I actually agree with this, especially since this time you don't choose any skills from the get-go. It is thus reasonable to assume that we won't have ANY spells at all when we break free from our execution. Want magic? Buy your spells.

This could easily be addressed by having the player start with nothing but rags, and very early during their escape, find some scrolls/potions etc. to be used, or "learned," or even sold later, at the players discretion.

Of course, the idea to delete spells would work quite well, but starting with absolutely nothing and finding scrolls/potions very early would be excellent role-play to start.

Like finding items in the Oblivion starter dungeon.

How are you supposed to fight after the release from prison if you don't have any spells of skills? Do they really consider the dragonborn to be a peasant type before he gets to prison, by game design?

This is what I am expecting as well, with the jack of all trades no class system they have going. If you want to play a healer, but don't start with a healing spell you kind of are screwed. How would mr pure warrior like it if he couldn't find a weapon until he got to the city. Nope can't train any warrior skills until then, only the other archetypes have access to improving skills before then. Of course I would prefer something that let you pick your skill focuses during the intro and your starting gear/spells were based around that. And if you want to broaden out from there then you need to pick it up in game. But I don;t see that happening given what they have said.

Well you could have 'waited' for a couple of hours, if i remember rightly this also healed charcters. and would roleplay taking some time to fix any wounds on your character

Nah, I think it would especially benefit a Paladin. Healing in that sense would be a gift of the divines that you ask for with your Thaumaturgy skill. Necromancers would take the life from others as a means of healing, and all other healing would be done with doctors/bandages/potions/resting and means that would take more time.

There shouldn't be fast healing. It degenerates the combat and balance into hilarity.

Thats one problem with removing the classes. Before if you wanted spells at the start, make a class that used magic.
Now that we have no classes, it makes more sense to start with nothing and find stuff as you go rather than start with everything, and drop it as you see fit.

And your player is a dragonborn, just like the emperor from Oblivion. Does it make sense for the dragonborn, who doesn't know he's special yet, to have been born with spells already memorized? Just because he is a dragonborn doesn't mean he is already a great warrior or knows any magic.

Not to mention, if your about to be you probably aren't combat ready.

So yes, it makes the most sense for your character to have a skill set of that of a peasant, just because hes dragonborn doesn't mean he knows anything yet.

Um,... pick up the first sharp or heavy object you see and whack stuff to death with it? Like a sword or mace? Isn't it obvious that's how it's going to start?

I'm of the camp that believes every character starting out shouldn't know magic by default. But then again, I'm also of the camp that says if they do give it to you by default, then it isn't a big deal. Just don't use it.

If they did it right, everyone won't start out with a heal skill. We already know that spells can be found as loot now (similar to spell tomes in the DLC). A well written tutorial would have you finding the spell tome and allowing you to either learn the spell or not. If you learn it, then it could go further and give you instructions for casting spells. If you don't want to learn it, then all those pieces of the tutorial would be skipped and you could continue to play as a pure melee character. Lets hope they did it the right way.

I understand the need for the "wait" feature, but I also feel it is very easy to exploit. Again, player can choose to not use it.

How a true http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d162/Rhanyan/larahobbyposter.jpg?t=1304619109 heals.

This would be a interesting feature to address healing/first-aid, etc.

What if you don't want to whack. And why haven't you learned anything before? If you can find a spell 10 meters after starting the game (in some dirty dungeon, I presume), why couldn't you get a simple spell before, during normal life? Your initial attributes must have come from somewhere too. This type of game start creates more questions than answers... The point of this thread was that the guy didn't want to use magic as a warrior type. So, we can't force mages to be warriors and whack a good portion of the starting of the game. I usually play mages and always presume that my character was playing with magic already from childhood. So, I must know some rudimentary spells, even being a peasant.

TES starts out with no past assumed. The skills you started with were defined by your class. So it looks like you have a problem with not having a class anymore.
And in that dungeon, you can always find scrolls, or maybe tomes if they have those. That way you can learn spells in the begining just like a warrior finds a sword.

I start out as a pure warrior. Why do I know a fire spell and healing spell?

When people said, "Awesome, now I don't need to pick a class anymore, there is nothing negative about this!" They clearly didn't think of this.

Exactly, especially in a world that runs on magic, like Tamriel.
Any old peasant can learn a basic healing spell for those small farmyard mishaps, or a basic fire spell for making a fire.
It would indeed be a bit odd to start out in the dungeon as someone who somehow managed to breeze through his whole life without doing anything with that internal battery of magicka reserve they carry around.

Again, all that is needed is the ability to delete spells from the spellbook.
That is all.
No need for intricate tweaks and novel ways to start the game.

Kind of. I have troubles with no background story. This is not RPGish to my tastes. For me, the class sort of substituted the background story. Now its like you wake up clean and start whacking around. Hmmm... I can't say I like it more than classes.

If one is captured, normally, one's items are taken from them. A mages spellbook, a warriors weapons, and a thief's lockpicks, all removed when taken prisoner.

The player could start with rags only.

Replacements, or even those exact items could be found during the escape. Perhaps your "stuff" has been put in a holding area that the player character finds during escape. We don't really know what TES has written yet.

And good gracious, even a fishwife can use a filet knife, and most fighters know some first aid...

Edit: Add http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d162/Rhanyan/larahobbyposter.jpg?t=1304621630

I'm with the Gothicy game start

u start with NOTHING but a rusty sword

A warrior that doesn't know of any way to heal himself is a useless warrior. Granted, there's nothing wrong with the idea that you start with nothing and you want to keep it that way - nothing. Even a warrior that knows first aid might not have the necessary supplies in a prison dungeon.

Even so, the idea that a warrior - in a land where every person has some magic capability and any person could be a mage if they wanted to practice it - wouldn't know any magical remedies at all is kinda silly. If you really want to play that extreme, then you should have the option by deleting the spell from your inventory, but just because you want it does not mean it should be placed upon everyone else.

TL;DR

But although I agree with you, being able to delete spells would have been nice in OB and hopefully, even without spell making, you can delete spells in Skyrim. Other than that I really don't care if you start with a healing spell or you get some cash and you go out and buy one right out of the "tutorial".

Edit:



I agree. Too bad you couldn't do that in OB. And being able to delete any starting spells would be nice for RP reasons. You start the game as a prisoner and it is up to the player to provide the background (which I really like). But if your background is a farmer chased off his land by goblins and you turn to thievery and murder to survive (and were caught and to be executed) and know nothing of magic, why start with the starter spells? Deleting them would help fulfill your background. Leaving other players who want those starter spells for RP or other reasons can have them no problem.

Lets not talk about removing it, because we don't know if it's going to be like that in the first place (Skyrim isn't Oblivion).

They should just not add it in the first place. If you want a healing spell then go buy it. Just like weapons. (Either that or just add the option to remove spells which I'm sure they're going to do anyways)

[edit] And as a side note I really liked how Morrowind handled this. They just gave you that ring that you could do anything you wanted with. Start a quest, sell it, or keep it for yourself. Your game started with choices right away.

So a Bethesda employee came into your living while you were playing Oblivion and held a gun to your head to force you to cast spells? And how did you get into the locked chests in the game considering there was no bash option? A certain amount of cross-classing was necessary in Oblivion, you simply couldn't make it through the game without using a variety of skills. But that hardly means that you ended up being a mixed class, unless that's what you wanted to do in the first place. You could quite easily be a "pure" Warrior while still having a certain amount of proficiency with some non-Warriors skills. It would be rather foolish for a real-life soldier not to know some basic First Aid skills while in the field, and a basic healing spell would just be the Tamriel equivalent.

I believe linear spell cantrips is logical in magical word where Magicka flow in the blood, they can work as utility spells, fire up candle or torch, douse them with freeze, detect forgotten keys (really need such spell IRL :biggrin: ), problem thats devs does not add such logical feature, while thats is not hard at all and simple scripting and was done in ten year old games before, but we can add such features with mods at last.

About removing starting heal, thats can be done in hardcoe mod if it will presented so only charters thats take some starting traits from restoration school will have them at beginning, but I doubt thats will be done devs seems don't like options if something flawed axe it and tend make game average for all players, be generic be blank, they even protect us from wrong and moron decisions at beginning by removing Birthsigns, since some one will take wrong combination, oh well Pink Floyd The Wall really suit there.

The game starts well after your orcish warrior 'came out of the womb'.

Be able to delete spells.

I cannot honestly comprehend why this was removed.No one enjoys a cluttered up magic menu.

Or why you can't name your game save in Oblivion.Whoever suggested that should be beaten.

what about my paladin? There are many flavours of the 3 main types of characters and limiting choice does not help.

They should have a Warrior perk where your health slowly regenerates which will be equal to using a basic regenerating spell..