Thank your for a great comparision! If you all won't mind, I'd like to ask for some opinions on another mod.

I had taken a break from Oblivion for about 1.5 years and just recently started playing again. Back then I remember OOO's being in "development", so to speak, and I hadn't even heard of some of the other mentioned mods. Back then I used Sagerbliv's Balance Mod and G_s Loot mod. I see that they are not listed. Is it that they are no longer supported? Or that they are/were inferior to the currently mentioned mods? My old game still runs them, and I am wondering if I should try one of these mods. From what I remember about Sage's and G_s, I think Frans would be the most similar. I liked the unscaled aspect of G_s loot mod. I used Sage's as I didn't like the idea of bandits in glass which all the newer mods seem to correct.

Thanks for reading.

Hm. There are two reasons why they aren't listed:
- I forgotten them.
- it's not that they are not supported (finished mods don't need support), it's that they are limited in scope. Mechanic wise when combined they're very similar to Fran's, but with less features. I don't know if they're still used today - they were great at their time (which is nearly two years ago), but today I don't know if they even interest people anymore.


(Note for myself, link: http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=OblivionMods.Detail&id=501, including sagerbliv's mod)

in general, what do u think is the most realistic overhaul?

That's hard to say. And quite easy.

Hard: People have different preferences when it comes to overhauls. Some will say that Fran's is the most realistic overhaul. Others will say TIE is the most realistic overhaul. And because there's no absolute true, all are right. There's no best or most realistic, in the end it all comes down to how you want Oblivion to be. What creates a realistic experience for you .

Easy: For me (which is a personal thing) place centric overhauls are much more immersive and realistic than player centric overhauls. Now there are only two place centric overhauls: OOO and FCOM - I love both. I think from both OOO is more realistic, while FCOM offers the greater game experience - and is _not_ a beginner friendly project!

Wow. What an amazing guide, thanks bg!! Really, really helpful, it needs to be bloody stickied. I nearly missed it!!

I am half worrying about getting FCOM though. Mainly because it changes sooooo much, making most other mods unusable. I might OMOD it all, and run it seperately, so I effectively have a new game.

What kind of things are edited (much) by FCOM? What textures etc are? Are new races usable (I assume so)? What about things like alternate beginnings (the ship)? And the official mods?

I agree, and somewhat disagree.
Place centric is more realistic when done good. IMO, I think it is unrealistic that a threat like Amazons have a lair right on the Imperial City isle. Or that a threat like those elven dudes is a couple minute march away from anvil. I guess the local guards would keep the area around town at least somewhat in check. But who cares. They are now safe thanks to me.

It's much http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Tes4Mod:FCOM than those which are. "making most other mods unusable" is a gross overstatement - I have yet to find a mod I'd want to use but couldn't because of FCOM. All things you mention are compatible.

Check OOO's readme, MMM's readme, WarCry's readme, Fran's readme etc. for what they edit/do - it would take too long to list it.

EDIT: Started this in two threads. To keep this on topic (comparing the biggies), I'll keep to the other one. Please don't reply.

I stand corrected! And that's good!

Thanks. Ignore what I posted in the OOO thread haha.

So what are the main things FCOM changes? What land masses? NPCs?

I've read the FCOM online readme btw, I'll read the others once I have them.

nice thread, grat.

i've been playing oblivion since the realese. i've played all the overhaul mod (except TIE), i made at least a level 10 char with all of them (except FCOM).

(these quick "opinions" are really quick, i don't mean them as a desrispect)

warcry: like a diablo hack'n'slash.
martigen: for my taste it gives waaay too much kind and number of monsters.
OOO: i liked it, but i succumbed (from a dictionary, hehe) under the tons of loot i obtained (seems like a stupid excuse, but somehow i hate that. see francesco). the other thing i didn't like is that i had to turn back at the half of every dungeon because of the large number of spectral warriors. i simply hated the mystical imps.
FCOM: ok, it's probably my fault, but i haven't managed to play normally because of lots of "technical" issues.
Francesco: so far this seems to me the best mod (for my taste). i set the loot extra hardcoe (and ingame in the franmenu i went further), so i have the feeling that i really have to explore the world for a fine weapon or armor, and i don't trip over stuffs in every corner in a long ago looted dungeon. the additional monsters are moderate. exploring a dungeon is a challange but not impossible (even at low level). I think fran is good for a casual gamer like me.

although TIE is very notable. i've never had serious problems with vanilla oblivion, except the level scaling system. soooo "vanilla oblivion can be fun" )) i meditate to give a try.

only one choice lol All of them! Fcom ... I know I'm a dumb @$$ , but seriously , the optional things like reduced spawn or Random , you can virtually make fcom into want you want

???

when I was a Kid, there was only "mood music" on the am radio, Spikes Jones was on and the "Anderson typewriter song"
was the hit song, B. E. [Before Elvis!]

I will be 67 in June!

I was a computer operator in the US air force, a 1401 IBM computer, maybe your cell phone is now more powerful than this one was, needed an entire huge room of its own!

I have played some of the Arena game, the first daggerfall series game.

freestone

This is an excellent thread.

One thing you don't mention is the extension to SI. I believe Frans is the only one that scales SI. So if you play OOO up to level 40 then head off to SI you may get zonked by a Dachsund.

Anyone know, what would be the easiest way to get SI rescaled if you are using OOO? Would it work easily to get FCOM set up with just OOO and Frans?

Yes, and there are instructions on the FCOM site. It even explicitly says which options you should install for FCOM if you want them active in SI.

I was somewhat put off by the warnings in various places that it is a bad idea to try FCOM unless you are very experienced with mods, which probably means being on top of Bash and TES4edit. But maybe if I am hardly using any of the features it will be easier.

The warnings is a bit exaggerated to be honest. FCOM isn't difficult to install, but it's not trivial either. The installation instructions really have to be read and followed, FCOM is more than just putting all files into Oblivion\Data and activating them. It's not a real warning for not that experienced players - it's more a indirect warning to prevent RTFM candidates trying to install FCOM. That's something which always end badly.

FCOM requires three skills aside from reading it's readme:
- downloading and installing mods.
- getting Wrye Bash installed. FCOM requires Wrye Bash.
- setting your load order with a program of your choice.

From my experience most problems arise from the first and third task. You can't imagine how many people download wrong components like only OOO patches instead of OOO complete, or forget Fran's .bsa files, or using the German instead of the English Warcry .esp ... I guess some giggled as I wrote as required skill "downloading mods". From my experience that's the biggest source of installation mishaps :blink:.
The third task is no task at all - FCOM's readme is very detailed and tells you exactly how it has to be . Unfortunately some user's attention span is too short to follow it. It is a bit of work, that's for sure, downloading mods aside you need good half an hour if you never had FCOM installed before.

Only people who are completely new to Oblivion shouldn't try out FCOM right away, because if you never ever made anything with mods before, and you have to learn everything, then it's a daunting challenge.

Thanks BG, that's helpful, and neatly put.

I am completely au fait with all the requirements except I haven't used WB to make a bashed patch. Something puzzled me about it. I will look at it again and post if I need help.

Just seen this topic, and if I may can I bring to your attention my mods?

Not as well known as the bigger mods out there, but they also address scaling. Having made very popular morrowind mods (PTE dealing with trade & costs & Creatures for creatures), I've replicated the same approach and made a creature mod called Critters of Oblivion, and various balances & tweaks.
In fact after playing Oblivion for a few hours, I had to recreate my trade mod straight away, shopping was such a bore. Nothing exciting on offer and really unbalanced prices.

They are not as massive as the ones mentioned in the OP, keeping more to vanilla oblivion while addressing many things.

Can't have enough variation though in mods

You should add that Fran's is the only mod that supports several language and avoid moving many dialogues or voice in English.

? I have never had a problem with OOO or MMM related to voices and language?
D'oh - I only thought about dialogues: you mean places and creature's names? Anything changed/ added gets translated into english indeed, but does Francesco's avoid this "problem"? How so?

yup, fran's ask for language you want at the install

Great info here. I personally can't believe I went without OOO for so long... it makes the world so much more static like Morrowind was, and combined with Frans + MMM (in other words, FCOM), the level scaling/loot problems are almost perfect... only things left to tweak in my game with mods are gameplay elements and visual things like weather mods... plus quests, hosues, magic overhauls and etc., so it's an excellent package.

This is indeed a thread well worth my read. It's time for this geezer gamer (68 in November) to install FCOM.

A quick bump for this thread before it fades into obscurity.
It really deserves to be stickied.

The monthly bump :bolt:

i used to use FCOM....although i prefer TIE now. it only took me half an hour to get FCOM up and running and i only had to flip a couple of esps around. i think it gets a bad rap for installation and now there are programs that do it for you.

i think one more point of comparison should be density for lack of a better term. every five steps i was running into one thing or another in FCOM (one of the reasons i uninstalled it). which some people might like but for me was a little over the top. i literally would walk from an atronach to a giant spider to a minotaur and then a spriggan all within the same cell. TIE is much less sparsely populated than FCOM although more so than vanilla. if you like more of a hack and slash then FCOM is more for the liking. TIE seems to be more for adventuring.

also the combat changes in TIE cannot be emphasized enough. i really never had problems with combat in FCOM and i play a light armor stealth type. and at medium levels you can wade through swaths of enemies without breaking a sweat. TIE makes you take alot more damage and you have to pick your fights.

for a really exciting game along with TIE i also use the FCOM durablity and damage esp which double weapon and creature damage and i also use duke patricks smash of the titans mod which gives ogres and giants a really big up in their damage. i pretty much got flattened in one hit from an ancient ogre or something big sounding, the second hit took away my last 2 hit points. by the way i was level 55.