That was VERY shallow. As someone stated above, TES is like a second life, and in life you can have a relationship if you want

Exactly. The OP said, "romance" not relationship. I don't want to work for a "zero sum". I play games to enjoy the story, explore, and kill [censored].

Why waste a devs talent on something so inane?

I'm not sure. I know they could either nail it or blow it completely. In my opinion Fable really kills it, but Bioware is on the right track. If they could make it a step or two ahead of Bioware then I'd like to see it. I know it sounds silly to most non gamers, but the whole romance thing in some video games really connects you more to the people. Fable does a horrible job with it though.

Make it similar to Bioware. Include the whole courting ritual, wedding etc. I think it has potential to make a pretty decent quest.

As I said, I'm not sure if they should include it. If it's anything less than stellar then do away with it completely.

Why relegate another Elders Scrolls game to nothing more BUT that?

The very reason I bought Morrowind when it was first released was because I tired of inane, linear, games that were nothing more than tired constructs of Good vs Evil utilizing the same methods and gaining experience via body count. I have a library of hundreds of those games that never get a return play because for some of us, the constant theme of "figure the trap/kill the guard/loot the booty/kill the boss monster" is tiresome. If I wanted that, I would never use PC games because platform game systems are designed to perform that far better. But realistically, spending a perpetual $50 to $60 dollars to spend a week and a half just killing and problem solving until the credits roll offers little to me. Fine if others enjoy that, but to me, the open-ended tout of the original Morrowind was exactly what was needed.

Thank goodness that Bethesda thought to add the construction set. Mods are taking a game that nears over a decade that is STILL purchased because others tired of 7 to 20 levels of "kill, loot, kill, accolade, ending credits." Never have to worry about that with Morrowind or Oblivion really. No credits to roll. No need to adopt a "I have to beat it!" mindset. There is no 'beating'.

Nononononononono... no.

Leilana is a crazy stalker. We don't need that.

Okay, then I must firmly put my foot down and say I DEFINITELY do not want a six system. Too shallow, and too much of a waste of good time that could be put to good use elsewhere. To me, that'd be the last thing I'd work on for TES. The only way I could foresee a "romance" system is to do what Beth did with Nova in FO3. Otherwise, it's just a sleazy sleeping with everyone system.

But the Bioware method undoubtedly consumes a lot of resources. Dragon Age is made up mostly of dungeons and party conversation. While I don't care to "measure" it, in Mass Effect 2 I'm fairly certain the quests to recruit and gain the loyalty of party members takes up more of the game than the main plot and sidequests combined. If you want "real" characters, with personalities and backstories and in-depth conversation and romantical simulation, you're going to spend a lot of effort and have a limited number of them, giving all characters only the same few choices. On the other side, you get the Fable option, in which you can choose anyone but they're all exactly the same, and the concept of romance becomes shallow at best. For now I'd rather they leave it alone; with any luck AI will continue to become more advanced and they'll eventually be able to realistically simulate relationships without devoting a bunch of time to it.

No. I find the crusade for realistic relationships really disturbing. I hope Bethesda doesn't go trudging through uncanny valley. I'm ok with where video game romances are right now, but I don't believe there should be a future for them in games, or much less TES. Besides, I like the mystique of the heroes, as unbound to the world - anomalies of moment - not characters with a past and future.

http://www.city-data.com/forum/members/bs13690-83559-albums-random-pics-pic43266-nerds-ogre.jpg (Damn this forum and its prohibition of image posting!)

Seriously, what the hell is it with RPG fans and their obsession with women? Between Neverwinter Nights and Oblivion I can't look sideways without finding some dikefisted romance plot reminding me why I hate most of my fellow gamers.

Romance options are the weakest parts of games.

It's tacky. Cliche'd. Or at least, TES always put me in the mindset that we were frontiersmen, Tamriel a very serious world filled with dire consequences and great dangers. Life isn't fair. It's just unecessary to do something so sissy, if you will. There's such a thing as too much realism, or in this case, clunky, alienating, imperfect attempts at realism. I don't see how you can develop a relationship with an NPC, if anything, it would just detach me more from my character. Let's focus on depth of plot, politics, action. No soap operas in Tamriel.

Personaly, i don't really consider TES a game for everyone. You can't please everyone and you shouldn't try.

If we get the greatest RPG of all time, i can assure you that i would be willing to wait 5 years aswell but thats not really the point. If something in the game dosn't really interest you, there is no reason to want it in the game. Who care about what others want? Sure i don't have to play as a Daedra but i still don't want to see the Daedra as a playable race.



Ofcause it would have to be optional. I don't think anyone really want to force the pc into a relationship. And i agree the love interest would have to be atleast somewhat interesting characters. This is also why i don't think you should be able to romance all NPCs, only a select few. That should give Bethesda the opotunity to make them feel more real and natural.

I agree that a six scene is not really neccery, its enough to just imply it, non or less i actually think they should go for it. A tastefully done love scene, like the ones you will encounter in a good movie would be welcome. I fail to see why you can't do that kind of things in a game. I am not talking about hardcoe pormography ofcause and i have never seen that in a game so its not really something i worry about. heck if they actually did it my respect for Bethesda would probably just increase. You gotta admit that any develepor who did that, really have balls.

It's most definitely not a kids game in my opinion and as such, Bethesda shouldn't really care too much about ESRB and any other videogame content rating systems.



BioWare's romance system is not perfect, i will be the first to admit that. But there is "ALOT" of things which isn't excactly realistic in The Elder Scrolls, or any other videogame i have played for that matter, so i don't see why romances have to be. Ofcause they should be somewhat realistic but not in the way that they start to irretate the player. I never said BioWare was perfect, just that i think they are on the right track. there is still alot to be done before it's perfect.



It's gotta be alot harder in a game like TES than in DA:O, thats true. In order for the relationships to feel alteast somewhat realistic, you will need to spend some time with your love interest. Thats not easy in a game like TES where you are mostly the lone wolf. Hoever, i actually think it would be a good thing if Bethesda made some companions for your character. I am not talking about turning the Elder Scrolls into a Partybased roleplaying game ofcause, you should still mostly be alone but perhaps in 30% of the quests in the game, it would be nice with some company and i am not just speaking of potential love interests here.



Because i don't find it stupid ofcause.

And so what if they are not real? Love in movies, tv series and books is not real either but i am able to appreciate it non or less.



You might wanna read the first 2 lines in my original post again.



That really depends on what you appreciate in a game.

It should be hardcoe and no censoring.

Only then i'll be done with downloading 1080p pr0n.

Spending the time/resources to make a fully developed romance system in TES is likely to take too much away from the more fundamental aspects of basic gameplay, and add to the amount of space that the relevant dialog takes up on disc. On the other hand, making character interaction in general a bit better would be a big improvement to the game.

In my opinion, adding a few "simple" romance options aimed at "assisting RP" to perhaps 2-6 NPCs would let either imagination or mods fill in the rest, rather than forcing any potential relationship along rigid scripted lines. By having any more than those 2-6 NPCs "available", you would end up with a huge ballooning of the required dialog. Creating an "in-depth" romance system would also most likely turn into either a forced and artificial joke, or into nothing more than in-game porm; making romance options available for most of the NPCs in the game would be so shallow that it really can't be called "romance". I don't want to see any of those situations, especially at the expense of shallower overall dialog (if it can even get much shallower than in OB) or less resources spent on other aspects.

Such minimal additional features could at least make having a household or long-term travelling companion possible to justify or maintain from a RP standpoint, with the inclusion of a moderate selection of responses to a few "vague" topics of conversation such as "friendship" and "home". Anything beyond that would require much more effort to develop, and a lot of talent to implement well.

Mods could do the subject of actual romance much better justice, in my opinion. Since different players want or expect totally different things from such a relationship, keeping it fairly "generic", and leaving further details to a wider variety of mods would probably make the most sense all around. The game developers could be gracious enough to add a few "handles" to make such inevitable additions easier to integrate into the game. Perhaps a few extra lines of dialog could be recorded while the original voice actors are available, and later be offered as a resource for download by modders, which might assist the creation of such mods without having to fit it all on the distribution disc.

I don't know about that. If it was implemented well enough it would really fit right in with Beth's style. I don't think it needs to be a focus though. A new AI/Dialogue system should be adopted first. If that works I'm sure the moding community could do some experimenting with romance. If the mods work out well enough, perhaps we could get really good romance in TES VI.

TES VI... probably insomething crazy like 2018, dear god I'm looking waaaaay too far ahead.

I was clarified to what this "romance" system that keeps being tossed, and it's pretty much a six system. A real relationship is pretty much being ball-and-chained because you have to keep the wife/husband happy, and going around, saving the world, taking odd jobs, questionable work, dangerous work, and periods of random exploration become significantly hindered, as it takes time and commitment to be in a relationship. Not to mention you throw yourself in harms way, and coming back dead in a high risk area of work is not something good for a stable relationship.

Anything less is a six system, even BW's "romance" system is pretty much just a six system.

I honestly don't think so. Morrowind and OB didn't have "romance", and they were just fine, so I don't see the reason or logic behind adding a controversial feature into a concrete and secure RPG series.

I agree.

Sure, yeah. I have yet to appreciate a romance option in a game. My preference is to let other games experiment with what I would appreciate in a romance option.

I like your avatar.

If they do add one, which I would find a pleasant new addition, there should definitively be a gay and lisbian option. ^_^

EDIT-And I definitely don't think it's for nerds obsessed with woman, and it's definitively not sissy. I didn't realize everyone playing the game was such big burly manly men.

Jeez! I play video games to get AWAY from romance and s**t like that, so I don't really want it hampering my virtual world too!!!!
You could just imagine it.......you get up in the morning, pull on your armour, grab your sword and head for the door, only to hear (in a screechy, annoying voice) "You're not going out adventuring AGAIN!! You never spend any time with me! You never buy me flowers.........."
SWIPE!!!!!!!!
PLOP!!!!!!!!!!

Why does romance in TES have to be realistic when nothing else in the game is very realistic? We don't have to eat or drink. If you get shot in the eye you don't become blind or die, so why does your girl have to yell at you if you don't spend too much time with her, or why does she have to be a nag (all women aren't nags BTW). What if you're dating someone on the same path as you, a warrior with their own life? Maybe you could have a choice, if you want a needier relationship, date a normal citizen, if you want to be away for months, date a warrior or a thief in the guild?

Dragon Age's romance system is so far the best I've seen in any game - of course it could always be better, but so far its the best (mostly because of the excellent voice acting and interesting characters with their own pasts). How is it a six system? Because there is a six scene? There is still dialogue and storyline with the characters after you sleep with them. Most of the time, with Leliana, I got more approval points from listening to what she had to say rather than giving her gifts. There is even built in jealousy in the game, so you can't have six with multiple characters.

That's why I add Necessities of Morrowind: for the eating and drinking requirements. There are lots of requests in these forums for locational damage, so if you get shot in the eye you DO become blind or die. Of course, having your girl yell at you for not spending enough time with her should depend on the girl and the state of the relationship, not be a "hard-coded" requirement in all cases. Adding realism (or better, yet, leaving enough "room" for mods to add that realism for those who want it) is a good thing, within limits. I do agree that we don't need a "nagging" system that punishes you for doing other things in the game, though.

I did have my tongue wedged firmly in my cheek when I typed that, by the way.

QFT.

BioWare did an excelent job with the romance part in Dragon Age: Origin. I would like to see something like that, just a little deeper and more polished.

I do not understand the opposition to a love scene. It could be tastefully done. It don't have to be vulgar and i don't know why anyone would worry about that. I have yet to see something which could possible be compared to porm in a game... perhaps i am just playing the wrong games. :shrug: