I liked the lockpicking minigame from Oblivion. But the speechcraft system from Morrowind. So I voted for those.

Really? Why?

Lockpick failed.
Lockpick failed.
Lockpick failed.
Lockpick failed.
Lockpick failed.
Lockpick failed.
Lockpick failed.
Lockpick failed.
Lock too complex.

i think i know why because you need a certain lockpicking level to break the lock

Edit : oops i mean Open

Why it is almost like the characters stats mattered or something. Why even have the skills if you are going to put in minigames that let you bypass them?

If anything, I want lockpicking to be handled the way it was in Fallout 3, but harder. It was a very good balance of player and character skill. There should be more than five grades of locks, and you can't even attempt some if they're out of your skill range. Lockpicks should be more fragile than in FO3, and difficult to replace. No picks in dungeon loot, and most vendors shouldn't stock them. Scarcity makes failing at lockpicking more consequential.

As for speechcraft, it needs a total overhaul. It svcked in Oblivion and was boring in Morrowind. They said disposition will be influenced by your actions towards an NPC, so that role should be diminished for speech. As for what they can do, I have no idea.

Being likeable is very different than convincing others.

That's the point. I don't wanna play a mini game with all citizens of Skyrim to be able to convince a quest giver to give me 10 more gold. But I like to talk (static) with everyone to see what they have to say, thus giving me better personality through out the game.

I think merchantile should be handle the same way.
(what the shopkeeper think of you + a % of how much you have bought through out the game).

Sorry about the spelling.

Fallout 3's version of Speechcraft was horrible, IMO. A guy with 5 speech could get luckier than a guy with 90 speech when trying to convince Jimmy to sell his Corolla. it needs to be solid, either like NVs system or something else.


As for lockpicking, I don't really care, I liked both TES and Fallout style, but I prefer Oblivion's style that you can pick ANY lock.

I'm surprised so many people voted for Oblivion's Lockpicking. I guess if the lockpicking skill were taken out... but oblivion's lockpicking made the lockpicking skill useless.

I didn't mind Oblivion's lockpicking really. The speechcraft minigame, however, was atrocious. They should have a more in depth system for that. Like, for example, you click the speechraft icon, option, whatever; some new topics pop up. One is a clever joke, another is some form of threat, and perhaps a compliment, etc. You pick whichever one you think the NPC in question will like. Idk, something like that.

I want the option of blowing up the lock arcane style (As if tiny dynamite were inside the lock) alerting the enemy of my position(If they are nearby), entering the room and announcing my arrival like a total badass mage ;p

As for speechcraft, I'd like to be able to kidnap NPCs and threaten to kill them if they don't tell me everything they know about the mayor of Cityopolis. (Instead of evil city guards that have the ability to hear and see through walls at a 50 meter distance :S (For god's sake I disposed of him inside a room on the second floor!).

I really want to say how I would do lockpicking, but I can't put it in words, at least not easily. At the very least they should make it real time if they do a minigame again. As for Speechcraft, I don't care as long as it somehow make sense. In Oblivion you could make anyone like you, when in reality everyone would hate the guy who did this:

Bendu Olo: "You have pretty eyes."
Baurus: "Don't waste your flattery on me."
Bendu Olo: "So a mudcrab walked into a bar, and a guard said 'STOP RIGHT THERE CRIMINAL SCUM!'"
Baurus: "Oh that's good, how'd it go again?"
Bendu Olo: "I can bench press a Troll."
Baurus: "I'm not buying that, not even a little bit."
Bendu Olo: "Cross me and I'll run you through."
Baurus: "Yes, yes, whatever you say."



Seriously, If I was a guard or someone strong and a person just started saying random things like that I'd just kill them. Hopefully this will be fixed, and from the kind of half said remark in GI that said some enemies may confront you (or something to that nature) it probably is fixed.

Fallout New Vegas handled both well so something simular to that wouldn't be bad.

Some people (me included) just aren't that good at the lock picking game. That's why. For people like us, the lock picking skill is absolutely NOT useless. Being able to keep 3 pins locked when you [censored] up the 4th one is extremely handy after you've broken 20 lock picks just getting that far. (btw many of my characters are Level < 10, which means no Skeleton Key for me and more reliance on a good lock picking skill).

The Speechcraft minigame should be put on permanent display as a perfect example of how NOT to do things. Something more "speech-related" would be far better than some goofy wheel. I picked the 'something unique, not a minigame" option.

Oblivion's underlying idea for the Lockpick mingame was sound, but the implementation didn't make the lock any harder if your skills were low, or easier if they were high. Morrowind's system was perfect for a pure RP game, but a bit boring and "stuffy" for a FPS/RPG hybrid. None of the poll choices fit. I don't want Morrowind's "simplistic" system back (even though it worked fine for me in that game), and I don't want Oblivion's silly "stats don't matter" approach again. FO3 put a minimum requirement on it as a "band-aid" solution, so you couldn't even play the mini-game if your skills were too low, but it still didn't FIX the problem.

As for the earlier post about MW's lockpicking system being:
fail
fail
fail
fail
fail
fail
lock way too difficult for your pathetic skills (which it would have told you immediately on the first try, almost as blatantly as FO3 did)
Well, obviously somebody didnt' take Security as a Major skill, and can't deal with a Level 60+ lock with only 5 skill. If you COULD open something extremely difficult without any skill, like in OB, that would be far more stupid than your novice character not being able to open it. After all, what's the point in locks if they can't keep anyone out? Besides, in MW there were several different unlocking spells available in cast and scroll form which you could find in random loot (one even capable of opening Level 100 locks), as well as self-recharging enchanted trinkets for use on the easier locks. My MW characters almost never "major" in Security (some take it as a "minor" skill, and end up doing fairly well at it after a few levels of play).

I voted "don't care" on the second question, even though I care a lot, because even though a lockpick minigame is fine in theory, none of the systems in the above games meet both the "fun" and the "meaningful skills" requirements.

Dont forger merchanting the top 3 most useless skills in oblivion

The bobbypins in NV were much more rare, albeit you only had a slight chance of running out. For the really difficult locks, i think you should have to use very rare tools that are difficult to aqcuire - maybe permanent, maybe not, but you'd have to put in a lot of effort to get the tools.

Meh, I dunno. Making minigames for things really de-emphasizes the corresponding skills. You NEVER needed speechcraft in Oblivion because the game was insanely easy. They need that game to be harder. The Oblivion lockpicking game wasn't horribly easy itself but if I remember correctly trying to force it as per the security skill broke lockpicks on failed attempts. It should be uses like Morrowind.

i have a Speechcraft System Idea

When you Click on persuasion (don't know if i spelled it good )
Some Random Lines comes up on your screen you can click one of them and then see how the NPC Reacts
if He Reacts Negative Disposition get lower
When a Positive Reaction Disposition get higher
When he's Done reacting Then there is another Random Lines and you can keep doing it till you quit

If it has a minigame, it should not be a character skill.
I.E. if there is a Speechcraft minigame then the Speechcraft skill should be removed from the game since it is not pointless. Same thing with Lockpicking.

And combat too, I guess, since that has an extensive minigame.

I never was a big fan of RNG dice roll systems. There should still be a minigame, but it should be something that's VERY tough to do successfully until you get your skill to a certain level. It needs to achieve some kind of balance between player skill and character skill.

As a fan of Morrowind's character-dependent combat and a hater of Oblivion's Block-Block-Swing combat: yes, combat should be less arcade and more stat-based. This is a game with stats... they should have a purpose or be eliminated (which it appears they are doing anyway what with there being only 3 combat "skills" now).

For lockpicking. character skill, not player skill at all.
otherwise remove it as a skill. but then, that really takes a lot away from being a Thief character.

I love OB but the lock picking mini-game holds a fairly unique place in my list of most hated game mechanics ever. Very first mod I ever made for OB was dropping a skeleton key just outside the sewer exit. :meh:

I don't hold the same sort of animosity for the speechcraft mini-game but it was kinda boring. The FO:3 and NV model was better but I'd like to see something just a smidgen flashier and exciting. No mini-games though.

Both need a really big overhaul from OB, and still more refinement from the FO versions.