No Shortswords?

Post » Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:42 am

How does playing with shortswords vary from playing with longswords?

You have to get up close and personal, you can swing faster and have more control over the blade.
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Silencio
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 10:52 pm

You do realize that alpha and beta versions of games are different from the final version, especially for small details as that. That was also a DEMO, as in it's a demonstration of the game, not "final copy what you see is what you get, if it's not there it's not in final release." The character in the demo also had 999 health which is incredibly unlikely for regular gameplay without cheating or modding so by your logic, you should expect your character to reach 999 health. I seriously don't get why people go by that logic, "Oh some small detail I didn't see in demo isn't going to be in final release, because it wasn't shown in demo."

What are you even talking about?
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Nienna garcia
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 8:08 pm

Wouldn't be surprised.

They already took away my spears, tanto, wakizashi, gladius, crossbows. Short swords would be just a drop in the bucket of things I like to use that are gone.
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Ash
 
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Post » Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:07 am

You have to get up close and personal, you can swing faster and have more control over the blade.

That's a minor difference. Perhaps shortswords have gone the way of the crossbow.
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Marcus Jordan
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 2:45 pm

Ooooh I see. So this basically means every little detail in these games has its own fanclub thats going to go mad when they change their respective dominion (in this case shortswords, of all thing)?



Really? Get some perspective. In the scheme of things, they really aren't a big deal.


These guys are right. As far as I'm concerned, the only gear available should be:

Sword
Armor
Mace
Shield

Anything more than that is too confusing and unnecessary.
If you don't agree with this, you're a whiny Morrowind fan that can't accept any change.
If you think this list as the only gear in the game is dumbing down, you're a loser and they're not making the game for you.
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:)Colleenn
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 8:00 pm

These guys are right. As far as I'm concerned, the only gear available should be:

Sword
Armor
Mace
Shield

Anything more than that is too confusing and unnecessary.
If you don't agree with this, you're a whiny Morrowind fan that can't accept any change.
If you think this list as the only gear in the game is dumbing down, you're a loser and they're not making the game for you.

:facepalm:
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Jessica Phoenix
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 4:00 pm

That's a minor difference. Perhaps shortswords have gone the way of the crossbow.

Crossbows don't make sense because they take much longer to draw. Which means they would have to do considerably more damage to compensate. Considering the changes to archery, which make bows more powerful, crossbows would be extremely overpowered against single targets. One hit stealth kills on pretty much everything but dragons.

Shortswords would not have introduced any balance issues. They wouldn't have required new animations and could have used the animations of longswords or even daggers. All they would take is time to design, model, and texture. The only reason I can see for their removal would be that Bethesda did not want to take the time to do this.

As far as weapon choice goes, the loss of shortswords is rather considerable. Consider that there are 13 smithable ores, and we can assume that there are 13 weapons for each category. 13 axes, swords, maces, two-handed variations, and daggers. That is 7 categories for a total of 91 weapons. The melding of short and longswords means that we lose 13 weapons, 1/8 of all possible melee options. You could round that to about 1/10 when you take into account artifacts and unique weapons.
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James Shaw
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 9:23 pm

Crossbows don't make sense because they take much longer to draw. Which means they would have to do considerably more damage to compensate. Considering the changes to archery, which make bows more powerful, crossbows would be extremely overpowered against single targets. One hit stealth kills on pretty much everything but dragons.

Shortswords would not have introduced any balance issues. They wouldn't have required new animations and could have used the animations of longswords or even daggers. All they would take is time to design, model, and texture. The only reason I can see for their removal would be that Bethesda did not want to take the time to do this.


I think I've read somewhere that crossbows weren't added to the game because they didn't introduce anything new gameplay wise. It was fundamentally the same as the bow with minor differences (and as you stated, balancing issues). Shortswords may very well fall into that same category -- the transition between daggers and longswords. They may have been axed for similar reasons though I do hope not.
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oliver klosoff
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 2:48 pm

What are you even talking about?

Items are one of those things that changes a lot before a game is released, names, stats, artwork, etc. So because there was a generic sword in the DEMO, that doesn't mean there will only be generic swords throughout the game. It's a simple concept, so I don't see why the confusion.
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barbara belmonte
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 3:31 pm

You do realize that alpha and beta versions of games are different from the final version, especially for small details as that. That was also a DEMO, as in it's a demonstration of the game, not "final copy what you see is what you get, if it's not there it's not in final release." The character in the demo also had 999 health which is incredibly unlikely for regular gameplay without cheating or modding so by your logic, you should expect your character to reach 999 health. I seriously don't get why people go by that logic, "Oh some small detail I didn't see in demo isn't going to be in final release, because it wasn't shown in demo."

Seriously?
When Tod's giving a demo, he uses god mode(999hp) so that he doesn't get killed and look like a tool.
You're trying to say that five months before a game releases they haven't bothered to add "short" or "long" in front of "sword" because it's an alpha or beta build? For real?
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Nicholas C
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 3:41 pm

These guys are right. As far as I'm concerned, the only gear available should be:

Sword
Armor
Mace
Shield

Anything more than that is too confusing and unnecessary.
If you don't agree with this, you're a whiny Morrowind fan that can't accept any change.
If you think this list as the only gear in the game is dumbing down, you're a loser and they're not making the game for you.

This post gave me cancer. :dead:
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Jordan Fletcher
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 11:17 pm

Shortblades have been seen in various trailers (particuarly in the part that showed dual wielding). It is unlikely that Short Blade will feature it's own skill since Todd Howard's goal with Skyrim is to lessen the amount of skills. This is really unfortunate. I think Todd should ask himself "If we have a real life person trained in a long sword, would he know how to use a short sword?". The answer is obviously no, and it doesn't make any sense that we can play as a Longsword character all threw the game until the end and switch to a short blade and know how to use it even though we've never equipped it before.

This post gave me cancer.

True. No offense, but calling someone a "whiny Morrowind fan" doesn't make any sense. A great feature from Morrowind was taken away in Oblivion and we're just whiny Morrowind fans? Your list obviously wasn't even thought out, sense they'res no place for bows/marksmen. Or warhammers. Or axes. And maces were used far less than any of the ones I just listed.
Having four skills that can only be trained to 100 does not offer replayability or specialization.

Edit: A question, have you played Morrowind?
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Carys
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 6:44 pm

Items are one of those things that changes a lot before a game is released, names, stats, artwork, etc. So because there was a generic sword in the DEMO, that doesn't mean there will only be generic swords throughout the game. It's a simple concept, so I don't see why the confusion.

I doubt they would just add a whole new category of weapons into the game this late. There would be no reason to name "longswords" swords if shortswords were planned or under development. They just would have been called "longswords" anyway.

Nothing is guaranteed though. There is no confirmation that longswords are all we get. It seems likely enough, but worth waiting for confirmation.

FO3, could you point me to a shortsword screenshot or video? All I've seen are longswords if I remember correctly.
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Lifee Mccaslin
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 9:55 pm

[
Items are one of those things that changes a lot before a game is released, names, stats, artwork, etc. So because there was a generic sword in the DEMO, that doesn't mean there will only be generic swords throughout the game. It's a simple concept, so I don't see why the confusion.

Do you honestly believe that?
1.Game's releasing in five months.
2.They're giving demos to the "press"
After looking at those two points, you want to tell me the items all have generic names?
Really?

edit:
:facepalm:



This post gave me cancer. :dead:



True. No offense, but calling someone a "whiny Morrowind fan" doesn't make any sense. A great feature from Morrowind was taken away in Oblivion and we're just whiny Morrowind fans? Your list obviously wasn't even thought out, sense they'res no place for bows/marksmen. Or warhammers. Or axes. And maces were used far less than any of the ones I just listed.
Having four skills that can only be trained to 100 does not offer replayability or specialization.

You all thought that was a serious post?
I'm sorry..I honestly thought my intention was pretty blatant. I should have realized that the level of stupid around here as risen so much that I really needed to clarify my sarcasm with some sort of emote.
I apologize for misleading you gentlemen,
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Etta Hargrave
 
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Post » Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:11 am

That's a minor difference. Perhaps shortswords have gone the way of the crossbow.

What?How is that minor?In a skilled swordsmans hand having a short blade while fighting a man with a long sword could be a large advantage and also vice versa.
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N Only WhiTe girl
 
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Post » Mon Jul 04, 2011 1:16 am

Seriously?
When Tod's giving a demo, he uses god mode(999hp) so that he doesn't get killed and look like a tool.
You're trying to say that five months before a game releases they haven't bothered to add "short" or "long" in front of "sword" because it's an alpha or beta build? For real?

First off, the video was older than five months, second, it was an alpha or beta build, things change between those builds, as well as between those and the final build, especially for smaller things like item details and details of other individual objects like NPCs or various enemies. If I were to demo a game like Elder Scrolls, I wouldn't use the most unique of weapons, I'd use some generic ones of the major categories, e.g. swords, axes, bows, etc. just to show off the different types of weapons and how they work and look in the game, not something like short and long swords because they don't differ enough gameplay-wise or art-wise to bother demoing.
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Jade MacSpade
 
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Post » Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:16 am

Do you honestly believe that?
1.Game's releasing in five months.
2.They're giving demos to the "press"
After looking at those two points, you want to tell me the items all have generic names?
Really?

Bethesda is infact, still working on Skyrim, and anything in the demo is subject to change. Five months is plenty of time to change the entire game.
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TIhIsmc L Griot
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 7:15 pm

First off, the video was older than five months, second, it was an alpha or beta build, things change between those builds, as well as between those and the final build, especially for smaller things like item details and details of other individual objects like NPCs or various enemies. If I were to demo a game like Elder Scrolls, I wouldn't use the most unique of weapons, I'd use some generic ones of the major categories, e.g. swords, axes, bows, etc. just to show off the different types of weapons and how they work and look in the game, not something like short and long swords because they don't differ enough gameplay-wise or art-wise to bother demoing.

If that's how you would work, you would probably get your lazy ass fired.
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Syaza Ramali
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 2:25 pm

What?How is that minor?In a skilled swordsmans hand having a short blade while fighting a man with a long sword could be a large advantage and also vice versa.


In real life, yes, there'd be a difference. The shortsword was particularly effective in the confines of the shield wall where you didn't have enough space to swing a longsword, but this isn't real life. The most skill our characters display is whacking things until they die.
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Solina971
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 4:48 pm

These guys are right. As far as I'm concerned, the only gear available should be:

Sword
Armor
Mace
Shield

Anything more than that is too confusing and unnecessary.
If you don't agree with this, you're a whiny Morrowind fan that can't accept any change.
If you think this list as the only gear in the game is dumbing down, you're a loser and they're not making the game for you.

So, no one can used ranged attacks, two handed bladed or blunt weapons. Even no daggers? So basically, assassins would not really be that possible.
Also, do you thing they should remove magic?
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Aman Bhattal
 
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Post » Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:37 am

So, no one can used ranged attacks, two handed bladed or blunt weapons. Even no daggers? So basically, assassins would not really be that possible.
Also, do you thing they should remove magic?

Heh. Thats exactly what I said. I don't think the list was actually well thought-out.
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Sheeva
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 10:15 pm

I'd like some solid proof before any kind of opinion is made. The simple fact of it not being there in a small demo doesn't really conferm anything.
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LijLuva
 
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Post » Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:04 am

So, no one can used ranged attacks, two handed bladed or blunt weapons. Even no daggers? So basically, assassins would not really be that possible.
Also, do you thing they should remove magic?

Please read my edit in http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1206802-no-shortswords/page__view__findpost__p__18023265.
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Kelli Wolfe
 
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Post » Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:12 am

You all thought that was a serious post?
I'm sorry..I honestly thought my intention was pretty blatant. I should have realized that the level of stupid around here as risen so much that I really needed to clarify my sarcasm with some sort of emote.
I apologize for misleading you gentlemen,

I knew you were joking...
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C.L.U.T.C.H
 
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Post » Sun Jul 03, 2011 3:39 pm

That post was a little rude but whatever. It is very important to note however, that in a forum, it is completely impossible for anyone to understand sarcasm. There are many factors including native language and lack of facial expressions or voice changing that get in the way. Its best not to use sarcasm in a forum.

But back on topic...

Oppsies, I missed a post.

I'd like some solid proof before any kind of opinion is made. The simple fact of it not being there in a small demo doesn't really conferm anything

Your right, but unfortunitally you will never get solid proof until novermber. Even if Todd Howard says "Short blades will not be featured in Skyrim" theres always a chance for reconsideration. A demo is probably the best proof you'll have for a while.
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Katie Pollard
 
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