You know what? I'm starting to see a huge hole in Lorkhans plan. This whole sub-gradient stuff is BS. Who are our only 2 CHIMsters? A God, that is Lorkhan's replacement, and another god, that is someone who stole Lorkhan's power. Both of these people are part of Lorkhan (not as an aspect, but as in taking bits and pieces of his power in the conventional sense).

So, we don't have people lower on the gradient. We don't have mortals, AKA; the very beings Lorkhan was trying to create so they they could achieve CHIM. No, what we have are 2 beings who are on the same scale as Lorkhan (one of the more powerful Et, Ada), achieve CHIM. This means many things:

1. Et Ada could achieve CHIM in the first place, without needing to be weakened into mortals
2. It is possible that Lorkhan, and only Lorkhan can achieve CHIM.
3. 2 could be true, meaning that creation took place just so Lorkhan could share his power with others, and they couldn't take, or maybe even didn't want his power. So he had to lower them to be more able/accepting of his power (I'm saying "his power" far to much here), so they could reach CHIM.

And that's it. Just another crazy observation with a possible explanation.

You just got me thinking, what if he didn't fail. What if he's been subtly manipulating Mundas from sovngarde through Chim. Creating champions like Pelinal, The CoC, Nerevarine, Wulfharth and many others each avatar designed for specific tasks furthering his goals. While his enemies think him dead and gone he seemed to be giving orders from Sovngarde ordering Tsun and the Dead warriors not to challenge Alduin. Tsun even suggested he might have forseen The LDb arrival. He even had the Tongues the only others who knew Dragonrend standing at the ready to assist.

I think you mean die. Because he didn't fail. Vivec and Tiber both achieved CHIM, which was his end-game plan. So, Lorkhan won, even though he had his heart tore out in the process. However, the more we look at it, it seems like he's pulling chest master like plans here: Intending for Magnus to flee so that Nirn might have a sun, letting his heart get removed so that his power could be spread into Nirn and its inhabitants.

Subgradience isn't required for CHIM. Lorkhan achieved it himself when he first saw the tower. Subgradience is required for Amaranth.

EDIT: Of course, looking at the "I" from the inside is much easier than from without so subgradience certainly helps

I can't find anything that states that. Is it buried in C0da?

Lemme hunt for it real quick, think I saw it on TIL. Found it.


Here it is: http://www.imperial-library.info/content/vehks-teaching

Yes, but that just says it helped them see it better. He basically saw something, and created a model of it to describe it better to others. He didn't need to though, in Vehk's Teaching he shows that even Lorkhan was very uncertain of his plan. His plan may very well be pointless, but then it might not. As I said that the only ones who get it, are those who take on part of him.

It's like you can't see the "I' without using his eyes. So he let others have his eyes. In a matter of speaking. Become mini-Lorkhans to see the mini-tower?

Ehh... I kinda don't think so. If you were to stand where the hub of a wheel is and look at the wheel edge on, you wouldn't see an "I" you'd see an infinite vertical line. You also would be incapable of seeing all of the wheel at the same time. Being outside of the wheel lets you being able to see all of the wheel in it's entirety.

Or to not talk in metaphor... in order to attain CHIM you have be be able to see the Mundus as a whole, not just the part in front of you. Or rather, you have to both know that you're just part of a dream and also have the willpower to say that you matter in spite of it. Only seeing one part of that isn't going to cut it.