Just a poll to guage peoples' response to the simplification of the system.

I personally find that removing Attributes was un-neccessary. If you read the GI magazine, you will find that they only kept the "derived attributes" and renamed one of them "Stamina":-

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Attributes

where did it even say that the attributes were gone? I just saw a picture that showed the skills

We don't know they're gone. I expect they are still here. If not, this can still be handled gracefully.

It didn't. They weren't mentioned and incredibly enough, there's people out there who automatically assume they were removed.

The attributes are not in Skyrim. They are down to just 3 base ones. This was discussed in detail in the forum.

yeh people are assuming from a skills or level up menu that attributes arn't there, it could just be the new skills menu, it could just offhandly mention leveling up there, why else would there be a progress bar on the skills?

Discussed by whom? Forum members?

And if attributes aren't a big list, maybe it's because the skill usage system is more sophisticated. I am not worried, not jumping to any conclusions either.

I'd say the game is too far in development to make major changes to the character system, which returning attributes would be. If attributes have been removed, then the entire character system will be designed without them, and adding them in again would require major changes to be made to it. Things like how attributes interact with skills, how they tie into leveling, the attributes of other characters, both hostile and otherwise, and so on. If the game was rebuilt from the ground up without attributes, as they were handled in past Elder Scrolls games, then suddenly adding them in again would probably create a horribly broken mess, so assuming attributes have actually been removed, I'd say it should be kept that way in Skyrim, because even if I don't approve of the decision to remove them, I'd rather play a game designed without them from the start than a game whose quality suffers from a half-hearted attempt to add attributes into a system not originally meant to have them. Now, should they return in whatever comes after Skyrim? Maybe, maybe not, since I doubt Bethesda will completely overhaul their character system when there's less than a year away from the intended release date, I might as well wait and see, and save that question for after I've seen how the new character system works out in game.



I don't think it's been said explicitly, but it seems to be the general assumption on these forums right now from the information we've been given. I can't tell you if I agree with this assumption yet since all my knowledge of the information revealed in the article is second hand, being as I got it from reading these forums, so I haven't been able to judge what's shown in the article, and decide for myself.

Considering the direction Fallout 3 has taken since Oblivion, I wouldn't be surprised if attributes are gone. To be quite honest, a lot of them were just plain useless (jumping, acrobatics, etc.) and didn't make a lot of sense. While it does make the game feel like there is less choice in what the player can do, it is ultimately on how Bethesda crafts the game. I found Fallout 3 overall had a level system that made more sense than Oblivion, and I'm curious as to how perks will play a role in Skyrim. Either way, while I'll miss attributes since they have always been apart of TES, I can cope with losing them if it makes the game overall better and make more sense.

Link to developer confirmation please.

Still going to reserve judgment till I hear it stated somewhere or there's irrefutable proof. All we know is that we get to manually increase stamina, mana, and health.

How do you know that the system has been simplified? What does it mean to be "simplified" in this case? What if it were replaced by something more interesting? What if the original system is incompatible with some new systems that are critical to gameplay?

Acrobatics and jumping are not attributes.

We don't have enough info to really form any kind of educated opinions yet.

I'm curious as to how something like the amount of junk you can carry would be determined if the strength attribute is gone (tie it to your stamina points, perhaps?).

FYI - If you read the magazine, there is a bit which explains what happens when you level-up. You get to increase either your Health, Magicka or Stamina (the latter one used to be called Fatigue). There is no mention of any attributes at all.

A reminder of what the Attributes are from Oblivion:-
http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Attributes

So first you claimed that attributes are gone, and then you edited the post to say it's down to 3? This is pure speculation and it hasn't been confirmed.

I'm going to say no, but mostly hope that they've been implemented better in Skyrim than they were in Oblivion.

I really hated having attributes direct exactly what I did in Oblivion all out of the need to try and get all those +5's for attributes. I just want to play the game, not have to worry about this and that and not doing too much of those otherwise I'll be wasting skill points.

I made a theory thread at the bottom of the first page telling how attributes could be implemented without being implemented as other TES games.

Yeah, all we have are assumptions, speculations, and blah. I say wait till there is actual word.

Those are "derived attributes". Not the Attributes I was referring to - such as Strength, Intel, etc. Those are gone.

If they are gone yes put them back! I want my RPG elements in this game not just action/skill based!!

to be honest i frankly dont care. in a way its kind of freeing because the typical archetype for playing a thief character is someone who is super fast and agile and really weak. when in fact thieves would be very strong from constantly climbing, running and jumping and carrying all the loot around. they obviously shouldnt be as good with a battleaxe and plate armor but the doesnt mean they are physically weak. navy seals are a good example. they are trained to be invisible and stealthy yet no one would say that they are wimpy.

So maybe attributes rise automatically when you level depending on what skills you have raised. There is no official proff that attributes have been cut and I'm having a hard time believing they were.

To have a mere 3 attributes wouldn't make any sense

What would they be? Strength, magicka, and stamina? No I don't think so

I think all the usual ones will be back, strength, intelligence, willpower (accidentally said wisdom, was thinking of different game xD), speed, endurance, etc.

Maybe attributes automatically raise based on what skills you increase.

Or maybe they went the fallout route and you pick your attributes at the start, with no way to raise them except through perks or magic items/bonuses

Or maybe they entirely depend on your race, and again you increase them with perks.