Conan existed before Lord of the Rings, and even before the Hobbit. Norse mythology is even older than that.

Mithril is the only clear borrow. Orcs are debateable.

Haven't the developers already said they are big LOTR fans?

And this is really obvious;
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/11/august/skyprev4.jpg
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100325163860/lotr/images/thumb/2/2e/Edoras.jpg/830px-Edoras.jpg

I disagree. There are a few similarities but those are also seen in virtually all fantasy related...things

Despite there being companions in Skyrim and not in Oblivion

http://image.shutterstock.com/display_pic_with_logo/6575/6575,1143736227,1/stock-photo-dunadd-hill-fort-argyll-scotland-seat-of-the-ancient-irish-scottish-kings-of-dalriada-1142324.jpg
Scotland would like a word with you

Double post fail

Obviously TES is influenced by LOTR, but I actually like the lore Of TES better than LOTR.
Just my opinion.

Episode ?

No wonder you think it svcks Try "book" instead, it's much better.

I don't think any rpg could go very wrong by using Tolkien as an influence and it is almost impossible imo but TES definitely goes its own way on many fronts; some of which I like and others less so. Beast races and the depiction of Elves as examples. Tolkien himself was very much influenced by the old Germanic/Norse sagas. Nothing wrong with that since they are great and timeless epics.

Tolkien, Lewis and other famous fantasy writers have made grand books, there is no doubt. But what Tolkien did for the genre was outstanding, same as others. I'm not saying that other books haven't had as much influence on teh genre, but every contribution has changed it. LoTR is an outstanding piece of literary art. The world Tolkien created was and still is unmatched. The tales he created are still one of the most famous in the world. His Middle-Earth is so vast in culture, hitory, and myth, that even people who have read LoTR may only know a fraction of it.

I'm not saying that it's the sole influence, but almost every modern fantasy game, book, or movie has been inspired in some way by Tolkien's work.

He popularised it, but he wasn't the first.

It's simple, without tolkien, we wouldnt have Orcs, dwarves, elves and hobbits in our popular culture. He popularized them even if they existed before. IT's like Dracula. His legend existed long before bram stoker wrote about him, but its only after bram stoker that anybody knew who dracula was. Tolkien is the FATHER of modern fantasy, not the creator. He put numerous sources together and made middle-earth based off of them. He didnt invent much except the elf tongue. But without him, we wouldnt have DnD and all that it inspired, we wouldnt have LOTR movies and all they inspired and we most definitly would not have Elder Scrolls if it wasnt for him. I think this is a good exemple of the butterfly effect.

Also, they would have never made the narnia films if LOTR had not been so popular. Clear exemple of its superiority in fantasy setting.

No it wouldn't be big without Tolkien. Yes it is its own fantasy world but where Tolkien was ridiculously black & white with morality, George Martin has a realistic moral spectrum. Where Tolkien had armies of magic and myth clash, Martin has rare few supernatural beings. Tolkien developed two characters (Sam and Frodo, the rest were barely developed) whereas Game of Thrones has a large cast of well developed characters. Both are great books in their own right but Game of Thrones borrow little and less from Tolkien

orcs

gobliens

elves

dragons

:P hehe every fantasy owes something to LoTR anyways

I'm leaning more towards LOTR. Todd is a big LOTR fans so it really is obvious. I don't get why so many people here try to deny it (not necessarily the pictures, but the Tolkien influence).

t
I want proof.

That's a matter of tastes, not a fact.

If I a have deep respect for the work of Tolkien, the lore he created didn't impress me that much, except for its complexity and its coherence.

I think that says it all. I don't know why people are mixing everything up in here. Orcs, ogres, elves, talking trees, fairies, etc., have existed in many different cultures and not just in Norse or Germanic traditions. J.R.R. Tolkien detailed depiction of this universe is what place this genre into the map. Some say some author did this or that before Tolkien, well, like the saying goes, history is written by the winners not the losers. And Tolkien happens to beat everyone else, including the ancient writings ironically.

I disagree.

First of all, Elder Scrolls manage moral in a black & white form.
Second of all, tolkien didn't managed moral in a black & white form, the all point of the ring its an allegory of what power do to men. There's good, there's evil, and the human are standing as the weakest one's in the middle, fighting for surviving agains't evil, aragorn and faramir trying to resist what theirs family's couldn't, scared of being corrupt. And with this i go to the..
Third point. Tolkien and Martin wanted diferent things. Martin wanted to tell an intricate and real political story, with real characters. Tolkien wanted to create a world loyal to the nordic mythology and write about a story with moral lessons, he has more than a "black and white story" but being him a literature expert, he is full of allegorys and complexity, he also wanted to create a very complex world and culture (Silmarillion) just like almost all real mythology. Neither Martin or Tolkien are better or worse for that, they wanted to tell different things, and both reach their goals as storytellers in a fantastic way that few reach. BUT, as the subject being which one its more similar to skyrim, i would say that tolkien its the answer, the races, the fictional languages, are more tolkien-kind of thing. But if i had the chance to choose freely, i would choose Beowulf kind of world, i mean, there are tolkien influences, but the estetic style i saw in the game was more beuwulf-like imo.
Also, elder scroll have magic in a very different way that all the other books named, tolkien and martin don't have that much magic in their books.


Extra: If i had to choose something from tolkien that i see in elder scrolls, it would be those moments when you meet characters like tom bombadill, talk a few moments with him and then you must go wondering more about him, or when you ride trough a forest and meet unespected friends, or when you enter the ruins of a civilization long gone and found dark creatures that you have awaken...all those feelings of exploration in the unknown, into the ruins of the past, a very complex and rich past, that's the same feeling i get when i played elder scrolls, reading old books, exploring old tragedys from people that lived hundred of years ago.....ahhh such a beautiful and immersive game.


Forgive my english by the way, i wanted to say more and the few i said, better, but english its not my native language so im kind of limited in speechcraft, perhaps i need a magic robe.

It's the other way around, Turbine have a lot to learn from Bethesda. LotRO is not a hardcoe RPG. it was pretty okay the months after launch, but over time everything that could immerse you was stripped down. For example, a few months ago they reduced the agro range of mobs even more than before, I can in front of an on-level Orc only 15 meters away and he'll just ignore me. In addition, the entire map is flooded with mobs every 20 steps. When Moria was released, they abused a part of the lore that says 'no horses could go into Moria' to implement ridable Giant Goats, and to make it even worse they didn't restrict them to Moria. Also, Hobbits can be amazing warriors, equally strong as Elves. I could name a hundred more similar annoyances.

There's nothing hardcoe RPG about LotRO, it's as gamey as can be, everything gets sacrificed for balance, competition and ingame shop income. A typical MMO ala WoW.





I don't agree with the guy you quoted, but the facts you mentioned don't justify your conclusion that Tolkien wasn't black and white about morality. Go read the Silmarillion first. Tolkien's books are quite black & white conerning morality, it's just that Evil can corrupt not inherently evil people. Therefore a lot of character's can't be described as good or evil, but their acts are.

Even if you are correct you must be a fool if you think LOTRO has to learn from Bethesda. And I LOVE Bethesda.

Tolkien didn't set the fantasy world in motion. Tolkien has had a massive influence, but modern fantasy was set in motion by Edgar Allan Poe, Mary Shelly, HP Lovecraft and Robert E Howard (amongst many others). Tolkien is just the person everybody knows about.

Anyway, I don't see what's so Tolkieny about Skyrim.

You can't just say 'it's like LOTR' and not explain why.

As far as modern videogame western fantasy RPGs go , I would argue that the Elder Scrolls series probably owes the least to Tolkien. Although some elements are borrowed, I would argue that Elder Scrolls as a series has the most original lore and aesthetic out of nearly every moden day western videogame rpg.

For example, whils there are 'dwarves' and 'elves' in the Elder Scrolls, in nearly all other western fantasy RPGs the dwarves are actually dwarves, whilst in the Elder Scrolls they are elves.

I think that the Elder Scrolls as a series owes more to Roman, Greek and Nordic mythology as well as their own writers than to LOTR.

Oblivion had a lot more LOTR than Skyrim does. Skyrim is more Conan the Barbarian or Game of Throans.

Apparently a lot of the Developing team has been watching the Game of Thrones (or so it says in one of my gaming magazines), but I agree that the game does remind me more of LOTR then aSoIaF.