So, it really does get quite annoying that whenever someone mentions a bad point about Oblivion, there will be all the "Omg, Morrowind aint perfect!1!!1!!!!!1one!!" comments. I recently read the following comment: (I have no idea how to quote from a locked thread...)



It really annoyed me. WE KNOW Morrowind isn't a perfect game. In a thread where someone is pointing out something bad about Oblivion, there was never a mention of Morrowind's perfection. Morrowind DID have all these problems, and more, but that doesn't mean we want to see them again. It's ridiculous to complain about us. Personally, I wish Morrowind wasn't so dumbed down, I wish Morrowind had a better storyline, I wish Morrowind was larger, and I wish there were more quests. That doesn't mean I hate the game, nor do I idolise it as the single most perfect god-sent thing in the universe.

And, I also get annoyed by the "Shrug off the low points" comment. I see comments like this all the time. Oh, so the game has a nice stealth system, so that makes it ok that I find it extremely boring to walk around the wilderness? I'm sorry, but it doesn't work like that.

I'm not singling this guy out, it's just a trend I see in those who defend Oblivion in places it shouldn't be defended (You would never see me defending Morrowind's view distance, just as you shouldn't defend Oblivion's lack of a tropical climate).

Also, in most of the areas Morrowind and Oblivion have similar issues, Oblivion takes it to a whole new level. I mean:

Going against Lore:

Morrowind HAD areas that followed lore. Actually most of the island was wasteland. The green areas were placed, as it would get pretty old pretty fast walking around one big Red Mountain region for hours on end.
Oblivion had NOTHING that followed the lore. Every bit of jungle was scrapped, and we saw nothing but temperate forest everywhere we went. And I doubt that anyone believes that a tropical climate wouldn't have been more interesting.


Dumbed Down Combat:

Morrowind: 27
Oblivion: 21

They use pretty much the same combat methods, and the whole power attack thing isn't an improvement, it's a matter of taste. I know I prefer to be able to hold back my weapon, if I want. And perks where just cheap. I mean, what's with the "every sword is a jinkblade!" perk? Or the "Repair anything for free!" perk?


Smaller World:

While Oblivion was technically bigger than Morrowind, Morrowind had a lot more in it. I mean, did anyone actually think Morrowind was smaller, before it was measured? Pff.


Anyhoo, I think that's enough of that, and I think you get my point. Stop using the "Argument" that Morrowind isn't perfect when someone says that Oblivion's guard need to be fixed, or TESV needs to follow lore. It's just quite stupid.

Oh, and while I'm here, I'd also like to clarify that DAGGERFALL is the greatest TES game. Just because I prefer Morrowind over Oblivion, doesn't mean I believe Morrowind to be the greatest thing ever.

And this isn't an "Oblivion bash", I'm only here to rant at the constant amount of "Morrowind aint perfect!" comments.

This is Bethesda Forum, write anything bad about their games and they lock your thread.

I knew something was wrong in Oblivion when it first started, looked way too good and was way too detailed. No way they could keep this level of detail up and still give me a worthy sequel to Morrowind.

After directly exiting the sewers, i was awed by that beautiful scene with the Ayelid ruin across the water, but it was fleeting, same with first going through an Oblivion gate. Pretty graphics will only get you so far.

Oblivion is still a 5 star game, but still feels half of Morrowind was, which speaks more about Morrowind than it does about Oblivion really.

Well to be honest when i first came on this forum i had only played Oblivion. Then i started seeing a truck load of comments about how Oblivion was too "dumbed down" and Morrowind was a gaming bliss.

This forum is bias towards Morrowind Hircine, so don't worry

Well, the conversation you quoted is pretty much true for the most part. Every game will be held up to the previous and there will always be a vocal group that says it was a dumbed down casual easy kids game. They'd be wrong, either way.

All three games I've played are magnificent, Morrowind happens to be my favorite but, yes, it does have flaws just like the other two.

While I do agree, though, that rather than shrug off thew low points we should give constructive feedback here on the forum and hope they listen. Like how in that old interview from a few months ago Todd said he wanted to do Morrowind-level culture stuff in the future.

Both of them where "good" games, neither was perfect.
Both had some things they improved on from the previous game, both had points where they did worse.

And for the next game I honestly wouldn't want EITHER of them to function as a base. I'd want the next game to start of fresh and not try to be a clone of any of the previous titles, including Arena and Daggerfall.
There are so many points that can improve and SHOULD improve over just copying what once was. While previous games did have their pro's neither did perfect on either of them. The answer isn't "copy the more popular one" but "lets be inspired by the previous one and improve on that".

They were all good games on their own accord, but they are the past now. Let them rest, don't try to resurrect them into "Version 2".

Then you don't spend much time on the forum or only see what you want to see. Of course we allow criticism of the games, we are aware that not everything in any of the games is ideal for different people. What the moderators don't like and which invariably happens in topics like this is that the topic goes from criticising or supporting a game to insulting other posters for their opinions.

Perhaps you would send me a PM linking to the topics closed because "someone said something bad about a game"?

Oh God, am I about to witness Aunt Lucy's stare?

Anyways, I agree with Daniel_Kay, as much as I like both games, really the only features I'd miss from them is free-roaming and in-game books. The rest could be changed. Naturally, people will complain because that's what people do.

Now for a joke:

You're all wrong! The only Elder Scrolls game worth playing is Arena!

I guess I really don't understand the OP.

I only read the quote (not that thread), but it doesn't seem to me to be a "Morrowind ain't perfect" comment. Rather is this a comment about "anchoring" to a particular game. That is those that start with Morrowind learn to accept its faults as natural, but when the next game comes out then Morrowinds faults tend to be ignored by those that started with Morrowind, and the improvements of Oblivion are ignored. The quote's comments about Morrowind were not, it seems to me, to say Morrowind was a bad game, but rather that those that anchored to Daggerfall, saw the faults of Morrowind and not Daggerfall, just as those that anchored to Morrowind saw the faults of Oblivion and not Morrowind. And there is a prediction that will happen again if there is a TES V.

I think that's a valid point. With all due respect, it seems to me that the OP misread the intend to the quote, because the OP then proceeds to compare Morrowind with Oblivion, which seems to me to be what the quote says we should avoid. Rather view each as a seperate game.

Again with all due respect, but anchoring to game you start with seems to be very common to me.


BTW, I've noticed a lot more Oblivion "bashing" on these boards than "Morrowind bashing"

You know, Morrowind ain't perfect either :wink_smile: jokes.

People say what I did above, because it feels like the whole forum is comparing both of the games all the time. But if people want TES V to be a completely different TES game just like the others are, which BGS always manages to do, then why would you compare Oblivion and Morrowind when every TES game is supposedly completely different from the other? OP, I'm not saying that you do, I've just noticed some people on the forum contradict themselves.

Daggerfall wasn't perfect, but there was alot of dumbing down when they moved to Morrowind, and even more when it was Oblivion's turn. I've posted a huge list of complaints about Morrowind, only to annoy those who idolize it over Oblivion and have never played Daggerfall. I love Morrowind too, but there are tons of things I'm still missing from Daggerfall.

I know I should enjoy their good aspects when I play them, but if something is missing, it IS missing. Also I can't stop fantasizing of TES5 that would mix only the best things, returning to the roots in some sense. Hope I didn't start the Ideas and Suggestions threads for nothing, and Bethesda rewards our thousands of hours* of work and makes TES5 as TES veterans like to have it.

*combined ofc

I believe that everyone should have their own opinions and have the right to defend their opinions. Also that trash you write about Oblivon not being set in a jungle as a game fault is complete [censored] and those who think your view on this matter is wrong, such as I, have all the right to express their opinions.

This is a forum and only because you personal opinions do not match someone elses doesn't mean they are wrong and if I think the view distance in Morrowind is perfect then that is my opinion and I have the right to defend it no matter what you say.

Why has this been kicked off again? What do you hope to achieve? Because no doubt it will end up in flames. People have differing opinions, and sometimes are unable to express theirs without trashing others. It's a shame, but on something as potentially volatile as the interwebz you just have to accept it.

Ranting about the opinions of other members isn't topic-worthy in and of itself, and what is left to discuss beyond that is well-worn territory that usually leads to warns for flaming, etc, so I'm closing this.