So with this whole dual wielding system, it would make sense that you'd be able to sword with one hand (one handed of course) and punch with the other...THAT MAKES SENSE RIGHT!!?!?!
Although, I can totally see that not being possible. The only reason that i ask about that is because i highly doubt they're going to add kicks. Despite the fact that it would make things magical and awesome, I highly doubt they'd add kicks. On the other hand, I'm totally wondering if they're even going to care about unarmed. it was obvious it was a second thought in all the other elderscrolls games, and that kinda svcks in a game about choice. The fallout series is much better about their unarmed combat, so i'm hoping they learned some lessons from that.

By the by, adding kicks would totally help with that whole, range thing when it comes to punching versus swords...because you know...legs ARE LONGER AND STRONGER THAN ARMS!!!!!! COME ON PEOPLE!!!

i apologize for all the yelling

hmmmm
honestly I never EVER used unarmed combat in ES games, seemed boring and weak.

but if its their I hope we get something deadlier this time around and more interesting.

I hope it is around. Things like kicking and hth weapons could make it worthwhile.

While I agree that using unarmed combat myself was never a thought, I would have loved just for diversity to have fought some actual monks who were masters of it and offered a different gameplay challange than people with swords

The reason unarmed was boring and weak was because it was just boxing-lite. No kicks, no grappling, no crippling attacks (they BETTER have Fallout 3's body damage system), etc. How is unarmed supposed to be dangerous when it isn't even close to the strength it has in real life? I should be able to grab my opponent's arm, twist and break it, then plant my boot in their ass. This is a fight to the death, not a boxing match.

I would like to see something like Dark Messiah's kick, but I doubt it. Unarmed has been in every TES game, I think, so I don't see why it wouldn't be in Skyrim too, especially when considering it's in Skyrim. Sure to be a lot of people interested in going unarmed in the land of barbarians. It would be nice to see it improved from past games though, as it seemed kind of like an after-thought and not really a real option compared to using a weapon. Then again...using your fists is hardly an option compared to a weapon, so they've got me there.

I definitely think it should be there for the player but maybe less lethal this time. A weapon that knocks enemies out could be immensely valuable. And kicks should be available to high level hand to hand users IMO but I doubt they'll add them at all.

That is why I think it should be able to be used in conjunction with weapons (plus have it's own hand weapons) and have some reason to need to use it, say make your weapons break more easily and you need to get to a crafting station to repair them.

How would kicking make something magical?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnvXpLOzKeQ @0:48

It would be nice if there was a perk tree in unarmed that supported the use of other weapons, so you could use a sword in one hand, and have a free hand in the other. This could have combos like an open palm in their chest into a thrust of the blade. Perhaps you could even get perks that, while blocking, if you press a direction, if you have a chance of deflecting the blow in that direction, allowing for a counter strike.

Essentially, what I believe unarmed should be about is flowing in combat, about adapting and using the energy of one's opponent against them. Deflecting blows, catching and breaking arms, disarming shields, sweep kicking the legs out from underneath people, and all sorts of things. It should NOT just be boxing. That will ALWAYS result in boring, weak gameplay.

I have to agree. I'd say unarmed could be fun and worth using, past games just didn't handle it very well, it didn't do enough damage to be worth using on that alone and didn't have enough in the way of other benefits to make up for that. I mean, in Morrowind, unarmored could knock people out pretty quickly when you were skilled at it, but you still needed to hit them thirty times afterwards before they'd die, and since the knockout effect from hand to hand was short lived and you couldn't use it to cripple people without killing them, it didn't provide a non-lethal option for combat either. It was also pretty boring considering that you'd just punch people, and punch them, and punch them, no variety in combat moves or anything, at least with other weapon skills, you can get better weapons as you play, when you don't have any weapons, making combat feel less repetitive would require more variety in combat moves.

For unarmed combat to be useful, if you don't want to take the easy way and make it as deadly as swords or axes, you have to give it some other advantage to make it worth considering as an alternative, perhaps allowing it to be used as a non-lethal combat option. Just removing the weight of your weapons isn't enough of an advantage. We don't know if it's in Skyrim or not yet, but if it is, I defintely hope it's improved, in past games, I just didn't feel like it was worth using except for the novelty, which quickly wore off once you realized you'd be throwing the exact same punches for the entire game.



Well, it doesn't literally make it magical, of course, but being able to kick people would at least add a bit more variety to unarmed attacks, since it's no longer just punching.

I think only mysticism is out from the skill list , so if hand to hand is in,they will have to perk-tree it.so there is some scope for improvement.

Think of all the possibilities for unarmed fatalities or power attacks. Rear naked chokes or a brutal Thai knee, soccer kicks or stomps to a downed opponent. Slams, flying arm-bars... I think one of the animators has some fight experience so who knows, its possible

Edit: beut like mentioned above I would prefer it was mainly for non lethal combat... only being lethal if they were unconscious. I remember in morrowind I would use it to knock people out and steal their stuff without killing them, and I was disappointed that it didn't work the same in oblivion.

Mysticism can't be the only skill that was removed as Skyrim has 18 skills, compared to Oblivion's 21, therefore, even if we disregard everything else that we've heard about skills so far and just look at those numbers, it means at least three skills from Oblivion must be gone from Skyrim. Now, this doesn't mean their functionality is gone, as they could have been merged with other skills, but they would have to no longer be individual skills. Is hand to hand among them? I don't know, nothing has been said about unarmed combat one way or another.

Unarmed has always seemed like a "oh well why not include it" feature in TES. The only time I've ever used it was when quests required I did, but other than that its suicide to attack NPC's without a weapon. It would be nice if they included a punching feature with your free hand to where it stunned or staggered your foe and opened them for a slice with a sword.

I think unarmed needs to be included if they want to keep up the 6 skills per paradigm deal.

Combat
- One-Hand
- Two-Hand
- Hand-to-Hand*
- Smithing
- Block
- Heavy Armor*

Stealth
- [Acrobatics/Athletics]*?
- Light Armor*
- [Sneak/Security]*?
- Archery
- [Speechcraft/Mercantile]*?
- Alchemy

Magic
- Illusion
- Conjuration
- Alteration
- Destruction
- Restoration
- Enchanting.

* Has not been officially confirmed. All others have.
? Merged skills or one dropped in favor of the other.

i made a thread about this same thing earlier. i piture the legend of the seeker style where im swinging my sword around and a guy blocks it so i quick jab him in the face and then run him through the belly. another cool think i was thinking about was fighting hand an a half style with a larger long sword and an open hand. regular swings would use one hand but the power swings you would use your extra and to get alittle oomph behind it

i also would like to see along the lines of non-lethal pommel punches. smack him right in the grill with the hilt of your sword and lay him flat

Maybe you can use your fists at the same time? That does seem weird though. Maybe fists dont count as weapons, so much as "no weapons". So you would need to be unarmed to use fists, like in previous games .

i just don't want it to be an afterthought like it's always been. I hate it when games do that. As far as "unarmed should be weak because that's realistic" aspect of things, well, you've got dragons and people who can shoot fire out of their hands, so that kinda throws that out of the window. they could easily (yes i know a lot of work goes into animations, don't take the easily part soooo literally) do the thing that they did in fallout new vegas, different animations for third and first. If modders were able to put kicks into oblivion...cool kicks for that matter...there's no reason that these professionals can't at least make interesting unarmed combat. As for damage output vs swords...keep the damage where it is and make it status effects if you want.
Round house kick to the head stuns people (side attack...idk if it's still the same in that aspect), Side kicks knock people down and sends them back (forward attack), back attack does something else...you see where i'm coming from. It could easily be punches doing the same thing.
But hey, i somehow doubt that i'll be seeing anything of interest unarmed wise, call me a pessimist....which is kinda a shame.

Perfect monk/ninja class right therr. :ninja:

So i just thought of something that would be hilariously depressing. If the range on unarmed was still as small as it was, and the sword fighting remained the same as in the trailer (i.e. the characters don't even hit eachother and they're still doing damage)...that would make unarmed suuuuper useless lol

Arena didn't have any skills at all. Daggerfall didn't have unarmored. Only TESIII & IV. I love unarmored because my character never uses armor, nor does she use weapons.

There has to be hand to hand in Skyrim! How else is Beowulf...er Dovakiin, going to grapple honorably with Grendel...I mean giants!

They definitely need to do more than the simple punches and jabs they gave us in Oblivion, at least some kicks. I can understand If they don't want to make everyone ninjas (meh, mods can do that), but a barbarian people like the Nords would stll mix in plenty of holds, kicks, and throws into their brawling that could liven up unarmed gameplay.

You mean the Underfrykte!