Simplifying. : V - Skyrim

» Sun Aug 01, 2010 5:57 pm

This. Bethesda is improving the TES series with Skyrim, not weakening it. Too many people don't understand that.

Not the point he was trying to make, I'm afraid. The application of Occam's Razor in this instance is to point out that one can achieve the proper explanation, or answer to an equation (i.e. calculating Magicka via Intelligence) with a simpler version of the same procedure.

The "simplifying" or "dumbing down" that so many people argue about on this forum amounts to the simplest answer by Bethesda: Todd and the team want a game that functions just as well as (if not better than) the previous titles, but without unnecessary procedure and titles for those game functions that create the enjoyable experience Bethesda, (and by extension, us, the fans of their games) have come to expect.

Not really. There was nothing complex about the other system. For example: Raising Intelligence to get more Magicka, or just raising it through perks at level up are the same thing, so Occam's Razor does not apply. But thats not even what we are talking about, we're talking about losing things and they never get replaced. Occam's Razor doesnt figure into that either. If we did apply Occam's Razor, we'd be playing a linear action game.

» Sun Aug 01, 2010 1:04 pm

I'm sorry but someone that went from "punny swordman that barely knows which end to point at opponents" to "grand master swordman that rivals all others in the known world" for SURE didn't do that without a sizeable body strength improvement.

And you don't gain a "sizeable body strength improvement" in the 8 or 9 game months that 200 hours of game play translates into. If you want to be a "grand master swordman," you would need to BUILD your character with enough points in your Strength Attribute.

You say attributes are fixed or mostly fixed but it's wrong. You can train them as well as you train skills, it's practically the same. You are of the opinion that your fate is decided at birth but ever since Daggerfall Bethesda has been making the TES games to mean more and more that hard work and dedication can overcome such initial problems. There aren't many games that allow you practically freely to take what looks like a puny race like a Bosmer, put him through some military like training for years and end up with a mean muscled two handed axe wielding pro. And why should it be totally forbidden?

No, I stated what Attributes actually are, by definition . . . and what I think they should be in a RPG. And I used Fallout 3 as an example, because its attributes were much closer to the actual definition, because they rarely increased (you didn't get to add points to your attributes when you leveled up). Fast leveling skill increases is NOT the same as years of training. Skills are what should improve over the months of gameplay that most play through lasts . . . not inherent things like Strength, and Intelligence, and Endurance, and Agility.

TES is a game where your training is the main factor to decides what you are, not your birth and it's fine like that. Don't go against that because there's not many RPGs of the kind already.

I disagree. TES is a game where you BUILD your character at the very beginning of the game in the way that you want to play that game. This unique character build (which, in the previous games, have included things like Race, Gender, Class, and Birthsign DIFFERENCES) represents your character's Abilities at that point in their life . . . which is at age 20 or 30 or whatever (not when you were born). Your abilities at the beginning of the game should consist of your inherent Attributes (that won't change much) and your Learned Skills (which should improve as you level up).

» Sun Aug 01, 2010 8:38 pm

Post limit.