Well yes and no. I don't see why you would want your games on a different hd. You seem to be the type of person that likes to keep a clean system, operating in optimal condition. Is your "gaming" hd faster? Slower? During most installations, certain files need to be installed on your OS hd, no? I just don't see a real benefit to this, except being organized.

Every DRM gets cracked, and very quickly. Restrictions like this only hurt the end user. Some people prefer having the disk, and hate having programs run in the background. There are people who have NO internet. Lose your account for whatever reason, which could even be a server failing, and you could lose everything.
Some people like digital distribution, thats fine. It has its benefits.
Some people want to own the disk. I also plan on shutting down every process running in the background (that I can) to allow more resources for Skyrim. Steam is another process that has to be running.

Its not like people who don't want steam for disks are saying digital distribution should end, why do fans of digital distribution feel the need to explain how their system is better? Everyone is entitled to an opinion.

Skyrim is a game that requires lots of data loads from the hard drive. I will be installing it onto an SSD, along with Oblivion and Morrowind. All other games are on a much slower magnetic disk. Nothing ends up on my boot partition except drivers and system utilities. And I'll be damned if I'm forced to install Skyrim onto a magnetic drive.

Great. So, in a few years, when you stumble across the DVD in a closet and think how great it would be to play again, only to discover the activation servers aren't there anymore, how happy will you be?

I'd rather the game authenticate the DVD locally - so as long as its physically readable, I can play the game.

I used to do that 'back in the day'... can I say that now? lol

But seriously, I am very curious to what actual performance boost you receive in a game by doing that?

Look at the highest rated comment for that video. That is the proper response to this statement.

Even with today's computers that can be upwards of 5-10 FPS gained, depending on how much stuff is running in the background.

Don't think I'm entirely computer savvy as you... but wouldn't a game run better in general if your OS was also running on a SSD?

Yes, and that's why the OS is also on an SSD.

Oh my bad... Not realizing how many SSD's you have in there! lol

If you don't know what half of the reason people dislike steam is, then go learn and enlighten yourself. PC gamers are not casual gamers. We care about our computers.

Put simply, Steam is like a talking rock you have to carry with you everywhere. It may be small and relatively easy to carry, but its annoying as hell most of the time.

My computer + related software is probably the only thing I own besides clothing. So I care very much about it. I'm not about to let that stupid talking rock invade it and tell me what I can and can't do.

Kinda seems like you're insinuating that people who use Steam and/or casual gamers do not care about their computers <_<

Depends on the processor. But in my computer, the GPU is about as bad as it gets, integrated ATI. So my processor picks up a large part of the work, its not as efficient at rendering graphics as a GPU, but its all I have for now. Any extra bit of performance I can steal away is good, I can barely play Oblivion on max settings.
Besides, I hate programs running in the background. Whats the point of making a game if its just a file to be used by another program.

And computer people tend to like to be in control of what is going on, the casual market place is the console market place, its my PC I should have control of it.

Add to that total loss of control over the game.

I was referring to newer computers. If Steam is actually causing that much of a problem, then you'd definitely want to stop some processes.

Ah ha!! To be in control. I think THAT about sums it up!

That is the root of it. The game companies want to strip consumers of any control over the games they buy, many of us that hate Steam want to keep it. Piracy is just an excuse.

According to my experience you can move steamworks games outside of steam folder and they don't mind at all. I tested Zeno Clash, Metro 2033, Killing Floor and they ran without problems. I think other games having problems are related to their own DRM restrictions like usual disc checks, folder checks, "application running in background checks", constant internet connection checks etc...

So only people with newer computers should be able to run the game efficiently?
I understand some people love steam, but let those of us who don't want it just get the physical disk with disk checks. CD keys work well enough too.

What about people who have no internet? They can't activate it.


If we didn't we would probably own a Mac.

I hope that they have a physical copy that will utilize steam, but I hope that it doesn't require steam.

Oh Snap! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BnLbv6QYcA

I personally don't mind Steam, I can and have moved Steamworks games without it screwing up. Not all of them work but a sizable amount do. L4D/L4D2 both did it fine, those are the only 2 I currently have through Steam.

Well here's the honest answer... if you have an older system that you can barely max out Oblivion, I should assume you're probably not gonna be able to run Skyrim as efficiently as you'd like to.

You know what though? I love options... I'd be all for allowing either: disc checks OR Steam

People without internet are boned, yes. More and more games are requiring some sort of online authentication. AND I believe someone had mentioned earlier that PC gamers are NOT casual.... So I'm just gonna say, anyone THAT hardcoe must have internet! :whistling:

I have Oblivion installed on a pair of lightning fast Intel SSDs in Raid0 in my laptop.

Vanilla Oblivion gets constant 60 fps at 1920x1080, all settings maxed, but after installing 150+ mods the fps drops significantly. Do you happen to know whether there is some way to adjust my mods to use less compression?

I don't fully understand the way that OBMM, OBSE and Wrye Bash access all the mod files, but I have a some files in .7z archives, some are in normal esp/esm files I dropped into the Data folder. I noticed that when creating OMOD from the 7z archives, there seem to be some sort of options for compression.

Any advice you can provide to reduce the compression of these mod files would be greatly appreciated!

Or maybe they are hardcoe because they don't have internet? Like a burly bear in the forest, primitive as the day is long, but as strong and raw as a an axe that cleaves flesh and bone as gently as air. You might mock that bear from your comfy chair in front of your computer no doubt in the safety of your home which may or may not be in an area bears do not live, you certianly won't mock that bear to its face, in the middle of that dark forest, where no one but hungry bear cubs thirsting for man-flesh will hear your screams...

And I believe I've gotten off topic enough. Steam is great for some people, but there are a lot of people who don't want it and shouldn't have it forced on them.
Steam (and maybe other options) for digital distribution. Not for disks.

I don't buy it, that almost sounds like a dodgy conspiracy theory.

In my time on various forums I've discovered there's a pretty decent proportion of gamers that are pretty clueless when it comes to computers. Developers seem to view products like Steam as a way to smooth the experience for some, whether it has the desired effect is perhaps debatable but I'm at least happy to accept that their motives are genuine.