Xbox One games often require an online connection to work now, which is essentially DRM. Other than that, purchasing anything from the Xbox Marketplace adds it to your purchase history, which you can access at any time to download even de-listed items provided you downloaded them when they were previously available.

So, I believe Microsoft's system is capable of at least verifying all digital purchases of games or DLC.

Also, as I have mentioned, plenty of other games have allowed for free upgrades and save file transfers, so it's all very possible, if nothing else.

This is no criticism of you, Leonardo, but more generally speaking, the only issue in my mind is whether people care enough to oppose the decision by Bethesda. I knew full well that the Skyrim forums would be populated mostly by PC gamers, seeing as the game ran it's course on consoles a while back, and that many would vehemently oppose a backtrack by Bethesda to take away their "free game", though the current reception has been mixed and those that do agree with me are only tentatively doing so, due to the crowd mentality set against me personally.

I'm more than happy to wade into this particular mire where my opinion shall not be popular, but if we could refrain from the indirect snipes on my character in an attempt to undermine my argument, that'd be great.

Keep things factual, free from speculation without substantiation and preferably civil.

Us PC users make mods that extend the games lifespan and keep it popular. Bethesda repays us for this with a free version of the special edition. I don't see any problem here.

Not all PC users make Mods. That argument cannot hold up as it is flawed.

Only give free versions of the SSE to popular Mod creators then.

Exactly, but others will always respond that this would only be justified if every single one of those over 10 Million PC users personally makes mods for console users. Not every PC user is a "potential mod author", but there's no way to seperate here.

that would cause an even bigger backlash than what you are complaining about, and fracture the modding community even more than their other recent decisions have (in all honesty, the bethesda modding community is a shadow of its former self, after the mod theft issue with FO4 mods being on consoles, and the "premium mod civil war", most of the bigger more recognized modders have left for greener pastures)..



as i posted before, just in case you ignored it:

I'm sure there is a way to separate here, they just cannot be bothered to do so. And 10 million users, eh? That's a lot of money even for $1 per copy.

I know people don't want their freebies taken away, but let's keep it real here, it's not even slightly fair by any stretch of the imagination.

As for FO4 Mods, I could live without them. They don't make any real difference or improvement imo. The one I've liked the most so far is the one which adds in a Walther P99. The other "Modern Firearms" ones are just too CoD for my tastes. Good that they included an AS50 though. Makes a change from every .50 AMR being an M95.

Sure, but that's a problem for the modding community, not the greater gaming public. New Modders will fill the void eventually, and no one person will make Mods forever. Let the new talent in, I say, especially if everyone gets fairer treatment as a result.

Giving free copies only to those who really, genuinely deserve it is much, much more acceptable as well. Plus, there will be a lot of Mods which will get ported over by other users who ask for the original Mod creator's permission, as has happened with Fallout 4.

All in all, I think Bethesda should just bite the bullet and stop treating these people with "kid gloves". If anyone is acting "entitled" it's those high and mighty modders that think they should be put on a pedestal for their work and deserve special treatment because of it. The community would be healthier without those people and will naturally recover in due time.

welcome to life.

Doesn't excuse it the action though.

People should unite to fight against all injustice, irrespective of race, beliefs or social standing. That's democracy.

businesses and corporations aren't even close to democracies..

And so we raise our hands collectively in the air and say "Nothing can be done about it!" and wash our hands of the issue.

The community wouldn't be a place at all without all the great modders in the community. If it weren't for the modding community the game would have lost appeal for the most part a long time ago.

May I take a wild guess? You may also be one of those people that say that mod theft is totally fine if the mod author decides not to port one his mods, because "entitlement" is always their argument, too...

If that's not the case, I will stand corrected.

You stand corrected.

The best, long-time modders will not be around forever, and making concessions for just them is no way to help this transition. Bethesda should just get it over and done with. It'll be barren for a couple of years, but if they were banking on having lots of great Modders putting out content for free on all platforms as part of their business plan, then whoever came up with that idea as a safe bet for profit should be fired.

Modding is great, but entirely up to the community. Trying to appease them by halving your profits is just plain dumb.

You might not think so, but modding IS a big part of TES and Fallout games, back since Morrowind. If mods weren't so fundamental console mods wouldn't have been a thing in the first place. I don't know why you condemn modding so much. It's good business for Bethesda and for the users, even if it is, what you consider, "unjust".

That's exactly the reason why the Morrowind modding community have been active for over 10 years and some veteran modders are still active today.

Anyone who still monitor the Morrowind mods forum will be aware of new mods that's released every month.

True about not every PC user is a modder. Wrong, that argument are NOT flawed since modding is a hobby and anyone can mod, if people are interested to create a mod that is. I bet a lot people have once and a while create a mod for their personal use over the years, but decided not to release it to the modding commuity for a reason(s) that other people doesn't know about.

I can't believe what you're saying, is this similar to the hot topic about the paid mod fiasco that Bethesda and Valve launched last year on Steam Workshop. Believe me, there are a lot of threads (use this "Discussion for Workshop Paid Mods" keyword when searching for threads in the Skyrim mods forum due to a broken forum search) on that subject somewhere in the Skyrim mods forum.

You are seriously clueless.

@Leonardo : And I quote :

So, Bethesda "repays" ALL PC users, for those that have made multiple, popular mods that have benefited the community.

So, yes, that argument is flawed, as most users, irrespective of mod creation for personal use, have not made popular mods that extend any game's lifespan.

Also, I'd love some statistics on just how many of these PC users have made these little mods for personal use that you speak of. An actual percentage of all PC gamers preferably.

@Remiros : I don't condemn modding at all, I actively encourage it.

That said, I don't see why any group of people should hold enough power which is tantamount to holding Bethesda to ransom for their services.

Sure, modding is important, but this whole song and dance about the current modders being so important and impervious to criticism needs to stop. Bethesda need to just make those necessary changes now and stop trying to butter them up with gifts and endless praise. There will always be people to replace them, it just may take a couple of years for new talent to develop.

If you can't discuss differing opinions constructively and with respect for all people involved, you're on the wrong forum.


Thread is close to being removed if it continues down the same path.

A product is only worth what people will be willing to pay for it, on the PC that would be about nothing, we already have the fancy graphics, what we also have are games that are set up just to our liking, many of us will have characters and saves that rely on certain mods, mods that may never be made available for newer version, the 64bit is nice but for those not hitting the 32bit memory limit it offers nothing. Bethesda want mods on consoles and for that they need PC gamers to switch, there's not a huge incentive to do so even with the game being free, there would be even less incentive if they asked for money.

Bethesda are a business, they exist purely to make as much money as possible, they obviously see this as the best way to do that, they won't be interested in what's fair and what isn't, only their bottom line. The OP as a consumer has the ultimate power, that's saying no and keeping his money in his pocket, it only takes a little self control.

My actions are irrelevant here. What I choose to do in October will have very little impact. What the majority choose to do will have a major impact and unless the crappy treatment of console users is made into a "big deal", not enough people will know about what is transpiring, and so they'll buy it anyway.

It requires a concerted effort to shout this from the rooftops and let all the world know that this is unacceptable, and then, and only then, will enough people hopefully not buy it for the ridiculous price that they're asking.

If anything, it's BS like this that Jim Sterling should be covering. He's done Mighty No. 9 now, he should bring attention to this and Deus Ex : Mankind Divided next.

But your explanation is right, and without larger YouTube names picking this up and publicising it, it'll never get the reaction it needs to send the right message to Bethesda.

And besides, if those PC users who won't switch over regardless wouldn't accept it for free, why not charge a small amount anyway? Something like $5. Most people won't bat an eyelid at dropping veritable pocket change if they were interested, and it helps balance things out, so console users hopefully get a better deal.

Or even better, set up one of those "pay what you want/what you think it's worth" deals. They'll recoup some money from the PC crowd from that via sheer goodwill.

I haven't bothered to read the 5 pages of you going back and forth with people about what scumbags you think Bethesda are, but it's as simple as this:

Todd Howard said they believed it was the right thing to do to offer the remastered version to the PC community for free as thanks for what the PC modding community has labored for years to do for free. IMO, it was a nice gesture they didn't have to offer, but they did, and his reason makes perfect sense. It's also just plain good business. You get the PC people moved over for free, they port their mods, everyone wins and the longevity of the product is Bethesda's ultimate reward.

So no. It's not unreasonable at all. Plus, PC players must own the vanilla game + all 3 DLCs before they get Skyrim SE for free. So not ALL of the PC community will get it that way.

Given it's price in the numerous sales online, yeah, it's not going to have cost the majority of PC gamers much at all.

Also, as a remaster, they simply shouldn't be charging $60/￡40 regardless. Look at other remasters, then look at this. It's not common for a remaster to cost this much unless it's a bundle of more than one remastered game, and even then, some companies know better than to charge that much.

They're taking a bit of a gamble with people being willing to pay this much due to it being "The Elder Scrolls", but I know lots of my console friends who have no intention of buying it on release as it's overpriced.

Oh, and Todd Howard isn't infallible. Just because he said it, doesn't make it right or "more acceptable".

You seem to underestimate the fact that many PC players have bought things like the collector's edition (I did, and most everyone I know did too) or bought the game during the first 2 weeks after launch. CE cost $150, full launch price was $60. Then many of us picked up the DLCs at full price at their launches too.

There could be an argument to make about the price if ALL you were getting was just a remastered game with better graphics. That's not the case though. They're doing a platform shift to a 64bit/DX11 engine. They're adding mod support for consoles. They're going to some pretty huge expense to provide all of that to you for simply the cost of a copy of the game. They didn't even have to do any of this at all, but they have.

So wait for a sale. Get it for $30 then. Or $20. The same thing is going to happen with PC copies on Steam. Eventually SSE will show up their on sale for $15 just like Legendary Edition does now.

Well I'm sorry, but his explanation for why PC users will get it for free is perfectly right, and more than acceptable. You not liking it does not make him a bad person for doing it.

Not many in comparison to the rest of the entirety of the gaming population who bought TES V, and all of those Collectors Editions that sold on consoles too.