You are seem to imply that raising the level cap would somehow make the DLC no longer quality content. If raising the level cap had no effect on the quality, it wouldn't even need to be mentioned because it has no relevance to the discussion. It would be like mentioning that sandwiches are delicious out of the blue.

And yes, you have just said that if modders can do it, Bethesda doesn't need to do it. That applies to the skill cap, and that applies to DLC. Again, if it wasn't relevant, you wouldn't have mentioned it. Stop trying to evade out of a being beaten in pure logic. It is pointless.

Please stop derailing the thread. If you have a logical argument against raising the skill cap, feel free to present it. But saying that modders can do it... just keep it to yourself.

you cant become master of all in skyrim. you currently can only access a maximum of 80 perks. thats it once you hit 100 in all your skills you no longer advance anymore. getting to level 80 takes a ridiculously long time to do. if you increase the level of the monster proportianol to your current level then how is that any different than what oblivion did......it isnt and i do not want oblivionis system back. shivering isles was arguable the best DLC for any TES or even fallout game to date. it didnt increase levels but it was still a blast to play. the worth of a DLC should be entirely in the story and quests it offers and some bonus trinkets such as weapons.

if you add DLC that has monsters that scale above 50 then you destroy any danger that currently resides in skyrim. all of a sudden those dragon priests and ancient dragons that were the bain of the world are small potatoes to the "insert new name" bears or the "insert new name"trolls that were added by the new DLC which because they scale to 100 become more powerful than alduin himself. added extra levels destroyed any semblance of balance in fallout NV. you dont take a game that was balanced around a max level of 50 (80 if you play the same character forever) and then expect it to not be broken when you can all of a sudden get to level 100.

Let's take a look at what was actually said then, not your convenient snip.

What I said is that the problem you have is trivial and shouldn't be included in DLC. DLC should be for quality content, not trivial settings to be changed, which are easily alterable by the user as it stands. If you want to try and induce an alternate conclusion from that, as you have, then that's fine, but it doesn't make you right. So once again, nice fallacy.


I didn't say anything of the sort, once again you're trying to induce a conclusion from premises which simply aren't there. I assure you, what you're doing, has nothing to do with logic.

I seriously think that a good 80-90% of people using the word 'logic' have no idea what it means. People like you blindly draw unreasonable inferences and then try and pass it off as the result of a logical progression.

There really isn't any danger in Skyrim when you're above 50. Dragon Priests and Ancient Dragons are supposedly bane of the world but Forsworn Briarhearts are more deadly than them. Problem? Yeah. But they can't scale everything down just to make some enemies that are canonically more powerful stay that way. You need to be willing to accept facing rank and file level 52 Thalmor grunts. Sure, they might be more deadly than some of the older stuff in absolute terms... but when you faced those dragon priests, they were deadly proportional to you, and these soldiers, proportional to you, are weaker than you. It happens... and already has happened as I said with some of the Forsworn and some vampires.



There you go again. HOW DOES RAISING THE LEVEL CAP SOMEHOW TURN GOOD CONTENT BAD? THIS HAS NO RELATION TO THE QUALITY OF THE CONTENT! Heck, if anything raising the skill caps allows for the content to be better.

Once again, you're trying to put words in my mouth. You're creating a strawman argument which just isn't there. At no point did I say that raising a level cap makes good content bad, I said that the change you want is trivial and shouldn't be included because it is a trivial thing which you can do yourself. I also said that DLC should be for quality content, not trivial settings changes; therefore, your trivial settings change, which you can do yourself, should not be included.

I really don't see how you cannot understand that.

And now I'll redirect you to the point where you said Bethesda doesn't need to do it if modders can do it, therefore following that logic follows there should be no DLC. Arguing what is trivial isn't for you to decide.

An interesting idea but there would be some slight balance issues with Smithing. The other skills I don't see a problem with, Light Armor/Heavy Armor rating would go up 8 points, it wouldn't really affect the magic skills except Enchanting, The stealth skills besides Alchemy wouldn't really be affected, lockpick would be useless, etc. I doubt this would happen but it is an interesting idea.

Go ahead and redirect me there then, because it was never said. You're repeating a tired and disproven conclusion. I've shown you what I actually said multiple times, and written in clear form the reasoning behind the statement; you have quoted small parts of a post to attempt to justify your outlandish conclusion, which shares no logical connection to what was said.

if it were up to me then mobs would be completely independent of level. dragons should ALWAYS be at least level 30 for the low level ones and level 50 for the higher level ones. the beginning of the game where you kill the dragon at the tower made dragons look like a joke. bears should always be difficult to kill even at high levels because they are bears and in the real world a bear can crack all of your ribs with only one swipe. as far as danger in the game is concerned there is no danger for me past level 35 or so which is usually around the time i max out my archery, one-handed (or two-handed) and im pretty high up in the armor skill and at least one magic skill which is usually conjuration. after that its becomes easier for me not harder because ive already maxed out my sword weapon damage and so have the mobs but as i get to higher levels i add more tools like alteration paraalyze spells and illusion calm/frenzy or dual conjuration etc. the game gets easier not harder precisely because i am levelling up and not because the mobs arent. so what if they get some extra hitpoints it doesnt change the fact that they are still easy to kill it just takes a couple extra arrows or spells.

increase the mobs level only increases their health which is exactly what oblivion did and turned fights into long winded and boring mash fests.

as far as the forsworn briarharts thats has to do with how OP dual wielding is moreso than anything. if they reduce the power of dual wielding then they wont be the killing machines they are now. if you used cicero as a companion you can see that that guy is a death machine because he dual wields.

we seem to have a disagreement on how games should scale. i dont think there should be any scaling whatsoever. if i go into the game world at level 4 then i should expect to get my but handed to me by 99% of everything out there. by the time i reach level 25 i should be able to beat 50% of everything and so on till level 50 where i can pretty much handle anything. skyrim does throw some hard stuff at early characters early on but not nearly enough. all the npcs are afraid of draugrs and crypts and yet i can go into them with a level 3 guy and iron weapons and clean them out. i should be dying if i did that.

there was a mod for oblivion called TIE which completely unlevelled the game except for main roads and cities. you never knew what level the mobs were going to be inside. it didnt matter if you were level 2 or level 40 you could encounter everything from low level bandits to level 40 lich kings. it made the game much much more fun and dangerous. skyrim is alot better than vanilla oblivion but it still has that basic flaw of letting you go to to many places at very low levels and scaling stuff to your character. thats why regular bears become almost extinct and apparently get eaten by the new cave bears which start popping up everywhere.

Uhh... well I'm glad Bethesda doesn't share your vision. Skyrim would be much less fun IMO if getting all the dragon shouts was a joke because dragurs were always a piece of pie. You turn something almost completely non-linear into something completely linear if you want to have any sort of challenge yourself as a player. That is bad. Bad.

it worked just fine in TIE and FCOM had very difficult scaling and many more dangerous areas and those were very popular mods. i think you missed my point on draugrs. i said that it was funny that everyone was afraid of them yet i could go into a crypt right off the bat at the start of the game and kill them with no problem. for me draugr should be a mid-high level enemy.

you have more method which is closer to oblivion where you can go anywhere and do anything at any level and then you have fallout NV system where certain areas are almost impossible for low level players to get to. i guarantee you that more people preferred fallout version of level scaling compared to oblivions awful system.

clearly you never tried TIE or FCOM because otherwise you wouldnt be saying that they are bad. they were massive improvements to the game.

"Why don't you just make ten louder and make ten be the top number and make that a little louder?" - Marty DiBergi

I would rather have better DLC than just raising skill numbers.

I don't want to see this, after seeing how people are already abusing the skill system with 6000 damage swords and such, what I would like to see maby is a couple new skills and those will raise the level cap to about 90 or 100.

My $0.02.
No.. This is no fallout If you play normally it will take a long long time before you get a capped character. You'll even have invest in upping unused skills a lot to get a maxed out character. I am not talking about grinding or exploiting, but if you just play the game as is.
In other words, unless you are really dedicated it isn't necessary. That and the fact that new perks would make you an übergod in the world of Skyrim.
This is not Fallout or FO:NV. There the levelcap felt somewhat irritating because before you hit the cap you'll always gain experience. (after that nothing) Upping the levelcap with DLC's was a great idea in FO:NV because you would still be investing in your character if you maxed him/her out because of a levelcap. (and even then you would have a hard time getting every skill up to a 100) Skyrim allows you to get every skill to a 100 and will still level you up past lvl 50.
IE the levelcap in Skyrim is a natural one,(you truly are the dragonborn, you maxed out everything) upping it would be unnecessary an unnatural.

the extra levels in falllout NV DLCs were a horrible idea. what they should have done from the get go is to have slower leveling. with fallout NV by the time i hit level 50 i ended up with 100 in almost all the skills unless i specifically avoided perks and traits like skilled, educated and i avoided using skill books. even then i had four skills at 100 and the rest were in the 80s or 90s except survival which i never used. also by the time you get to level 50 there arent really many perks left over that are worthwhile unless you start picking perks completely unrelated to your build such as picking melee perks for a gun/explosives build. and in that case you just end up with a master of all character which defeats the purpose of specializing in fallout in the first place. i played fallout NV to death and the only way i found it to work was by cutting leveling to at least half of default for vanilla or 25% or less for games that are modded with increased spawns. with those settings i was able to complete the main game and most DLCs (hated OWB) and i was ending up just shy of level 50.

Because then it wouldn't go up to eleven. "I mean eleven, it goes up to ten and then one more"

It probibly will cause I've noticed that if you have maxed out a skill it still shows at 101 with an empty bar and not just 100 with the bar full.

Raising the skill cap doesn't make DLC bad. Make an actual post, and try again.

Also, the people here don't seem to understand that not everyone wants everyone of their characters to be exactly the same due to the only progression options being to become a spellsword once you hit level 50. Some people want their wizard to stay a wizard and their warrior to stay a warrior without feeling like the game just stops all of a sudden.

Also, you people don't understand Fallout and Skyrim are fundamentally different. In fallout, as you raise the level cap your character becomes more homogenous. In skyrim, as you raise the level cap through raising the skill cap, your characters become LESS homogenous, because people focus on expanding upwards rather than outwards. In Fallout, all your skills were 100 because once you hit 100 with your guns, you stopped leveling up your gun skill and put those points elsewhere. In Skyrim, if you raised the skill cap and therefore level cap, you would let characters become more powerful naturally, by allowing them to invest in what they like instead of expanding into areas they don't like just because it is the only way to see progression.