak and a 25% chance to find Rad-Away.

For UnfoundGuns it gets more interesting. By default the Hunting Rifle behind Springvale School is at 8%, I would like to factor in Small Gun skill, Repair Skill and random Luck into what the weapons' Health would be, if you're lucky enough to find it. I could build the menu to give the player control over how each stat would figure into it, you could have Game Design and Small Gun Skill be "contributing factors", Repair Skill as a "major factor" and Luck "not a factor". Again this could be setup differently for each specific type of weapon.

For FewerGunWieldingManiacs I've a script that allows me to dial in the exact ratios I want for a given spawn point, (25%Unarmed, 25% Schematic Melee, 25%Melee, 20% Schematic Gun, 5% Small Gun) but with a few creative variables I could put the weapon class in the menu (Unarmed, Schematic Melee, Melee, Schematic Gun, Small Gun) and let the player decide the percentages. This functionality comes at a price however; it almost works with MMM Increased Spawns. It works, just not how I would like. I also need to keep it working with the respawn scripts, both vanilla and custom. I may have to create my own script to emulate Increased Spawns, which could make it another option in the configuration menu. I could also try making my own custom respawn script, but for compatibility reasons I may wait until I can dig into the FWE 5.0 respawn script.

On that note, I've really taken a liking to FWE and plan to make a FWE plug in. For example; I'd like for the UnfoundGuns to spawn some of the worn weapons and some of the new weapons, probably dependant on player level. I would also have to set the spawn lists back more to vanilla as Worn Weapons tweaks them.

I would like to have Karma be a factor in Unfound Loot, but would like some input on implementation. I was thinking that Good Karma can increase the amount of Meds and Ammo found in the game world and Bad Karma could increase Guns and Explosives. I'm not really sure about this though, if anyone has any other ideas/opinions/issues with this or any of the current or planned functionality as I have stated it feel free to let me know.

Unfound guns is really really good work, well done!

I'm really looking forward to your next iteration of fewer gun wielding maniacs. Is it going to be customizable on a faction by faction basis? Because I'd really expect some factions to almost always have guns.

Thanks!!

That is my intent, I'm still playing with how it should be implemented, I'm leaning towards having the configuration menu allow a drill down to each class within the faction. Raiders, for example come in Melee, Gun, Rifle, and Special. By allowing configuration at the class level the player can alter the spawn ratios of Melee, Gun and Special, but leave Rifle alone, because it would be silly to have a raider in a crows nest armed with pool cue.

Here is my Good News/Bad News scenario.
Good News: I am almost done with all my scripting and grunt work and I've started work on the menu system that controls both Fewer Gun Wielding Maniacs and Unfound Loot.

Bad News: I inadvertently left a single line out of one of my scripts and while I immediately knew what went wrong and was able to fix it, it revealed that I had a much bigger problem.

I have made a script that generates a number between one and five and then creates that number of spawns; it's not quite as elegant as increased spawns, but it works. (And it's configurable) In one of my test sessions, I left out the line that tells the script to run only once and ended up with continuous spawn points. Remember that scene in the second Matrix when the all the Agent Smiths came pouring out of the buildings? It was a lot like that, except all the "agents" were naked. Apparently, this http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=1068957 had always been there and I didn't ever notice until they were everywhere.

I have a few possible solutions, neither one of which is very desirable. The first involves replacing every spawn point in the game with an elaborate setup of Xmarkers and trigger points. This would be an extremely time consuming process and would require me to spend large portions of my salary on energy drinks, therapists and divorce lawyers. The second option is to create a very very small NPC that spawns, dies and disappears in the shortest possible time. While this would be the "quick and easy" fix, it strikes me as a little too Rube Goldberg to actually want to put my name on and release.

There is one more possible workaround. I could make all NPCs in the game, by default, Melee fighters. Then only allow customability for the increased spawns. This means that the highest possibility for NPCs with guns would be 80%, but you'd have to have that faction set at the equivelant of increased increased spawns. This also means that you would never be able to set any faction back to its' vanilla setting, this was a feature that I was really wanting to add.

So unless I can figure something else out I'll be stuck with one of these options. My mind is not made up one way or another.

After weeks of trial and error, I have come up with an answer: I am an idiot! :banghead:

The question, of course, is: Why didn't I figure this out sooner?

It seems I had over-engineered my Fewer Gun Wielding Maniacs scripts into an unworkable monster, while the simple solution has been staring at me from the To-Do section of my notebook. I ran some preliminary tests and found no problems, I'll do a full scale bench test this weekend and if nothing unexpected pops up I'll schedule a release for as soon as I'm done scripting the menu.

I had created new NPC types for the different factions; Unarmed Raiders, Schematic Raiders, Small Gun Enclave? and I had been trying to make variable spawn points that utilized my custom script for dictating what type spawned at each point. Instead I will add my weapon class leveled lists to all NPCs and control them with the Chance None Globals. Compatibility may be a minor issue, but easily fixed by either load order or patch.

How it should work:
Every Raider in the game will have, in their inventory leveled list, a leveled list for Unarmed, Melee, Small Gun, Big Gun, Energy and Schematic weapons. By default the Gun Raider will have the Chance None set to 100 for all but Small Gun which will be 0. If I set Melee and Small Gun both to 50 it won't work out to be a 50% chance of the raider spawning with a Gun and 50% with a Melee Weapon, it will be 25% with a Gun, 25% with a Melee Weapon, 25% with both and 25% with none.

This method inherently addresses the issue of setting the total of the percentages less than or greater than 100%, and I'll still have my presets for Vanilla, Low, Med, High and Extreme; but I'll add in a Custom for those who want to tinker. It will also be easy to port to the DLC.

Hey Steve,
Been using Fewer Gun Wielding Maniacs for ages and wouldnt play without it.
One thought though... It seems every raider and his brother (as well as their super Mutie cousins) has a grenade or two.
Where the heck are they getting all these from?

Any way to reduce the numbers of grenades too?

It seems that Bethesda was reluctant to take away all forms of ranged combat from Raiders. All Melee Raiders have a chance to spawn with grenades, and in the first Savage Wasteland I didn't touch the Leveled Lists for Inventory, so all those Melee Raiders are getting grenades. In the next version I plan on tweaking the Chance None for all weapon types for each NPC type. Just to give you an idea I'm planning to make a custom setting something like this:

Raider:
None X%
Unarmed X%
Schematic Melee X%
Melee X%
Schematic Gun X%
Small Gun X%
Big Gun X%
Energy Weapon X%
Explosives X%

And then let you the player set each X as a number from 0-100.

There is still a lot of grunt work to be done and the menu is a monster but when it's ready I think it will be a big improvment over the old method.

Awesome!
Sounds like a major improvement indeed!
Whats the difference between none and unarmed though?

OOPS!! Brain-Fart!

The None option is not an actual option. I just copied and pasted that out of some of my notes. Unarmed is knuckle weapons, none is completley bare fisted. If all catagories are set to 0% then all raiders would be set to None, but even if you put numbers in all of them as long as they are each less than 100% then there will be a chance fot a Radier to spawn with absolutley no weapons. If you want you could also use this mod to increase the amount of guns found on NPCs, you could give the entire wasteland energy weapons if you really wanted. This approach was inspired in part by El Di4blos comment about giving the Enclave assault rifles. In playtest I thought I had screwed something up because I kept getting raiders in the superduper attacking me with laser pistols, it took me a while to figure out they were grabbing them off the counter, because they were completly unarmed otherwise.

An easier way to go about this when dealing with specific items already placed in the world would be to check "initially disabled" on the references and have the dummy enable them, rather than spawn them.

Thanks for the tip Rhoark.

I was playing with this but maybe I'm not smart enough to see what you're seeing. It seems I'd have to initially disable each and every instance of an item in the game, which would be similar to my current methid of going cell by cell by cell by cell to "Find and Replace" everything in it.

Hey Steve, quick question.
It ocurred to me that in absence of guns/ammo future wastelanders would most likely gravitate back to more simple and easily produced ranged weapons for hunting/defense. Namely bows, crossbows and throwable spears.
There isnt much if anything like this currently in the game, but assuming that some can be modded up, would it be easily possible using your new system to get these included onto the weapons lists for raiders and wastelanders?

The reason I ask is that I think your savage wasteland is a huge move towards post-apocalyptic plausibility, but it does give the man with the gun (aka. the player) a huge advantage.
Having raiders with crossbows and javelins would both increase the realism and the challenge.

DING DING DING!!! Give that man a turtle!
:turtle:

I actually had that in the back of my mind while working on this. Right now, I have some generic leveled lists for each weapon type, schematic or otherwise, that I've just been attaching to each NPC. I had been considering creating a different list for each faction but this seems to work okay. I have also made a test patch to add the weapons from the Junk Weapons mod to the schematic melee weapons list. It's very cool having the raiders attack with home made spears and knives, it was also a bit of a defining moment when a super mutant came at me with a junk sledge hammer. I would love to see more schematic weapons in the game, bows and/crossbows that shoot pencils/forks/butter knives would be most welcome in a savage wasteland.
I'd also like be able to CRAFT some of the WMK kits, a scope made from a lead pipe and camera lenses and a silencer made from tin cans would look perfect on a hunting rifle, or even a pipe rifle! After going through all that trouble to gather up a handful of rounds, why not make'em count by using a modified firearm. I'm not sure how you go about CRAFTing an extended magazine or auto-fire kit, but when used with Savage Wasteland the extended mag is more like a sick joke and the very thought of auto-fire is downright horrific.

:sadvaultboy:
I wish I knew more about modeling and texturing. Or at least had one of those day-planners that gve you 26 hours each day instead of that stingy 24.

hey stevedog, been running your unfound loot mod, with only the unfound meds esp for a good while now

but anyhoo I have found a bug I think? after playing a while Im finding meds with the UL abreviation like ULmentants, ULpsycho, ect,ect,

its all good untill I try to pick them up then CTD everytime

I have checked for conflicts with the FO3edit, and found none? but you guys know more than I, so just thought I would chim in and let you know about it

the mod works great, just leaves behind the phantom UL meds sometimes, so hope I didnt mess your thread up, just didnt see any other place to post, to let you know

Good to know. UL is the prefix on all my unfound dummy items, they are supposed to delete themselves when you enter the cell. I never had this happen, it was actually one of my fears and I did a lot of testing specifically to look for that. When you reload are they still there? Is it something that you could recreate? Do you have another mod that removes hand placed items? I think I remember reading in another post that you were also using the XFO meds rarity mod. It's possibly that, because we each edited the exact same space in many cells, me replacing items and Xodarap deleting them.

If you find anymore bug, this is the perfect place to report them, thanks.

Yay! turtles
Good to hear that you have this in mind.
Personally though, though the schematic weapons are interesting and good for a laugh, I would prefer to see the type of thing that I could actually imagine post apocalyptic survivers making.
Instead of shooting butterkinves and forks from crossbows, I imagine they would hammer them into wicked points for their bolts. I would expect to see things like maces made from bikesprockets mounted on shovel handles, spears made of butcher knives attached to long poles, big clumsy but powerful crossbows made from springsteel car suspensions, axes made with circular saw blades, etc.
Crude, very brutal but effective stuff like you could imagine folk good with their hands (and at least partially psychotic) would make from the stuff around them in order to hunt, protect themselves and butcher their neighbors.

hey steve, no I uninstalled XFO meds, I reloaded the save before-- I found--tryed to pick up--and CTD, and It did happen again, I have been out all day today, but might get in some playtime in the next day or so and will keep my eyes open for more phantoms really the only mod I have that does anything to placed items is Arwens less is more but if Im not mistaken it only gets some food but I could be wrong

@gurachn
Yes, I definatley see your point and I would love to have some of those things in my game. If there are modders out ther willing to creates such things, I'm ready and willing to make the few adjustments to Savage Wasteland. After all, the types of weapons you describe would make the wasteland truley savage.

@kingsheart
I'll check out Arwens mods, I've looked at them but done no real testing with them. Thanks again for the heads up.

O.k. Stevedog, have done some more testing, and so far the only location I can find the -UL prefix bug- is at the raider fort down the river from Dukov's place

you might want to check that out

Still don't understand why it would be just in this location, but if I run into any others I will let you know

By the way. hows it going with the next update will it include food?

sorry don't mean to be a nag, just curious, take your time, no hurry Steve

Thanks for that info, I don't think I did any play testing in that cell. I usualy just snipe those guys from the bridge for safe passage to Rivet City and then ignore thier little "camp". I'll focus there and see if there is anything funny going on there.

I've done quite a bit of work on the next version of Unfound Loot, Ive added all explosives about 90% of all melee weapons and about 25% of all food and drink. I am also working on a config menu. I've been playing with FWE V5 and I should be able to get the container loot to work with and with out FWE running.

O.k., try under the bridge across from the citadel, just found some -UL's- there too

Fewer Gun Wielding Maniacs
This is an update of the original concept. At first I had setup the weapon rarity by NPC faction how I saw fit, this time around I want to give you the decision over how much firepower each faction gets. I will setup some preset levels and allow you to pick and choose a level for each faction. The levels I am planning are these:
None - Vanilla, need I say more?
Low - 1 out of 3 chance of spawning with out a gun
Medium - 1 out of 3 chance of spawning with a gun, small chance of having a schematic weapon
High - 1 out of 10 chance of spawning with a gun, good chance of having schematic weapons
Extreme - Very low chance of spawning with a gun, good chance of having schematic weapons, most guns will be schematics

Stevedog - this isn't in the current version of the weapons - correct? I actually disabled the current weapon one b/c I didn't like meeting so many Outcasts and other high-tech people with rippers. I'm very excited for this idea though!

Crossbows, especially scoped ones, could be deadly if combined with sneak - there should be no way to tell who is shooting you until visual contact is confirmed - since they would make very little noise overall. Would there be a way to add a toxin/poison to some of the bolts?

I am in a new game - so I will keep my eyes peeled for UL labeled items and report if any are found.

As I noted in the other thread, your loot mod is excellent.

The update for Fewer Gun Wielding Maniacs is still in production. Right now I have it setup for Raiders and SuperMutants, but I have yet to put together the config menu to switch settings and customize. I'll be getting the update of Unfound Loot first and the updated Fewer Gun Wielding Maniacs will follow some time after that. I suppose I could throw together a few stand alone esps for Fewer Gun Wielding Maniacs for the low med high and xtreme already set up. I could also, as the ratios are controlled by global variables, release a beta/test version with all the major factions set up and include the list of the global names, that way you could use the console to set them until I get the menu figured out.

The message menu system works but is a little clumsy and has definate limitations. I've been spending my free time reading everything DarN has ever written in hopes that I can someday create an XML menu to control Savage Wasteland. It would be so much easier to have a list or drop down box of every faction on the left of the screen and a list of each weapon class on the right:

[Raider]				 Unarmed %	 <25>Slaver				   Melee %	   <50>Outcast				  Small Guns%   <15>BOS					  Schematic%	<20>Enclave				  Big Gun%	  <00>Super Mutant			 Energy Weap%  <00>

and then let you hit the arrows on either side of the number to set it how you want it. But that will be a ways off as my previous attempts at Bethesdas XML have resulted in some pretty epic failures.

I did some testing and I am seeing the UL[Med] ghost items. I didn't find a cause but I'll be digging into it this weekend. If anyone else is experiencing this please let me know which cells its happening in, if you don't have this problem in one of the known cell please let me know that at well.