If I'm sniping from a distance, I'd rather they run for cover. That would seem like the more realistic thing to do rather than instantly knowing where I'm shooting from and come stupidly charging for me.

This was something I actually really liked in Fallout 3. I remember on a recent playthrough I was looting the back of a truck when two raiders ambushed me from behind. I quickly turned around and popped one of their heads off with a gauss rifle, but having to reload the weapon, the other raider tore me up real good. There was a brief pause while the raider was reloading, that I whipped out the auto axe and just thought to myself "You gonna get it now, boy". As soon as I did that the raider immediately screamed "I don't wanna die!" and ran for the hills while I went after him, revving up my auto axe like a mad man. Met a gruesome and mutilated end that one did.

Still, just a charming moment in FO3's AI that I found hilariously well done.

I think you're underestimating animals quite a bit. A lot of animals coordinate their attacks quite intelligently. Look at wolves, dolphins and chimps for example. They all use group tactics to hunt. Chimps even organize raids on other chimp groups even if they don't really need the loot or territory. And wolf packs are smart enough to only leave one set of tracks whenever they move as a group. And almost all predators know to stay downwind from prey and pick specific targets from groups of prey.
Many animals also do communicate using sound frequencies that humans can't hear, it's not telepathy but it's still inaudible communication. Different species allying for uniform attack is rare though, have to give you that. But with all the mutation going around with rads and the FEV it could be possible for animals to get a boost in intelligence as well increasing the chances of cooperation. And if you look at statistics you can see that yearly a lot of people die from animal attacks in wherever there are wild predators. If humans were that much smarter than animals you'd think we could manage not to get eaten.
Animal AIs in all Bethesda's games are pretty poor and I sure am hoping for some improvements to that in FO4.

I'm not even hoping for good AI. Just half-decent AI. Have enemies take cover if I come running for a frontal assault. Notice dead friends and react accordingly while I am in stealth. Patrol areas intelligently.

Now the best outcome would be a scaled back version of MGS: Vs alert levels and AI. They take cover, flank, coordinate. Their stealth mechanics work well too as they actually react to dead comrades and have several alert phases.

Smart and aggressive hahaha! If they're smart they won't be aggressive in my game

I wonder if that would be possible with mods. One would think it could be managed with something like ai packages. Assuming we could dynamically add them to npcs. For example, if your caught sneaking an area or they find a dead body it causes an alert package to be added to the npcs in that area. That package could mimic MGSV style of alerts (finding a dead body alert vs combat alert).

Just speaking hypothetically since we don't know if such a system is needed, or possible with the new kit.

Nope. Not underestimating animal intelligence at all.

Do not include pack animals. They are very specific and not pertinent to the context of Fallout 3. Radscorpions are not pack animals, nor are Yao Guai, for example. I would not even call mole rats pack animals. Deathclaws are certainly NOT pack animals. Bloatflys? Nope. See my point?

And no, the context of Fallout 3 (post nuclear apocalypse wasteland) does not excuse making AI telepathic and having them do things they simply cannot do. It is glaringly apparent when humans/humanoids behave exactly the same as animals (or vice versa) because the humans/humanoids are not even communicating at all, simply telepathically coordinating efforts, including cooperating with other enemies nearby to draw you into a more dangerous, multifront encounter when the two foes are actually enemies of each other as well as you. It's very stupid and easily avoided from a coding perspective.

An example of having enemies communicate (or having a valid excuse for communication) is NPCs like the BOS with their obvious technology and power armor helmets that would include means of communicating and coordinating efforts. However, my point was that you do not code AI packages for such NPCs and then attach that package to all NPCs because it is extremely apparent what has been done when the behavior of things like animals is exactly the same as humans.

It's also very boring because it makes the encounters exactly the same except for the visuals (i.e., the behavior and any counterstrategy is the same regardless of enemy).

I will say that some people here seem to be playing a different game than mine. Enemies take cover. Enemies flank you (even when they should not - see the above discussion about animal AI). Enemies flush you out of cover with grenades.

Not really sure how people can claim these things are not happening when they obviously are. Maybe there's a difference in play time where those of us who play much longer have seen much more varied AI behavior as far as these specific actions? Whatever the case is, the enemies do the things that people are asking for so such things don't need to be included (i.e., they already are included).

Hehehe, awwweeesssooommmmeee!

they need enemies like in f.e.a.r. that duck and scramble for cover then attack.

The animals in FNV were pretty good, I thought. I really liked how many creatures seemed angered by your presence but not necessarily enough to attack. Smart animals.

My point was that in general animals are capable of smart tactics instead of just rushing straight at you. And as I pointed out, that's not limited to just pack hunters. And taking your example of radscorpions (that actually do often appear in packs in all Fallout games, especially 1&2), I hear they're burrowing to the ground for ambush attacks in FO4. It's a clever tactic that some scorpions use in reality. Good example of Bethesda improving the AI.

Aaand I just now realized you were just talking about FO3 whereas I was considering a broader look about animal AI... Should not reply at 3am.. Yeah FO3 AI was what it was, not arguing with that. But since I already did it myself, I recommend googling "animal cooperation examples" anyways. Cool stuff, ravens guide wolves to prey, coyotes and badgers hunting together, frogs protecting spider eggs for shelter...

True, but beyond that their main tactic was CHAAAARGE! Cazadores did bite your ass too though.

Cazadores were far from standard animals in NV....their aggression and detection capabilities (both range and sensitivity - HIGH perception) far exceeded other animals in the Mohave. Now if those guys actually used pack animal tactics, we'd be in some serious trouble.

With Radiant Story I think it's actually pretty simple to add new AI packages to NPCs without directly editing them or their existing AI... although you'd need to know what you're doing in the first place, and I'm not sure what's involved with NPC AI. But NPCs already react when they see a corpse - they just comment though, they don't go on alert. But that means it's possible to insert an AIPackage that has them react and do something if they detect a corpse (presumably a corpse of an NPC within their faction) - you'd just need to know how to make an "alert" package and tie it into corpse detection.

Yeah I was thinking of that they did something like that, though its been a long time since I played the base game, hard to keep track of what was modded in. So the main issue, with the old system was the stupidity of the reaction? They stumble across the body, and make a halfhearted attempt to find you, then give up shortly?

If we were aiming for a mgsv reaction, we'd just add an alert to all the other npcs, try and get them to search in teams and not give up as easily. All simple in theory. Just sort of toying with the whole idea. Just finished a mgsv binge. I liked how if you went in guns blazing the enemy would all try and find you. It actually gave you a reason to try stealth, instead of just rolling up in your chopper and mowing them down.

edit: Teams could be set up with some sort of follower package, easiest thing I can think of is that guy who follows Mjol around in skyrim like a puppy in riften. Something set up to to tag the guy who calls alert as the leader and the other team members follow. Side note: its fun to think of potential problems in fallout 4 and how to solve them

I don't want Fallout 4 to go so far as to necessitate stealth - we should still be able to build a character that goes in guns blazing and manages to clear a room by way of utter chaos. But having a game that supports stealth and adds more challenge and strategy to it, sure.

Not sure I'd go for anything as complex as having enemies start following each other, but I would definitely have them alert anyone within detection range and have all of those NPCs enter their own search modes - or in some cases set off alarms and put the entire location on alert for extra pressure.

I want an AI with a little variety.

All raiders shouldn't act the same.

Some should be smart and aggressive.

Some should be dumb and aggressive.

Some should be high on psycho or drunk off their ass.

Some should be hung over.

Some shouldn't be aggressive.

Maybe they ran away or take cover and fight defensively.

I think that would make the game a lot more interesting.

Some raiders should have riot shields or metal shields that stop small arms fire so you have to use a certain ammo, explosive, or flank them...if the world went to hell you better believe I would have a metal shield with a slot in it to shoot out of just in case.

I think I read somewhere in the fallout 4 perk chart about companions working together (not sure about this). This could imply that enemies might do the same? I would really like to see enemies that fear for their life (not running up in your face unless they wear armor and melee weapons), but who take cover and use tactics to defeat you. Would also be cool to see them react confused or scared when you attack while sneaking. I know this is unlikely, but it would be fun to attack from the shadows and make them flee in terror

Yeah. I remember years ago (playing F3) thinking it would be interesting for our vault dweller to come upon a raider who's just sitting there being utterly non-threatening. It sort of struck me. I decided I'd shoot him anyway, but like you say, the more behavior variance (within reason), the more interesting the game is.

Imagine if a creature decided to befriend you and tagged along, but attacked everyone else, including good guys. What would you do?

How does one aquire said weapon in Fallout 3? I've never seen it

The pit dlc. You honestly cant miss if it you play through the game. You can get a named version of it by collecting a certain number of iron ingots and turning them in.

Ambushes. I sure hope we all experience at least 10 unexpected enemy traps in different places, a building, a cave, a park where we think we are being sneaky but then we start getting lit up from behind from Raiders/Mercs/Mutants. That said, not all the time just will be nice to get surprised once in a while.