Okay, so some of you have been following my comments regarding single-player instancing and ESO, but I felt it would be a good idea to provide a detailed explanation of why I oppose it.

First and foremost, my opposition has nothing at all to do with difficulty level of mobs or bosses within a given instanced dungeon. Even were my character maxed out with everything, I'd not enter a low-level single-player instanced dungeon, out of principle alone - even knowing I could one shot kill the boss in question. So again, difficulty of play has nothing to do with my argument.

So why am I so vehemently opposed to single-player only instances? I play this MMO with my wife, and we play as a grouped team. If she isn't playing, then I don't play. When we do play in an MMO, we do everything together - and I mean everything. Both of us have played characters together for a long time, and we communicate very well together, often knowing what the other will do even without verbal communication. Many others play MMOs for very similar reasons: They enjoy grouping together all throughout the game, and they have no desire to quest as a single player.

In case all that isn't clear, grouping is vitally important to many of us who play, and we insist on cooperative grouping. So we have no desire to be forced into single-player instancing - at all - ever.

Now I'm not demanding that those who desire to enter instanced dungeons as single players be prohibited from doing so. By all means, they should!

A couple of popular counter-arguments to my stance have surfaced:

• Grouped players will have an easier time defeating mobs and bosses in an instanced dungeon than would a single player
• Grouped players in an instanced dungeon will miss out on developing game mechanics and skills, vice the single player in the same instanced dungeon

Addressing the first concern, I offer this compromise:

• Level up the mobs and boss in a given instanced dungeon in proportion to the size of the group that enters
• Reduce XP and loot in accordance with the size of the group entering the instanced dungeons.

As for the second concern, my response is, "I don't care." If you percieve that grouped players are missing out on developing game mechanics, then that is our issue - not yours.

This isn't a single-player game. If you want to engage in a single-player ESO , there are a plethora of TES titles that have been released to date that will offer you what you desire.

This isn't WoW or any other MMO. This is ESO. None of the compromises I offered above in any way adversely affects the ability of other players to enter instanced dungeons in single-player mode. There is simply no logical reason to insist that instanced dungeons remain single-player only.

I feel like ESO is too much Single player right now. There seems to be no need for grouping unless you are fighting elites in the open world. The only argument i have for SP instancing is that having too many peole around stops the spwning of mobs. Although this is a mechanics problem (and perhaps not intentional on unique mobs) it is probllematic for quest progression. This can be fixed by allowing fewer people in an instance or just removing the "anti-farm" mechanic from unique mobs.

But ya. I do agree that mobs should be made harder for groups of players. But i don't agree with lowering xp, especially if xp is shared. I don't know if its shared or not, but if it's not shared, then a nerf to xp doesnt matter to me.

I really beleive that ESO should encourage grouping. Like give extra gold, or better loot, or actually more xp (even though this kind of goes against one of my points).

ESO does encourage grouping. It has solo content, duo and small group content, and large group content. If you want to do ALL the content you have to be able to play in each of those modes. Rings of Mara give more XP while grouped, and the drops you can get in the zones that are too hard to solo are FAR better and more numerous than the drops in solo/duo zones.

There are solo players who would like to be able to solo everything, and who do not want to EVER be "forced" into playing in a group; that's not going to happen. There are also group players who want to do everything in groups, like the OP; apparently that's not going to happen either. But they don't have any more right to dictate how the game plays for everybody than the solo players do.

It's no different than the argument between PvE-only and PvP-only players, or RP and non-RP players. Each group feels entitled to impose their playstyle on everybody, but the game would lose large chunks of their audience if they let any one group take over the whole game.

I know there is the small group and large group content. But i mean in the regular world, doing regular side quests, etc. I would support having the option to SP and MP qhile questing, but wqhen i played with my friend on the beta, it felt liek nothing changed except for the greatly reduced difficulty and that we had to collect items separately, instead of sharing items collected for quests. Felt less fun and felt liek it took much longer.

Although now that i think about it, i realize that the incentives for grouping in group content are fine, and that grouping otherwise is just punishing. In order to bring it up to speed with solo questing though, quest kills and quest items shoudl be shared. But otherwsie i think it might be fine as logn as you have rings of mara.

I too represent a husband and wife team,and we were very irrtated by the solo surprise on this quest. We have played for years including DDO and EQ2. We were very excited about this game and the beta and i pestered customer support to Give my wife a beta key early on. We have done three betas together and have purchased three games for my wife myself and my son.

When we came upon this dungeon we were Very unhappy and I Thought it was a glitch. When we we found out it wasn't, but by design, we went away....But then we came back , 4 times over 4 levels We finally beat it .

Now , wife sits adjacent to me in front of her computer and we can converse freely and so we went through together in spirit ( well , i could see her check marker) Taking notes as to what seemed to be efective and what wasn't. After Two nights of coming back and trying it we Beat it. Now I'm the kind of guy that won"t let a stupid game kick my ass , so i had incetive ,as for my wife ? She followed me, gave advice and helped me succeed , and then in turn i did the same for her.

This quest was designed to be mano a mano . To learn to Judge a situaition ,attack , get beaten , retreat and learn from the mistake . I died at least ten times before i got it right. I learned how valuable my team mate was and how beter to be self sufficient for her sake and as an equal partner.

There is no way to scale the dungeon and keep the dynamics of the Situation. This dungeon required solo to learn something that would better my partnership. I'm a better individual and thus a better Team player/partner

Or you can always walk away like I almost did.

earfalus, you bring up good points, and I respect your point of view.

However, I'll continue to insist this particular MMO not force single-player instances. If folks desire to conduct single-player instances, then they should be allowed to do so, and if folks desire to group, they be allowed to do so. I feel very, very strongly about this.

Not force but allow too? I can agree with this... To do it like Wow does a "flex" raid... If a single player go's in, then the instance is scaled back. If 2 or more, its scaled up to match the dmg

You have a very odd definition of "force". As far as I can tell, it's "if there is a nice reward for doing a thing, I'm being forced to do that thing."

Amen!

solo dungeons should be kept solo, everything else- i care little about since it was just fine to my experience,

The hard part about this discussion is that ,you are not being forced to go in the dungeon ,. And while I appreciate your compromise, it does change the dynamics of the Fight and That part cant be scaled up . Your meant to walk in to an onion , peel it back layer by layer and deal with it. with no help . there is the lesson . I enjoyed the Quest ...in the end I would be resentful if someone insisted i couldn t experience it. Especially when they have the option to walk away

If you cannot continue a popular side-quest unless you engage in only a single-player instancing, then that is a forcing mechanism by its very definition.

+1. Agree with every word of the OP.

I played the beta last weekend with my boyfriend and we were really disappointed with this aspect of the game - which is sad, as we've both been really excited to play the whole thing co-op style but it doesn't feel like that playstyle is really supported. Also, being in a group with somebody but having to still complete the quest objectives individually was really, really irritating.

Won't be cancelling my pre-order but I really hope they give this some thought before launch.

No one is being FORCED into any quest! You CHOOSE do it alone or you CHOOSE not to do it at all! It's all your choice.....I quest with my partner(husband), but this one helped me with strategies.

What is it that you said???? Get to know your enemy.......how better to do that than face it ALONE!!!

May be this best solution that would make everybody happy with out removing the content (solo only ), would be to remove this particular Boss and solo from the primary quest line. Then its easy to walk away from because it becomes completely optional.

Please pay special attention to what follows:

If the continuation of a popular side-quest is contengent upon a single-player-only dungeon, then its continuence by definition shuts out those who refuse to engage in single-player-only dungeons.

Do you understand?

I disagree with the OP. Instancing mechanics and logic filters today are or should be smart, most games coming out with this technology utilize this intelligence to higher degrees than I see in this game to date.

The question is does the engine instancing framework have this type of flexibility and if not why not? Such a simple thing to provide instancing today that accounts for all play styles and yet does not affect RP or grouping.

I like this game a lot but I do see fundamental design flaws that cause these complaints and issues. The OP says well I play with my wife so screw everyone else, others say I play solo and only have so much time so screw the groupers and elitists, I just want to have my immersion quickly and get in do a adventure and get out without being forced into grouping.

Also this notion in MMO's that since it is a MMO it requires you to force group to get the best gear or obtain higher immersion zones or adventures is in my opinion why MMO's are failing. I think especially with this FLAG title they could of designed their systems smarter to account for both play styles. I see no problem having instanced encounters/dungeons appear on map while adventuring as well as their static always open group/adventure dungeons.

There is no difference in spawning a chest or mob or a instance in today's techonology for these games, and who is the wiser around you no one only you would or your party would see it appear. I real missed chance at obtaining and maintaining a higher population of customer demographics in my opinion. I only see a lot more negative results from this design than positive, so I think all these threads you guys complain about immersion breaking and where are the solo content complaints are more than just people complaining these are customers and more importantly they are a huge base of our playing community that helps make the world better and stronger. So I ask you all why would you not want to support their requests as much as your grouping/PVP demands?

No instead you complain to the complainers, yes some deserve it but where does that lead in the end the community shrinks and we all suffer. The game suffers, the company profits suffer. You know what happens after that, F2P then death.

Public areas should always remain public it gives life and RP to the world, but open space adventuring instancing should be implemented. This to me was the biggest disappointment to this title and many others.

Let's see will give them the largest zone ever for PVP not only that but award them with faster experience and gear while in that space. Also will give them Group adventure zones with more rewards, but the true adventurer screw you, basically is how I see it today.

Post anywhere, in any thread, where I've posted an assertion that single players should not be allowed to instance dungeons.

It shouldn't be made 'for' single player but it shouldn't stop it either.

Solo running dungeons is meant to be more challenging, there should not be any down scaling of the mobs / end boss just because you are playing solo.

For the record I play solo a lot, but I like to know that when I have beaten a dungeon it's the same difficulty as if I were in a group, it adds to the sense of achievement.

i agree 100% you should not be forced to solo in a MMORPG

i know some of my guildies are dedicated healers, they only play in groups and they invest 100% in healing, and we all love them for it!

although they could likely stay alive forever in those encounters, they likely wouldnt have the dps to end them

for the love of all that is holy just scale the encounters when done in a group, they werent to hard before so there was no need to nerf them

Forced solo content should not exist in a MMO = Massively Multiplayer Online Game, it should be optional. I'm very disappointed in forced solo dungeons, I wanted an elder scrolls experience with a friend but with all of the phasing and forced solo dungeons I can't have that which is strange because I thought Zenimax made the rings of mara for this reasons....to promote group play but this doesn't do that.

I hope they eventually give us the option to invite help or a friend to our solo instances to do them together and those that want to solo have the option to solo...options is the key word here. If they're not going to allow us to do solo instances with other players then they should at least fix the phasing issues out in the world, the teleport to player doesn't work...relogging doesn't work...I can only hope these issues are a bug or else what's the point....

We should be locked in our groups phase at all times as long as we're in a group together.

And thats why I think the "flex" idea for ESO is a good one. Just lower the limit to 1 person, and raise it to the max where needed. Moot points all, but since we are wishing.....

The healer aspect is an excellent point I hadn't considered.

I Understand completely......Maybe ......this should not have been made part of the main side quest in order to complete for the fighters guild. BUT....i did it anyway!

Aggrevating nonetheless.

Couldn't agree more OP, I've been railing against this for some time now. SP-only content in an MMO is a terrible idea, regardless of the motivation. If someone wants to feel like a beautiful unique snowflake they should have the option to solo the main quest. Notice I said OPTION. Those who do not care to feel like that should have the OPTION to bring members of their party (aka friends) anywhere they want.

they werent hard they required strategy and not a lot of it, now pfft its just another pew pew quest