I've recently come to the realization that it's not the power smithing affords that bothers me, it's that it completely removes the sense of accomplishment in the game. When you're wandering through the world, and you find an elven sword for the first time, it's pretty badass. On the other hand, when you find your first elven sword, except you've had an epic elven sword for 5 levels already, there's just no wonder there. It seems to me that by increasing the crafting options, it dramatically reduces one of the main reasons people would play the game, hunting down rare items.

This is exacerbated by other stuff, too; for example, just by joining the companions you are given a skyforge steel sword? No effort required? That eliminates 3/4ths of the game, right there. And what about daedric artifacts? Without smithing, they're awesome; with smithing, they're almost immediately made useless.

The worst part, to me, is how easy it is to make and/or upgrade items. It could take me a whole dungeon and a boss kill to get an elven sword, or instead i could spend 500 gold and make the same sword, except better. And if I find an awesome weapon, upgrading it is either A: as simple as buying the ingot from the smith, or B: just head into a mine somewhere. B isn't QUITE so bad, at least there is some effort involved, but when I just buy the ingots, it ends up feeling like i've cheated.

Yeah, yeah, I know I can just not do it, but it breaks my immersion, y'know? I'm looking through the lists and I'm like "Oh, i could buy 30 steel ingots right now...or I could go find iron ore and corrundum and make my own. Hmm.

Honestly, I'd much rather have upgrades be based on items used, rather than skill. For example, a steel ingot could upgrade your weapon to "Fine", but a Daedra Heart could upgrade it to "Legendary". You could still have it be based on skill, but at least then it would take a little bit of effort, y'know?

I don't even know for making the weapons yourself. There must be a better way than the current system, though. Get one perk and you can make every type of weapon and armor? Not to mention Dwarven, which in prior TES games were Imperial contraband because they were such advanced technology and were impossible to re-make, while in Skyrim anyone can make them from a chunk of dwemer metal and a pile of scraps...

Yeah, which is why I only use what I find now after my first game started feeling a bit pointless.

Still, each to their own, there are people who like it like this. Personally I ignore smithing apart from making jewelry to enchant and sell because that is what I choose to do.

Upgrading seems to be a bit off though, I made a pair of glass daggers once for a companion and they had 27 damage, when I upgraded them they had 80 damage which seems to be way over the top in my opinion. That was without any kind of buffs via potions or enchantment.

If you can't keep yourself from going outside your character's role, and you perform actions that will make your character powerful, it's nobody's fault but your own if you do them. If it takes the epicness from the game to use Smithing, don't use it.

Smithing isn't required, and it's damned easy to keep yourself from using it. How does it break immersion not to? "Oh, my guy is a soldier. It doesn't make sense for him not to be the greatest smith in Skyrim."

I personally think it breaks immersion if I am a smith, which is why the only character I have that actually uses Smithing has a damned good reason for it. I've done just fine on a warrior character, and had tons of epic scenarios, without using Smithing. You can, too. Hell, my thief obtained two ebony swords at level 30 or so, when he took down a Forsworn Briarheart in toe-to-toe combat, which was [censored] hard as holy [censored] but totally worth it.

In short, just don't use Smithing if you don't like it. I like it, and I don't use it. Because I can exercise self-control, and follow a set path I made for my character's skills. So can you, if you take the effort to.

basiaclly don't use crafting if you want good progression and/or difficulty, yeah a crap solution until CK.

I don't mind the current system, but I do agree with you that you should not be able to make things like Elven and Dwarven equipment. (They're also way too common, but that's for another thread. And random bandits and hordes should not be wearing good equipment. That's for another thread too ...) It just cheapens those items.

I don’t like smiting either and find the underpowered artifacts a major letdown, but to each his own and I try not to let it bother me.

AGREED. Currently im playing a dagger/shield light armor user on master. I switch between stealth ( onl1 1/5 for the first perk right now lv 60) and I have heavy alchemy and no enchanting. 2 perks in smithing to improve found magic items and artifacts. Still wearing the regular thieves guild armor with a glass helmet. Dragon scale can't be bought so if I want it It will be insane to find, especially enchanted with what I want.

Even at lv 40 I still get destroyed by several enemies. Now it seems like self gimping, but this is a character I wanted to play from the beginning, before I knew any gameplay mechanics. Having to dungeon crawl to find epic items is very satisfying.

The thing was, there was no reason for my character NOT to be a smith. I don't honestly care if my character is brokenly powerful or not, i like meddling around more than fighting really. But in Oblivion, there were times when i found items and actually got extremely excited over normal things. Like this one time, I was playing as an argonian and exploring a water-filled cave at low levels, and i actually found a daedric two-handed sword in a chest...except it was guarded by a horde of high level slaughterfish. I spent 3 hours figuring out a way to get that bloody sword, and I enjoyed every second of the days i spent killing things with it, because I KNEW i had earned it.

In skyrim, it feels like there's just no point. I can craft a hundred of something and buy the ingots and make the stupid thing myself, and if it's too hard to get, I just won't even bother. This time around, I've been playing without smithing, and it does make it better, I admit...but it bugs me because smithing itself isn't a bad idea! In fact, it's a wonderful idea, i was extremely excited when i heard about it at first. I just feel that it was implemented badly, in that it's far too easy to get items that would otherwise be very difficult to obtain.

Dunno.

I love the smithing and enchanting, I feel like I'm creating a life long companion. I've had my deadric sword "Blade of Akron" for as long as I can remember. :yes:

See, this is exactly why Smithing is a wonderful concept. Making your own weapon makes it that much more personal, if done properly. But for me, making a daedric sword was pretty much, "Go to the general store, buy a daedra heart, go to the smith, buy 3 ebony ingots, make sword, woooo." The potential personality of it doesn't seem to be there, somehow.

I think the answer is to let smithing IMPROVE a base weapon. Not create and improve it. That way you still have to go find the good stuff! You just make it better.

It's does not make sense either that you can be the thieves guild master , The listener, The Archmage , The Thane of Every City , The Leader of the Companions , the nightingales and the champions of 10 Deadric Lord and wearing in your pocket some of the rarest and most wanted artifact of Tamriel.. Everything happens in the dungeons you visit because

You're 'Special' .

Hmm.

So being a master smith ain't surprising.

yet after all of this Guard still threaten you when you shout.

Meh, you are what you play. It's not because you have those options that you have to take them.

I do 'powerlevel' smithing (ocasionally buying iron ingots and making iron daggers) but I'm only level 48 smith at level 24. I only use the weapons I get from quests or find in dungeons and improve them from the ore I mine. Simple enough for me ... I'm using a Glass Sword at the moment (not improved yet) and with my 66 one handed and 58 two-handed I have to leave camps quite a few times 'cause I can't handle the mobs there on expert. I'm looking forward to the dungeon where I can find my first ebony sword or axe.

I'm also a Nord warrior that like to sneak. I do use the bow some times but I have restrained myself to only using a hunting bow and steel arrows 'cause it doesn't feel right for my character to use better equipment in archery. And my enchanting skill is still 15.

It's all about self-restrictment in a game like this and I don't find it even a bit hard. The game that way is still fun and challenging. People that whine because they made 800 iron daggers in the first week in-game and it became too easy, have just themselves to thank for it.

YOU choose your own balance in this game, you don't need anyone else to do it for you.

Well, you could put being the leader of all those guilds simply to you being a crafty bastard, that's usually what I do. But making weapons better than the Daedric Lords can seems a bit...odd.

Dunno, guess mods will change it to suit me better, but that doesn't do anything for anyone on consoles that don't like it the way it is atm.

But the option always exists for you to make it, and that can be enough to break immersion. It's like having an ebony sword lying on the kitchen table in Breezehome, that's not even marked as "Steal", and you can choose to take that one or go kill an hour long dungeon to get one just like it. When you get back to breezehome and that ebony sword is still sitting there, you feel just a little bit silly.

Agree. It definitely doesn't have the effort/reward factor that it should have.

Actually, Elven SHOULD be crafted. In 'Light Armor Forging' it explains how a Dunmer slave escaped Summerset Isles and told EVERYBODY how to make Elven armor.

As for bandits having good equipment, that's false. The best equipment I've seen bandits have is a high level Bandit Chief in full Steel Plate, with a steel mace. That was it. That's the basic cap on a Bandit Chief's gear.


There is a simple reason: A warrior would not be a master smith. Earlund Gray-mane outright says that NONE of the Companions know how to work a forge, much less make a suit of armor.

You can get that same epicness if you choose not to use Smithing. It's not that difficult not to, and apparently it would be more fun for you not to. You can buy the armor you need, or find it just as easily as in Oblivion, but now you have the option to acquire it by leveling a skill.

Hell, you don't even have to grind out iron daggers to raise Smithing, if you don't want to. I decided to make at least one of every item in each tier of Smithing before I could pick a new perk.

Or, you could wait until you reached the tier the items themselves were available at before making them.

/sigh dont like smithing been so OP dont use it..... and enjoy the weapons/artifacts etc u find thats cool is your choice

i dont power lvl or make the 3 craft profession exploit but i like smithing it gives you the choice w/e armor/weapon you like and make it useful

^_^cheerz

It's not like I've powerleveled smithing, here; I keep my smithing levels at the same level as the gear I get from dungeons. But why bother going into the dungeons to get the weapons if i can just make them myself, y'know?

Again, I know that I can just not do it, but the option makes it much less satisfying than it would be otherwise. I'm playing a game, I'm not really doing it to limit myself TOO much. I'm fine with not overleveling skills and stuff, but that circumstance I mentioned with the Daedric Sword in oblivion will never happen in skyrim, just because there's no point if you use smithing at all.

It's similar to reality, if our world was a medieval-type setting filled with dungeons to loot and whatnot. Most people wouldn't commit the time and effort becoming a master smith, but if they did then they could make whatever the heck they wanted, just like you can in the game. Playing properly, you'd do a little smithing here and there along your way through the game rather than spending four years getting your degree in blacksmithing at the start of the game and then getting around to playing the rest of the game. The game lets you play how you want, including ruining your own experience for yourself if you decide to play the game backwards by focusing on smithing hardcoe right up front versus doing a variety of stuff over time.

I prefer it the way it is versus the game telling you "Sorry, but you need to knock it off with smithing for a while and play the friggin' game before we let you smith any further." You're responsible for realizing that you have more to do than just sit there smithing your life away as soon as possible. It isn't the game's job to babysit you and suggest going outside to play in the rest of the game world.

If you're doing dungeons for gear, are you getting gear to do more dungeons for gear?

You should get the mindset that you are doing dungeons for fun, gear be damned, and it'll be a lot more enjoyable.

It's a FANTASY game, so let your FANTASY work and FANTASIZE that you can't smith your own crap.

I'm loving how you've ignored everything i've said...actually, no, It kinda hurts my feelings. Please go back and read what I've said?

See, I want to be able to upgrade my gear fully, so I get the perks. But at the same time, getting that makes getting the gear from dungeons pointless, because I can make it in a town infinitely more easily. Literally buy everything in 2 minutes and make it in the third. It just makes me feel like smithing was just tossed in, rather than lovingly crafted.

:facepalm:

It's a PC GAME. With the same line of thought go play a MUD instead of Skyrim and FANTASIZE the graphics!!!

Check the sig

Having a hard time accepting the views of elitist on this board. There is nothing wrong with Smithing or any of the perk constellations. Look, Dragon armor can not be found in the game. You must craft it. As a result, smithing must be increased to 100 and the light armor smithing perks or the heavy armor smithing perks taken before you can craft it. As far as ingots go, You'd never be able to mine enough ore to craft one complete set of advanced armor. It's perfectly logical that shop keepers would have what you need to craft equipment. Merchants would have developed relationships with suppliers. So, get over it.