At most let it be 30 bucks!

Bethesda doesn't police mods. Anyone who uses mods with their games does so at their own risk.

There is no way they would be able to police every mod that came out. Some just change colors, some textures, some add whole new areas and quests. One of the main issues about mods and the different platforms was the "who is responsible" idea; Sony and Microsoft want a lot more control over the content for their platforms. For the pc, its the user's discretion. You want a nvde mod, torture mod, fetish mod, Michael Jackson with children mod, or whatever, that is your lookout. For the consoles, not so much. Not only the content, but malicious stuff like a mod that does something small at first, then starts spawning copies of npcs until the game crashes and corrupts the save. Who is going to be responsible for spending the time and money needed to make sure the content is safe? Not Bethesda; they would never be able to hire the manpower needed for something like that. Sony? Microsoft? I don't believe either one would, not for "free" product, at least.

I know that they don't police mods uploaded to Bethesda.net and I didn't mean it in that way. Everyone should be allowed to upload whatever they want as long as it is their property. There's no need to censor mods if they are not harmful. What I mean is that they should take copyright infringements more seriously. Having to file a DMCA takedown request seems more trouble than it's worth for a simple mod, not to mention that Bethesda.net in general is anything but ideal in its current state. Even if a stolen mod gets taken down afterwards, it might just pop up again after a few days, uploaded by a different person. Some people may think that mod authors are overreacting, but it is still theft and should be taken seriously. I can see how frustrating it must be for some Fallout 4 mod authors right now and I hope the same doesn't happen to Skyrim.

Ofcourse they could. But you need to take into account that most indications, given by the console community was that they wanted mods on their platforms. At first they were talking about mod assortments and the likes and when next-gen (current-gen by now) was established, people were now expecting unrestricted mod support.

Bethesda knew this. Had they announced SkyrimSE without mod support they would've been driven out of town on a rail, to say the least. Now, it's not totally unrestricted, but even under MS/Sony's filtering policies (which I've only heard of) it's infinitely more than a bone like a "mod assortment"... You people are not dogs.

Coming to the PC community and the sole mods source (for obvious reasons) it has been there already. We remastered our game, years ago. They can't sell us the thing, but they can give us the platform to port the work that has been done so far -we'll do it for ourselves anyway.

Under this, I don't think people would have a problem making their work available on consoles -we don't hate you people, to begin with...

*well... maybe except https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-9vsIR9t7E. If he didn't mean what he was doing in front of the camera, he was damn convincing

Thanks bud.


I'm sorry you were led to believe that consoles would have the same modding capabilities as PCs. For a variety of reasons (SKSE, Skyproc patchers, xEdit, bashed patches, file size, Microsoft and Sony policy on advlt mods, etc. etc.), consoles have nowhere near the modding capacity of a PC.


It certainly wasn't me leading you to believe console mods would be more than they are. I was on here the day SSE was announced pointing out the limitations of console mods, like the SKSE limitation.


Still though, there will be an aweful lot console mods will be capable of. Mod authors have a lot of control over how big their file size is by their choice of what assets to use. Compared to no mods, console mods have the potential to be a pretty big deal.

Nobody has "threatened to withdraw" anything. People have pointed out diminished enthusiasm. Remember, it takes time and effort to convert a mod to console format and upload as a console mod. It takes a lot more time and effort to specifically design a mod for console, paying attention to issues such as the need for SKSE, dynamic patchers, file size, remembering to clean the mod (always good practice but especially important for console mods since console users can't clean it themselves). Then once uploaded it takes a lot of time and effort to respond to questions and comments from users that will inevitably accrue.


None of this work has even been done yet. So there has been no "threat" to "withdraw" anything. There was merely a statement that threads like these dampen the enthusiasm to spend a great many of your leisure hours working on something for someone else that might not be appreciated anyway, when you could be doing something else with your time instead.


Modding has always been a voluntary community. We many people who use mods have always been grateful to those few who make them.


I've only recently started making mods myself. Before that I was a mod user, and before that I was solely a console player. There has never been a better time to be a console player. Back in my day (2009-2013) we had no hope of mods of any kind on consoles. Now, it looks like consoles will have a great many mods available that can change the game in a wide variety of new and exciting ways. Yet, this thread has devolved into complaining that consoles won't have the full modding capability of a PC.

Well, that's one of the many elephants in the room, isn't it? Mod support on consoles isn't all it was cracked up to be, and Talaran really helped expand on that.

So many restrictions and further double standards from Sony/MS regarding nvde mods (seriously, I know a guy that went through The Witcher 3 and just recorded all of the six scenes with Game DVR, then uploaded it all to their very public Activity Feed, and that is 100% A-Okay with Microsoft, yet nvde mods aren't). Speaking of nvde mods, once again, I really don't care to be honest. It's just the glaring double standard that irritates me.

As I've said to other people, I like the idea of mashing up my games. Other than that, I'm only really interested in patches and mostly cosmetics tweaks. I'm happy enough with Bethesda's games as they are for the most part. It was pretty funny when the Contraptions Workshop released of FO4 too, as all of those Display and Mannequins Mods disappeared almost overnight.

To bring it all back to an earlier point I made too, we cannot miss that which we (console gamers) have never had. Consoles never had Mods previously, and to be perfectly honest, FO4 Mods on the Xbox One seem to be getting a mixed reaction of "That seems cool/interesting, but nothing amazing/essential.". Very much like a bonus to the base game, which is what it is. People shouldn't be being sold these games under the premise of "Amazing Mods Within!", and the standard Bethesda game therein is not only enough to sell the game, but is pretty much what we're there for.

So, when it comes down to pricing, it looks like a standard remaster which is being resold to us for an inflated price with the fabled "Mod support" (that has been kinda "meh" in Fallout 4) and that's just not all that convincing. Plus, PC users get it for free.

It's nothing personal, it just looks like a raw deal to me and many others.

Halve the price, then it'll be more reasonable, but for $60/￡40? Yeah, Bethesda are laughing at console gamers for that price.

I never expected console mods to provide the absolute FULL range of ALL pc available mods.....I am not unrealistic. However that is a world away from what appears to be on the table now.


I have already quoted examples of file sizes from your 'main', mod site and its pretty clear that a few biggish ones and a handful of minor ones will soon have a PS4 straining its partition. XB1 gets double that....but so what!


These consoles have generous HDDs especially if like me you only expect to fit TES on it! Yet they are configured such that less than 1% of the disk space can hold mods.


Add to that the whole SKSE (and similar) issues and I feel we are somehow being shortchanged. Beth should have been upfront about all of this instead of just hailing the greatness of it all, and telling us that it warrants full game price due to 'mod support'.


Now maybe the new "next gen" consoles (probably in R&D now)....or ones just after that will provide the capability supposedly offered hmmm? (In time for TES6 mods)


Look.....its like this.....


Its like....going to a car dealership and putting your name down on the latest model with all the bells and whistles and the big turbo engine. You get told its more cash than expected....but hell....its got to be worth it right? In fact this car is so good that the dealers are being given a free car as an incentive to get even more customers to enjoy the great experience when the first models get transportered in.


You want it so bad that you are even going to splash out on a new bigger car port built at home ready for the big day it arrives.....

Only then, you suddenly find out that the great version in the sales brochure is not what will be arriving....and although the cost is the same you can forget most of the top range features and the engine is gonna be the gutless 'Eco' version.

How do you feel about your much looked forward to purchase now ? Still happy? I bet um' no!


You raise a complaint with the sales team in the dealership and get told.....think yourself lucky a new car is being launched at all and if you don't like whats now on offer...theres the door...sir.


His would you feel?

Exactly.....you'd scowl....hop on your bike and look for a different make of car from a different dealership!


OR.....would you say to the car dealer....oh that's ok.....I don't mind really.....at least its the right colour....ho hum!

Yeah..right!


I said it before...for me its not about the money. Its about the capability. I am already prepared to spend the 300 bucks on a new console in October.....but don't tell me the game price is justified due to "mod support". Its not even as if the mod creators will even see any of it for their work.

The whole darn thing is a farce.

I am not happy and the more people here that tell me I have no right to feel unhappy...the less happy I feel.

Well, you are, There's no particular justice to it.

Business wise, it makes sense, They want PC users to adopt the new game so that PC modders will convert mods that will then end up on bethesda.net.

Except they seem to think (quite rightly I suspect) that most of us wouldn't bother since we can already mod our games to get what the remaster offers. So they give it away free to the PC crowd because they want the mods more than they want the relatively small revenue they'd get from selling it on a PC.

None of which makes it any fairer, but I'll bet that's the thinking behind it.

Rick, as far as consoles go and to be honest as always, when I saw the announcement video, my first thought was: what happens with mods than require SKSE? Obviously I wasn't thinking about the PC side.

I can only assume that Skyrim 360/PS3 launches directly. Under the hood, where lies a different story, it should be more than just possible to handoff Skyrim SE's launch command to SKSE, IF MS & Sony gave the green light on this. But that's a big IF.

Rick, you are severely under estimating what can be done with 2GB.. entire gameplay overhaul mods (which essentially turn it into an entirely different game gameplay wise) don't even take up that much space

since Skyrim was first announced back in 2010, these forums were bombarded daily with "why can't us console goers get mods", right up until the SE was announced..

As, I explained twice now, those mods you cited could be rewritten using vanilla assets to reduce file size and they would function the same. They just wouldn't look quite the same, but would still look great in the new engine, with the new high def textures Bethesda is promising for SSE. There are versions of JK Skyrim that have new assets and a large file size but the version I use is a very small file size and only uses vanilla assets. You seem to be missing that point entirely.


Also, as funnybunny says, even with the existing mods written for PC, you can do a lot with 2GB. You are severely underestimating what can be done with console mods with a 2GB size limit.


Besides, the console file size limitation is imposed by Sony/Microsoft not Bethesda. Bethesda is negotiating with Sony to increase it.


As Atkara mentioned, there have been threads popping up here almost weekly by console players begging for a remaster with mods and saying that console players would gladly pay for it and there was a huge market for it, and the PC players were largely saying a remaster was not needed because of mods. Given the feedback Bethesda has gotten over the past few years about who was willing to pay for a remaster and who didn't really want one, it's no wonder Beth is charging console players but not PC players, given that the promise of mods on console can't happen unless a significant number of PC players switch to the new engine.


And now that Bethesda gave the console players exactly what they were asking for, we have threads started by console players complaining that they have to pay for it while PC players get it for free. It's like that old saying, you can please some of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time.

yeah, you can have a mod that gives you a large castle to live in, or even add an entirely new city for just a few hundred kb.. a mb or 2 at most..

I just slogged through this entire thread, start to finish, and I have to say that your basic premise quoted above doesn't hold water. I see words like "console users" thrown about in defense of your stance but the context of that is way off.

- PC users who already bought the 32-bit game + DLC get it for free, because the SE contains little to almost none added value over what they already have.

The ONLY notable thing new is 64-bit, which is not required to run on PC, and by itself is not that big of a deal unless you're a PC benchmark numbers nerd. Most people won't notice much of a difference at all and Bethesda knows this.

- Contrary to what you might think, there has never been a single Skyrim sale for a PS4 or XB1 system prior to the SE. This is a new release to those platforms. You don't get to claim "console user" like a blanket term when the game's only just now being released for the first time ever on those two platforms. Nobody does cross-platform development for free. It's sold at full price because it's a completely new market on a completely different device.

Next-gen consoles get to pay for Bethesdas dev work on this because Sony and M$ didn't make their new consoles 32-bit backward compatible, and also because next-gen consoles are the almost exclusive reason this SE even exists.

I didn't explain myself properly. I wasn't accusing Bethesda of not allowing nvde mods, so much as I was blaming MS/Sony, so I agree with you. That said, Bethesda cannot and do not officially condone nvde mods as they have to be uploaded on bethesda.net, and that's just not gonna happen. Ever.

Speaking of patches and cosmetics, it'll take a long time for console gamers to get to grips with modding (probably several years), and the disabling of Achievements/Trophies is something that seriously needs changing. If Achievements are as pointless as people say they are, then why not let them be unlocked via modding. It's not like Bethesda RPGs Achievements are ever difficult anyway, so much as time consuming.

Those threads and people asking for Mods on consoles were like Rick. here. They thought they were getting better and more expansive modding than they really are. That was what they wanted, and currently, it feels like a bit of letdown due to the implementation of modding on consoles (and the restrictions).

And yeah, I know it'll drop in price. They're really putting all of the burden for profits on the console market, and looking at current popularity of preorders, even Batman : Arkham Knight GOTY Edition is beating it (that's out at the end of the month, I think).

@DocClox : If only you were around as the thread started. Maybe it wouldn't have gone a bit off-the-rails for the first couple of pages.

Pretty sure that's something you would need to take up with Sony and Microsoft. I don't think Bethesda has anything to do with disabling achievements on modded games. You are not going to get opposition from anyone here on that issue I don't think. I certainly don't have any problem with enabling achievements on modded games.


DoxClox is saying the same thing many of us have been saying since this thread started.

I already said its not about the cash for me.....and.....because the day will dawn eventually....I accept that we will have to pay M$ for mods....that's what all this is about in the end as far as the corporations are concerned. We are being manoeuvred into position is all.

And..don't think the paid mods for pc users has gone for good either.


As for rewriting mods using vanilla assets.....whats the point of mods then. Like maybe we can download new stand alone houses, but they all have to look like Anise's shack? Or Faendal's place?


As for the really immersive stuff like Cold and Wet...Frostfall, and the naughty stuff (banned by M$) and the snow falling through roofs, RND, repositioners etc. Well thats all just out of the question at least for the medium term.


CK? Pah! Not a hope.....


I don't think there is anything new to add to the compost until at the very least we get restrictions raised on both the hardware storage limitations and the software permissions.....especially by the Paranoid console makers. Give me SKSE enabled play with immersive mods and the CK and I will pay 160 bucks for the game disk. Nothing is impossible, especially if Bethesda actually commissioned the work to be done! They would get their money back.


Right I'm off before I get an 'off topic' flag......

I don't think you understand what can be done with vanilla assets. A house consists of hundreds (maybe thousands if you count all the clutter) of individual assets. You can build a new house that looks completely different using the same assets. It's all in how you build it.


Wet and Cold, RND and other "needs" mods and stuff like that require scripting. That's a different issue from file size. SKSE is not going to be allowed on consoles but if console modding becomes a thing, clever modders might find a way to deliver similar mods without SKSE. Some of the functions of those mods might be doable without SKSE by a clever scripter. The more PC players start using the new engine the more likely it will be that someone will.

yeah, pretty sure thats on micros/sonys side of things.. same reason any games with cheats will disable achievements the second you input them

not at all, you would be surprised at what could be done with just vanilla assets.. there was this one castle mod I played on Oblivion, only used default assets, had a large sewer system, a cave full of lava tunnels, a fully functional bathtub, swimming pool, working drawbridge and portcullis, constant secret passages, plenty of unique loot to be found, a wizards tower with auto-alchemy sorter, and so much more.. (I believe it was an early version of Glenvar castle.. a later version he added a few retextured pieces of armor, but the early versions were all vanilla, and amazing)


a good chunk of the assets in Beth games are highly modular, allowing you to mix them in unique ways that look absolutely nothing like anything you'd find in vanilla if you put in the effort..

I don't know how mods are installed on console FO4, which I'm using as an example, in the absence of SkyrimSE. I can only assume it's a foolproof way that doesn't affect the game's installation, along the lines of Mod Organizer's virtual folder and NMM's virtual install. Getting that out of the way, the only thing any player on either console platform has to get the hang of, is what he wants from his gaming experience. This will take a while, assuming he's still playing the same game.

As far as achievements go, they serve as some sort of a carrot "you have to chase because it's there". That's their whole point. If achievements made the gamer, I suppose Jonathan Fatal1ty Wendel (to pick someone close to my generation) is a nobody -while in reality, he's part of the group of people who established eSports

I read a number of these threads and these people were not like Rick. They were more like what I perceive as the average console player and they wanted mod support. On one hand, it's good that console game modding is starting in a restricted fashion, to let people get used to the whole thing -less problems that way. On the other, people with more specific expectations, will feel somewhat disappointed, in their own right. I suppose it may go full throttle at some point, but this is all -obviously- chit-chat.

It's all part of the greater discussion and thus, entirely relevant. The conversation is about the value of the SSE, to both PC and console gamers. Achievements are part of that conversation, irrespective of whoever has the authority to implement changes to that system.

Note : Not all games with in-game cheats/unlockables disable Achievements. I know I've played some where I could essentially use cheats and get Achievements, but I've played so many games, I cannot remember which ones at all.

Achievements are an integral feature and it's uncertain ground regarding modded saves due to the precedent it might set. On the one hand, it allows for greater freedoms when playing. On the other hand, it devalues the point of Achievements. Personally, Achievements are starting to wear thin as a concept to many people, even veteran Achievement hunters like myself. Many people would be happy to see them disappear altogether, so perhaps it's about time Microsoft reassessed the way it views the Achievements system.

Of course, they won't, because you know how they won't do anything until they HAVE to do it, and any kind of movement from a behemoth like MS is slower than your standard Ent 4km race.

Ok....I get that now....the asset isn't the house.....its a resizable "copy and paste" wall or window or patch of roof tiles etc....building blocks...understood. Thanks.





Yeah.....there's nothing average about me buddy

Nothing average at all. You're an educated nutcase and you smoke something between Longbottom Leaf and... what was the other thing you was mixing it with?

"Educated nutcase"......sounds about right, but I prefer...."Brillant eccentric"

That works too