Gotta agree. They all had clipping and I never ever cared. I expected there to be clipping in this not nothing at all. Because armors are different sizes weapons won't work? These three games all had different armor sizes and it worked there. If they made it so that it was holstered all the time except for in power armor it'd be ok and kind of make sense, but completely removing it was shocking when I found out.

What are you guys talking about? The weapons are visible. That laser rifle you just put away is right there in your back pocket. Right next to the two missile launchers and the minigun. Just pull the cloth back a little and look down in there and you'll see them clear as day.

As I recall, they would in fact float further and further away from the body the more you used them. They'd eventually get to where they were a foot away from your hands as you swung it around.

My loss? I wouldn't say so...

I'm playing GTA: San Andreas, wonderful game. Holstered weapons weren't visible there either, but it was made for ps2.

Another interesting game (heavy survival) I'm playing is The Long Dark. Very hard, but wonderful.

And then they'd have to change the animations for holstering/drawing the weapons each time, too, otherwise they wouldn't line up. And make sure it's consistent with every modded variation of the weapons. And then do it all again for Power Armor. Bethesda experimented with geared-up for Skyrim, sure, but even what they delivered ended up clipping or floating depending on the character's body size and the armor they were wearing.

I think this time they decided they'd rather hear complaints about it not being there, instead of complaints about clipping/floating... and honestly, clipping/floating was way more annoying to me in Skyrim than pulling my weapons from thin air is in Fallout 4.

You have an offset value in armor who set how far from body weapon is placed.

Body size size armor automatically.

Power armor has to be handled different.

More of an issue is all the weapon mods, how did FONV handle it, you could add scopes and stuff on weapons.

That does make a lot of sense. With the weapon modability, it would be more difficult. And I had forgotten about the floating weapons in Skyrim, lol, thanks for reminding me. That bothered me to distraction to see my character's bolt quiver floating a foot away from their backside.

Wow, talk about First World problems. Unholstered weapons stole my wife! Or something equally overdramatic.

Never really understood what people meant by 'immersion' anyway. Why are you playing third person? Hardly immersive to see yourself in front of you, that never happens to me in real life. Do you play with the music soundtrack? That's not really like real life either. Where are the buckets and brooms I keep collecting? I mean the whole thing is so unbelievable to start with, but this is the thing that breaks the game for you?

I'm not saying it shouldn't be done btw, but your language is overly drama queen to digest seriously.

When Gearbox announced that there will be weapon, shield, and class mod shown up on our character's body, it was rad.

Gearbox stated that now you can assign your best weapon and show off while it's being unused. People were pissing in their pants.

When the game's there, nobody gives a [censored] about each other's equipments being shown. lol

And I wished they could use the memory and working time spent to do other else.

???


What the hell are you even talking about? Is that a Borderlands reference?


On topic:


Weapons not being visibly holstered does svck. Yes, we all know the issues with layered armor and adjustable body shape. It still svcks. For the simple fact that you look a little less cool running around the wasteland. Even if they didn't bother with an actual holster animation and just had your currently equipped weapon appear on your back or hip, it would still look better.

All of these arguments are spot-on. This would be a significant amount of coding to get it right. Basically, having weapons attach to individual armor pieces would be the way to do it, but in future titles. That way, things could be customized to avoid clipping and placement errors. Re-coding existing armor would be basically like starting over.

Handling things with invisible "limbs" growing from individual character models allows for easier animations and customizability, and universality for all character models. But it also introduces the probability that an error with the skeleton could result in some very odd bugs (like the floating weapons thing).

In the end, it's a lot of work for relatively little return "gameplay" wise, but it's an immersion element that many players would be very happy with. Which leads me to:

Drama is what it's all about. There are two basic categories of gamers (just like any hobbyists): casual and hardcoe. Casual gamers enjoy games, regularly play them, enjoy talking about them, but it's just not a big part of their world. hardcoe gamers are in it for the experience; they're 100% vested in suspending their disbelief and "immersing" themselves in these other worlds (just like avid readers completely immerse themselves in a novel when they read).

Take tennis as a comparison. I'm a casual tennis player. Been playing for over 20 years, was in a league in University, and I could even hold my own against some really serious players during my late 20's. But I never really got that into it -- never owned a $700 racquet, never purchased special tennis sportswear, never been to Wimbledon, really don't care one whit about winning or losing. Far cry from a hardcoe player who can feel the difference between string tension in 2 identical racquets by dribbling a ball twice with each.

That's why immersion elements are so important to gamers. I am not affected much by the 1st/3rd person perspective things -- both are 100% immersive if handled properly. It's the attention to detail (like weapons hanging off of your belt) that really svck you in. It's meaningful dialogue between companions as you traipse overland instead of hearing the same recycled comments endlessly. It's opening a rusted chest in a pre-war ruin and finding preserved clothing and a pre-war weapon, not 3 hits of jet and mutated carrot...

_______________

TL;DR

Casual gamers are in it just for the fun. Little details don't matter -- it's just a game.

hardcoe gamers are passionate about the experience. The details are everything -- they're often the difference between "forgettable" and "instant classic".

Glaring holes and missing details in games are like opening fine wines too early, letting them breath too long, and serving them without decanting first. Connoissuers would be extremely disappointed, but casual wine drinkers wouldn't even notice.

Fair points. I'm serious about my music for instance and feel the difference in guitar string gauges.

However unlike top level sports, which I don't follow or particularly like, I do understand the passion. I guess I'm not from the generation that think games are high art or anything. They're a diversion.

I'm from the generation where this was my first game:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f8/Pong.png

So anything of Fallout 4's level, even with unholstered weapons, is a marvel!

I'm from the same gen. I hated "video games" that you would find in coin-op arcades. It wasn't until the 80's, when my father brought home a Commodore 64, that I really sunk my teeth into gaming.

You seem to have developed the same connection and passion to music (guitar, specifically). I developed it for theatrical performance, and later on theatrical direction and design. That bridged me into media almost directly. As games evolved and became a full-on medium for artistic expression, all of my insight, work, and passion flowed right into that, too! It's been utterly amazing watching it evolve. So quickly!

I feel we're right at the beginning, anyway. Technically speaking, it has not even been a full generation since Gaming was taken seriously as an industry. I'm always pushing the projects I work on into the same attention-to-detail that I would ask of any tech director or scenery crew for a production. If we do our jobs correctly, the audience will never know how much work went into such a simple scene. If there's a hole -- they'll notice it immediately.

Thank you for understanding my point of view. Meanwhile, I've read somewhere that survival mode is going to be overhauled to a real "survival struggle" including food, disease, danger, sleep and more. I still have hope for Visible holstered weapons. I have this schyzophrenic taste to watch "me" (=my digital avatar) from outside!

Come back when the GECK and mods are out. Apparently it also saved Skyrim for a lot of folks on PC.

As for those of us on console, well...

IMHO Skyrim war nearly perfect in spite of all the bugs considering the available technology. The dlcs were a little big letdown though.

I think a serious game should be complete without mods; mods add more detail to what already exhists, and shouldn't cover its lacks, because there shouldn't be lacks to be covered.

I like it when they change dragons to Charmander or My Little Pony. I makes me laugh. Worst was the mod that made characters look like PeeWee Herman. Just frightening.

Now I wanna go revive my Skyrim mage! Bye Fallout!

I would like to see my holstered weapons on third person. It's not really that much of a deal for me though, I think it's just there for decoration, it looks good yeah, but what's important is the gameplay.

If it was for me I would like to see everything I carry with my character.