Um just seeking a clarification on comparators - normally I use >= for journal entries to progress dialogue - is there any occasion when you would use <= or just =?

When something hasn't happened yet and you want them to comment on it :shrug:

Hehe - it's not that clever a mod

I was thinking of having a choice for a reward so you could pick either option, there would be two journal entries eg I took the money = CT_Work 12 or I took his life = CT_Work 13, as the conversation continues and other journal entries get added I wan't sure how to reference back to the two options when I am now up to an entry like CT_Work 16.

In essence i want to reference back to a a previous journal entry depending on what choice the character had made eg function/journal/CT_Work = 12 "You've already taken the money" or function/journal/CT_Work = 13 "I'm dead what more do you want?"

Because I only ever use >= I just wanted to know if anyone ever uses the other comparators

I think you can use GetJournalIndex, I never really got that function :shrug: (I can use it, though.)

But if you kill someone you could also just use the Dead function.

Either that, or you could use a global variable to keep track of your quest's status. I did this a couple of times in Rise of House Telvanni: it's a quite powerful and flexible technique.

B

So how does that work B?

I'll give you an example from RoHT:
In the East Empire Company (EEC) quest, the player is supposed to have a Telvanni spy kill Canctunian Ponius by a scentless and tasteless poison. If the player decides to kill Ponius directly, an official enquiry will follow, and the Telvanni spy will have to flee. In that case, House Telvanni will lose its influence in the EEC completely.
Now, a scentless and tasteless poison is hard to find. It takes a master alchemist to make one, and neither Nalcarya of White Haven nor Abelle Chriditte are inclined to get involved in House politics and make one. So the player needs to find someone else. That someone was once a member of House Telvanni before he had to leave and hide from Therana. In order to persuade him to brew that poison, he'll demand a tower of his own, complete with guards.
Now there are three possible endings to that quest:
- The master alchemist gets his tower, brews the poison, and the Telvanni spy uses it to poison Canctunian Ponius.
- The master alchemist gets his tower, brews the poison, but the player decides to kill Canctunian Ponius by other means (or Ponius dies in an accident). The spy flees Vvardenfell.
- The master alchemist doesn't get his tower. The player kills Canctunian Ponius directly, or Canctunian has been dead from the beginning of the quest.

This situation is difficult to control by Journal entries alone, so I made global variables to keep track on the master alchemist's tower and on whether the spy takes over the EEC or flees Vvardenfell.

Let's get our hands dirty with some actual code:
The variables are called RoHT_EEC_status and RoHT_TelAzura_status. I added a global script to keep track of Canctunian Ponius' health:

begin RoHT_Canctunian_Script; this script checks, whether Canctunian is killed by the furtive poison or other means.; It is started by RoHT_advisor in the dialogue topic "imprudent activity"; global RoHT_EEC_status; This variable is set by RoHT_advisor in the dialogue "Greeting 1" and in this script; 0 = Canctunian Ponius lives and is in charge of the East Empire Company; 1 = Canctunian Ponius is dead and Mehitabel Llaras has taken office; 2 = Canctunian Ponius is dead and Mehitabel Llaras had to fleeif ( MenuMode == 1 )	returnendifif ( GetJournalIndex "RoHT_EastEmpireCompany" < 100 ); Canctunian should be alive	if ( GetDeadCount, "Canctunian Ponius" > 0 ); but if he isn't, you have probably killed him before and this quest can't be solved as intended		Journal, "RoHT_EastEmpireCompany", 110; stop this script, it has served its purpose; RoHT_EEC_status will be set to 2 by RoHT_advisor in the dialogue "Greeting 1", so that Mehitabel won't vanish before your eyes		StopScript, "RoHT_Canctunian_Script"	endif	else		return	endifelseif ( GetJournalIndex "RoHT_EastEmpireCompany" == 100 ); this Journal entry is set by your advisor in the dialogue "Greeting 1"	set RoHT_EEC_status to 1	"Canctunian Ponius"->SetHealth, 0	"Canctunian Ponius"->disable; quest solved, stop the script	StopScript, "RoHT_Canctunian_Script"endifEnd

That script is started in dialogue at the appropriate time and will run until Canctunian Ponius is dead, regardless of his cause of death. RoHT_TelAzura is also set in dialogue:

; global RoHT_TelAzura_status; This variable is set to 1 by RoHT_advisor in the dialogue topic "master alchemist"; 0 = Tel Azura isn't built yet, Ammardunibi Camp is active; 1 = Tel Azura is completely built; Ranos and Bodrusa have moved there

With these two variables I'm able to keep track of this quest's outcome, regardless of Journal entries. For example:
"RoHT_TelAzura_status = 1" and "RoHT_EEC_status = 0" means that the player has recruited the master alchemist, but hasn't made any progress on taking over the EEC yet.
"RoHT_TelAzura_status = 1" and "RoHT_EEC_status = 1" means complete success.
"RoHT_TelAzura_status = 1" and "RoHT_EEC_status = 2" means partial success - master alchemist won, EEC lost
"RoHT_TelAzura_status = 0" and "RoHT_EEC_status = 2" means complete failure.
I have made extensive use of these possibilties in later quests, for example when I needed to filter dialogue independently of the EEC quest but with regard to the master alchemist's status in House Telvanni. To get an idea of how convoluted this can get, have a look at http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj158/bhlmods/WIP%20Rise%20of%20House%20Telvanni/RoHTQuestTree.png. Doing this by Journal entries alone would be a royal pain in the ****.
If you'd like to take a closer look at it, let me know: I can send you the current WIP version. It contains quite a few interesting dialogue techniques, like quest deflectors, quest delays, quests within quests, dialogue-and-script-choreographed sequences... lots of stuff to browse through. :read:
Expect to find some bugs in later quests, though. I'm not done testing yet.

B

Edit:
I forgot to mention that using global variables also enables other mods to interact with your mod without being dependend on it. All that is required is that both mods feature the same global variable. For example, if you wanted one of your NPCs to comment on House Telvanni taking over the EEC, you'd add the global short variable "RoHT_EEC_status" to your mod and filter your dialogue for "global RoHT_EEC_status == 1". If RoHT is also running, players would be able to see that dialogue; if RoHT isn't running, they won't even notice that it exists. Point is that your mod will work, regardless of whether RoHT is present or not.

Thanks for that explanation B it was really easy to follow (maybe I'm just starting to get the hang of this)

Um I have a faction question, I can see how to raise a faction's disposition if you belong to them - ModPCFacRep - but how do you modify a faction's disposition to you if you do not belong to them?

I have a faction that I want my player to do quests for but cannot join - however i still want them to either be happy or displeased with the player's choices.

You can use modpcfacrep for a faction the player is not in; however, Morrowind Scripting For Dummies says the getpcfacrep function is broken. I'm not sure if pcfacrep alone changes a faction's disposition, or if it just contributes toward rank increase.

I suggest you make a global variable to store the faction's disposition, then use something like set Illu_somefac_rep to ( illu_somefac_rep + 5 ) in the dialogue results to change it.

Is there someway I can get a Journal update from putting an item in a container?

Thanks Illy

EDIT: I found the Vassir Didanat script so wonder if I could amend this for my needs



Would this then be correct for a Journal update



Not sure if i need the quotation marks in the script for the Journal entry

Begin Illy's scriptshort doOnceif ( OnActivate == 1 )   if ( doOnce == 0 )		Journal, MY_Journalupdate, 10		set doOnce to 1		Activate   else		Activate   endifendifEnd

You don't need quotes unless you have spaces in your journal id.

That script will update the Journal when the player opens the chest for the first time. We still need to check for that item:

So here's my suggestion on how to elaborate on Jac's script:

Begin Illy's scriptshort doOnceif ( OnActivate == 1 )	if ( doOnce == 0 )		if ( GetItemCount "Illy'sItemID" > 0 )			Journal, MY_Journalupdate, 10			set doOnce to 1			Activate		else			Activate; needed while doOnce is still 0, but the item hasn't been placed in the container yet		endif	else		Activate; needed if DoOnce is 1	endifendifEnd

B

Edit: Talking about scripts: I just noticed a nasty mistake in my script from post #82. I really wonder how it has worked until now. :shocking: Does anybody else see it?

I didn't see the part about adding an item...

Firstly thanks Jac and bhl for replying I really appreciate your help

I wasn't sure whther you added the doOnce command just for good script writing technique as the original Beth script didn't have it? based on what I want to do it makes perfect sense though.

I really want to force the removal of the item from the player's possession when they activate the container as it doesn't make sense in the quest for them to hold onto it nor retrieve it.

The update to the journal will say the container has received the item

So can I do this with bhl's script?

Begin Illy's scriptshort doOnceif ( OnActivate == 1 )	if ( doOnce == 0 )		if ( GetItemCount "Illy'sItemID" > 0 )						Player -> RemoveItem, "Illy'sItemID", 1			Journal, MY_Journalupdate, 10			set doOnce to 1			Activate		else			Activate; needed while doOnce is still 0, but the item hasn't been removed from the player yet		endif	else		Activate; needed if DoOnce is 1	endifendifEnd

That should do it. I used the doOnce to prevent the journal entry from firing each time the container is opened, but it's probably not needed.

Not quite. Since this script will be attached to the container (it will, won't it?), the GetItemCount function will check the container's inventory, not the player's. You'll need to add a little twist and check for "if ( Player->GetItemCount "Illy'sItemID" > 0 )"

Begin Illy's scriptshort doOnceif ( OnActivate == 1 )	if ( doOnce == 0 )		if ( Player->GetItemCount "Illy'sItemID" > 0 )			Player -> RemoveItem, "Illy'sItemID", 1			Journal, MY_Journalupdate, 10			set doOnce to 1			Activate		else			Activate; needed while doOnce is still 0, but the item hasn't been removed from the player yet		endif	else		Activate; needed if DoOnce is 1	endifendifEnd

Edit: Actually, now I'm talking rubbish. That latest script will forcibly remove the item from the player's inventory when he/she activates the container instead of checking if the item has been placed in the container. Your script will work as intended. You might want to add something like "Illy'sItemID->disable" to make sure that the player can't retrieve it.

Oops now i'm confused - but I think the script does what i want

The script will be attached to the container

When the container is activated the item is removed from the player (and the world) it is irretrievable - however the container has other items inside

So I think your script does what I want - it checks the player to see if I have the item, if false then nothing is removed and no journal update, if true then item is removed once only and journal update

Thanks again to both of you

Once I've got it up and running I'll post some pics so you can understand what I was trying to do.

I'm glad you figured it out. My last post was admittedly a bit confusing, maybe even pettifoggery.
What I meant to say was:

f ( OnActivate == 1 )	if ( doOnce == 0 )		if ( GetItemCount "Illy'sItemID" > 0 )			Player -> RemoveItem, "Illy'sItemID", 1

would check if the player activates the container, and if there's one or more of Illy'sItemId in the container. If both is true, those script lines would remove one Illy'sItemID from the player's inventory. But if Illy'sItemID was already in the container, the player wouldn't have it anymore, so it wouldn't make sense to remove it from his/her inventory. (See, that's what I meant by "pettifoggery" :rolleyes:.) And that's what I intended to avoid by adding using "Player->GetItemCount".
Anyway, the main thing is that you've got it working. I'm eagerly awaiting those screenshots . And if you should need a betatester, write me a PM: RoHT has made me quite efficient in finding and squashing bugs.

B

Well I said I would post some pics off progress being made.

I have done 8 quests so far and they are reasonably dialogue focused - I wanted to show you the container but am doing a test run through the dialogue checking for issues - and am only up to testing quest 2

I have a print out of the script and need to do several saves as there are options for accepting different choices with the dialogue and I use the journal to prevent dailogue from being repeated - in other words if you decide to pick an option that insults somone then you can't rewind the conversation and pick a more diplomatic option.

Anyway this is some shots of Quest 1

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/509/q101.jpg

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/2194/q102.jpg

Now he's mentioned that once you get a quest you can check with an NPC Sumiko for advice - she acts as a hint person in case you get stuck however she can be useful to

Off to http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/968/q103.jpg then

If you ignore the advice to talk to Sumiko and just go get what the cook wants http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/8500/q104.jpg

So this time we go see Sumiko and instead of her promting the conversation http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/1246/q105.jpg

I'll pick the top choice as I've often felt like that making the mod so far http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/5035/q106.jpg

Great now we have our item that will make the mission a success - however we wouldn't of hand this conversation if we had gone see in the first place - no hugs then

just sharing this for bhl, Jac and cyran0 to let you know I have put into practice your many suggestions and advice and the mod is making steady progress - I'm even getting less afraid of the scripting so that's some personal progress as well.

That's looking really good, Illy. :goodjob:

I'd like to give you a general piece of advice on this: document your quests well, both inside and outside the mod. One quest with a couple of possible ways is difficult enough to keep together. Eight quests with many possibilities which may even be dependable among each other can become a modder's and tester's nightmare. I have gone a bit overboard with RoHT myself, and if I hadn't made a http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj158/bhlmods/WIP%20Rise%20of%20House%20Telvanni/RoHTQuestTree.png and documented each and every variable in every affected script (see http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=976365&view=findpost&p=14571735 for an example, that was actual, unadorned RoHT code), I'd have lost track by now.

A second thing that has proven very useful is my "Ring of Betatest". That's a ring-shaped activator that (when touched) updates the player's journal right up to that entry that needs to be tested. It's simple, but it will save you hours of typing into the Console.

Enough of my blather. Thank you for working on this! I patiently await playing it with great anticipation.

B

This looks pretty good will you be releasing it?

Thanks bhl - a little encouragement goes a long way.

I write all my dialogue down first using a spreadsheet - so I can order all my choices and keep journal notes, plot lines and greeting close together using tabs. When I'm ready to test I print out the script and tick it of line by line saving prior to choices so I can follow each line - and yes i do do a reasonable amount of console typing

I have a couple of questions:

Looking thorugh Kaye's greetings he uses his greetings like topics some of them you can come back and say they were too hard - when he gives the mission he has a dialogue variable set to local - localdayspassed >= to 2 and then when you come back he again uses greetings for the mission and you can pick cjoices like it was too hard - he berates you for bing a quitter and tells you not to come back for a day in your result box it adds set localdayspassed to 1 if you speak to him before a day is up his greeting says



And there is a dialogue filter for localdayspassed < 2

I checked the scripts but couldn't find localdayspassed as a script so assume this is something being generated directly in dialogue? I was thinking this could make my time based missions much easier when you want someone to go away for a day before returning - has anyone used this before?

A variation for this is that I am working on a quest which culminates in inviting someone to a meal - I want the meal to begin no earlier than 7pm - without getting really complicated is there someway i can use dialogue to check what time it is to then say either "You're a bit early come back at 7pm" or if you come at 10pm or later "you're a bit late come back tomorrow, make sure you come at 7pm" ?

It's not essential to do this as it really is up to the player how they want to roleplay their character - but if there is an elegant way of doing this I'd love to know

Finally I'm inviting someone from another interior cell which has the same naming convention to come to this cell, I'm not sure whether to transport her or just enable a clone - any thoughts on which is an easier/cleaner option?

That's far superior to my method. :goodjob: I doubt that I would have the patience to pull this through, though. Usually, I write dialogue directly into the Construction Set. Having to use Morrowind's Topic-Greeting-Journal structure helps me to keep it all organized. Or maybe I'm just used to keeping the whole quest in mind. :shrug:



localdayspassed is not a game function; it is a variable that needs to be declared like any other. So you need to attach a script to Kaye and declare localdayspassed in there. There's a really short example of this in MWSFD, 9th edition, p. 144 (on using the Day variable). I'm not sure, though, if making localdayspassed a local variable is a good idea. I haven't tried it, but I could imagine that this variable gets reset if you don't see Kaye within 72 hours. Just to make sure it is saved properly, I'd make it a global variable, e.g. Illy_KayeDaysPassed.



Try to attach this script to the host:

begin Illy_DinnerTimeCheck_Scriptshort DinnerTime; This variable determines if dinner is ready; It is set in this script and checked for in the dialogue "Greeting 1" by this script's host; 0 = You are either early or late; 1 = Dinner is readyif ( MenuMode == 1 )	returnendifif ( GameHour >= 19 )	if ( GameHour <= 22 )		if ( DinnerTime != 1 )			set DinnerTime to 1		endif	else		if ( DinnerTime != 0 )			set DinnerTime to 0		endif	endifelse	if ( DinnerTime != 0 )		set DinnerTime to 0	endifendifend

It may look complicated, and it could be greatly simplified. Most conditions are meant to ensure that the variable DinnerTime won't be set every single frame. In dialogue, you'd filter for "local DinnerTime == 1" if dinner is ready or "local DinnerTime == 0" if it isn't. Does that qualify as not "really complicated"? :unsure:



I don't know what's cleaner. I find it easier to use clones instead of teleporting NPCs. It's easier to make an individual script for each clone compared to writing one complex script that covers all eventualities. I'm using clones in RoHT. (Except for one choreographed sequence, because I used a whole lot of ForceGreeting in that script.) The disadvantage is that a clone is technically a new NPC, so all changes you make in game to one clone (disposition, handing over items) will not automatically apply to a different clone.

B

You're the best bhl

I hadn't thought to check if there was a script on Kaye so rushed off to check

Begin WaitOneDayshort currentDayshort localdaysPassedShort NoLore;blocks discussion of general topicsif ( currentDay != Day );assume that the day has gone up, not down or something...	set currentDay to Day	set localdaysPassed to localdaysPassed + 1endif

I'd just been surprised to see the filter for the local in his dialogue and had wondered if that was a shortcut way Hadn't thought of the 72hr bug resetting it though - must test him in game to see if it does.

The dinner script looks great - I'll give it a test - thanks for that

Thanks for the view on clones - by the time the event occurs there will have been changes in disposition and dialogue so I might try transporting first

A little contribution to this insteresting thread. I am almost sure local script variables are immune to 72 hours reset ; many companion scripts use local variables to store/restore GetStat values