Skyrim is so Lord of the Rings : V - Skyrim

» Sun Sep 04, 2011 11:21 pm

http://shamusyoung.mu.nu/images/edoras.jpg

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcShYwXmJU_YQj69KytdXJxYnAVvOdJfxGX1XbyEvGJmOAVEO0m-

Hmmm

Not THAT similar but makes me think...

» Sun Sep 04, 2011 11:44 pm

Lewis did not make fairytales. He wrote one series of children's books, that's it. Not only is his other stuff much higher quality, they are not remotely "fairytales".

I was referring to their mainstream successes, which is what defines a genre.

Tolkein was the only one from that era to make advlt fantasy as mainstream as it is today.

http://shamusyoung.m...ages/edoras.jpg

http://t2.gstatic.co...byEvGJmOAVEO0m-

Hmmm

Not THAT similar but makes me think..

Not as much as Oblivion imo
TES:
http://media.giantbomb.com/uploads/1/15399/738046-imperial_city_large.jpg
LotR:
http://images.wikia.com/lotr/images/e/e4/Minas_Tirith.jpg

» Sun Sep 04, 2011 9:54 pm

I'd say Whiterun is way more similar to Eldoran than the Imperial City is to Minas Tirith.

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 7:22 am

I'd say Whiterun is way more similar to Eldoran than the Imperial City is to Minas Tirith.

In look certainly, but Imperial City and Minas Tirith are both far more original concepts.

Theres not a whole lot of variation you can put on a hill fort, as opposed to a capitol city.

TES
http://images.uesp.net/thumb/9/9b/MW-place-Dagoth_Ur.jpg/800px-MW-place-Dagoth_Ur.jpg
Lotr
http://images.wikia.com/lotr/images/6/6a/Mordor.png :whistling:

They are all pretty subtle similarities

» Sun Sep 04, 2011 9:59 pm

Mac and others have written about Orks from being "monsters in folk lore" to almost their contemporary look and character. while Tolkien invented his own Orcs, he didnt create them.

"Created them in that image". That image being elves that were turned into orcs by whatever misdeed. You're arguing a point he isn't even trying to make, and agreeing with the point he did.

I'm baffled.

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 8:31 am

"Created them in that image". That image being elves that were turned into orcs by whatever misdeed. You're arguing a point he isn't even trying to make, and agreeing with the point he did.

I'm baffled.

I think he's trying to say that Tolkein took the traditional goblins/trolls/boogiemen concept (creatures in the night, kidnapping children and the like) and then fleshed out the lore for them.
The purpose they served in the hobbit wasn't that original, but the lore was.

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 12:43 pm

I think he's trying to say that Tolkein took the traditional goblins/trolls/boogiemen concept (creatures in the night, kidnapping children and the like) and then fleshed out the lore for them.
The purpose they served in the hobbit wasn't that original, but the lore was.

Exactly. That Tolkien took the concept of Orc, changed it in his own way to elves that were cursed in some fashion, and that idea has been carried on to multitudes of fantasy, The Elder Scrolls included. He definitely didn't invent the orc in and of itself. I think we can agree on that. Just found the premise of the argument rather strange.

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 1:50 pm

In look certainly, but Imperial City and Minas Tirith are both far more original concepts.

Theres not a whole lot of variation you can put on a hill fort, as opposed to a capitol city.

TES
http://images.uesp.net/thumb/9/9b/MW-place-Dagoth_Ur.jpg/800px-MW-place-Dagoth_Ur.jpg
Lotr
http://images.wikia.com/lotr/images/6/6a/Mordor.png :whistling:

They are all pretty subtle similarities

Subtle?
Hardly.
And not even that much of a similarity, unless you consider things like "both have trees" to be marks of similarity.
Lava, volcanoes, etc. are VERY commonly associated with the villain's lair.

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 1:37 am

Subtle?
Hardly.
And not even that much of a similarity, unless you consider things like "both have trees" to be marks of similarity.
Lava, volcanoes, etc. are VERY commonly associated with the villain's lair.

That last one was more of a joke.

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 12:59 am

I don't know anything about George Macdonald, but you're correct that Tolkien is attributed with the creation of the common modern concept of orcs.
The word has roots in old english and has been present in fairy tales since as long ago as Beowulf, but Tolkien gave the term its current connotations and association with that specific sort of creature.

Thanks for bringing up Beowulf. Classic. In oh so many ways : )

Just in case some of you haven't heard, there really is nothing new under the sun (or, because there is the occasional original thought, not very much new under the sun : ). Not a put down. But really, not sure what the discussion is about? Oh yeah, everyone is worried about "copying" and/or "plagiarism' nowadays. What a joke. We're all lawyers now?

That said, I thoroughly enjoyed (and go through the book series every few years) Tolkien. He put his own spin on timeless ideas. Great author. Neat story/plot/characters. I also enjoyed the movies. Looking forward to the Hobbit movie duo.

(edit spelling, punctuation, etc.)

Tarl

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 9:19 am

Just in case some of you haven't heard, there really is nothing new under the sun (or, because there is the occasional original thought, not much new under the sun : ). Not a put down, but really, not sure what the discussion is about, oh yeah, everyone is worried about "copying" and/or "plagiarism' nowadays. What a joke.

I actually don't see a problem with that, the greatest story teller of all time might not be able to come up with lore for nuts, so they should be able to borrow concepts from other books to serve his story (obviously not justa straight rip-off)

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 2:45 am

Tolkien gets a lot less credit than he deserves. Long live LOTR. Long live Bethesda!

Agree.

While the Elder Scroll universe is indeed unique, it and many other popular fantasy games, movies, stories have roots in JRR Tolkien's works!!!

» Sun Sep 04, 2011 10:33 pm

That last one was more of a joke.

I guess I don't have much of a sense of a humor, my apologies.

» Sun Sep 04, 2011 10:16 pm

"Created them in that image". That image being elves that were turned into orcs by whatever misdeed. You're arguing a point he isn't even trying to make, and agreeing with the point he did.

I'm baffled.

Mac wrote about Orks that were once goblin, a very similer concept. plus I was pointing out that one aspect of the huge realm that is Tolkien Elves, (Especially since there is varying theories by Tolk himself on the origin of Middle Earth Orcs) isn't just that they once may have came from elves. Not to mention Tolks descriptions in book that are nothing like ES Orcs.

Are there similarities and borrowed inspiration? Yes, but lore wise and even game wise, ES tries to differ itself from LoTR.

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 6:42 am

Skyrim isn't more LotR than all the other fantasy games out there.

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 12:31 pm

Well we have Bar Brawls or Singing Nords and we can pretend to be a Ranger of the North

We have a Lava Mountain, so Mordor can be Modded in

We can even make the Dragons look like Nasguls :hubbahubba:

If Todd can make a 7000 Step Mountain, then we can have a Dwarf Mine with a Deep Pit where Gandalf fell into darkness. :teehee:

We can even have those Walking Trees in the Forests of Fangor :blush:

We have Mammoths, we just Mod them to look like Olifants :thumbsup:

I suppose Ogres are back or Cave Troll. :smile:

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:00 am

Ive never watched a Lord Of The Rings movie..... :[

Am I missing out? Or is it the same as Harry Potter?

» Sun Sep 04, 2011 11:45 pm

I think the OP was just saying that he thinks playing Skyrim will be like being in the movies of LOTR, not that TES is heavily influenced by Tolkein.

@KInotsu -- Me neither. The dialog and characters changed too much from the books. Every time I see five minutes of it on TV it makes me so annoyed I change the channel.

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 12:16 am

Thank you Mujokan, its true they changed Allot from the Books, even i started reading them, but the Moves are still Awsome :tops:

@ Kinotsu: LOTR has Nothing to do with Harry Potter, LOTR Crush Harry 10 times over, go watch the Extended Movies, they are Awsome. :ahhh:

» Sun Sep 04, 2011 10:20 pm

Todd has said it NUMEROUS times, that one of the main great inspirations of TES, is the Lord of the Rings series.

That's mostly for Oblivion though...

Sure the races are Tolkien inspired, as pretty much all fantasy games are in some way, but I don't see anything LOTR-like about Morrowind.

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 12:21 am

@Daventry

I know the books just about off by heart... I have thought a lot about the story too. It is just my problem, not that I think the movies are bad.

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 12:48 am

Does it even matter if it was or wasn't inspired by Tolkien? If so, great! there are some fantastic concepts. I'm sure all of his ideas weren't completely original and they were derived from previous concepts. Either way, as long as they're not basing the game off of a failed concept, then all is good

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 11:55 am

I would be so cool to fight in huge armies like on LOTR.

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:27 am

Oh I don't disagree, I too think the Tolkien horse is dead and has been well and truly beaten.

I hope you only refer to the copying of Tolkien concepts by other fantasy writers, especially concerning games. There is not any game out there yet that does Tolkien's books even remotely justice. All of them just used the LotR license as a money-maker, they make a generic fantasy game and slap the LotR theme on it and it sells. The lore means nothing to them. And yes, that includes LotRO, with their stupid ridable WoW Giant Goats and Runekeeper (mage class) that have no place at all in Tolkien's universe, and their general WoW-ish game concept.

Besides, Tolkien's true masterwork is the Silmarillion, with all the stories from the First and Second Age. Those haven't been touched by anyone yet, since Christopher Tolkien will not allow anyone for as long as legally possible. The 'Tolkien horse' is far from dead, the cheap rip offs and parasites are dead.

» Mon Sep 05, 2011 8:31 am

Oblivion was fellowship

Skyrim is two towers