Sudden fps drop for no reason : IV

» Thu May 19, 2011 7:52 am

At least not a reason I'm aware of. All of a sudden FPS drops down to 1 [ONE] from an average 20 in exteriors and a stable 30 in interiors, the latter due to the OSR fps cap. I'm pretty sure this is not a low vram issue as I have plenty to spare, my guess is that it's somehow related to a cpu-intensive script since everything works like a charm with no esps enabled. This is kinda hard to investigate as everything goes back to normal if I close and reload the game. I'm really at a loss here as I have no idea on what might be causing this and I'm not aware of any useful debug tool other than typing tdt/sdt in the console, if anyone can check the following list and point me in the right direction I'd be very grateful.

Spoiler

Bain Packages:++ 000 - Quickstart-1947.zip (02CED535) (Installed)++ 001 - Unofficial_Oblivion_Patch_v3_2_0_Manual_Version-5296.7z (BCBA7B56) (Installed)++ 002 - QTP3_Redimized.rar (E4AC185A) (Installed)++ 003 - QTP3_UOP32_Patch_2dot3-11261.7z (AB6F3EB9) (Installed)++ 004 - Unofficial_SI_Patch_v1_4_0_Manual_install_7Z_version-10739.7z (79CE866D) (Installed)++ 005 - Unofficial_Official_Mods_Patch_v15_Manual_Version-9969.7z (BEDDA946) (Installed)++ 006 - Unofficial_Patch_Supplementals-27710-3-3-5.7z (576BF6E0) (Installed)++ 007 - Bomrets Texture Pack Shivering Isles.rar (04FB1178) (Installed)++ 008 - Detailed_Terrain_-_Beta_II-15245.7z (ACDC6F83) (Installed)++ 009 - DT_Texture_Pack_-_Shivering_Isles-15245.7z (2E490148) (Installed)++ 010 - Improved trees and flora.rar (02AF3AF2) (Installed)++ 011 - Trollf LoadingScreens.7z (E2984B92) (Installed)++ 012 - Color Map Mod.7z (5ECFAB7A) (Installed)++ 013 - Map_Marker_Overhaul_3_9-26389.rar (383BEA7A) (Installed)++ 014 - FOV Modifier.7z (7B93CCBE) (Installed)++ 015 - OBGE_-_Liquid_Water_1_2_0-37825-1-2-0.zip (8D9582F8) (Installed)++ 016 - Shoreline_Movement-37825-1.zip (84029463) (Installed)++ 017 - Animated_Window_Lighting_System_v5-5-3-19628-1.7z (D33C0877) (Installed)++ 018 - All_Natural-18305.7z (525AF603) (Installed)++ 019 - Immersive_Interiors-34199-0-8.zip (8E58AC1F) (Installed)++ 020 - OOO_Complete_1.34b.rar (65B33297) (Installed)++ 021 - ULComp165-19370-1.7z (89DE1D36) (Installed)++ 022 - DT_Texture_Pack_-_Unique_Landscapes-15245.7z (6B3295ED) (Installed)++ 023 - OOO_-_Cliffs_of_Anvil_patch_v1_1-13834-1.7z (CD3CB768) (Installed)++ 024 - OOO_-_Snowdale_patch_v1_0-13834.7z (A0664E0A) (Installed)++ 025 - OOO_-_Trollf_LoadingScreens_Patch.7z (7EDEC26E) (Installed)++ 026 - Harvest_Flora_v3_0_1-2037.zip (9DD13311) (Installed)++ 027 - Atmospheric_Oblivion_Updated-7703.rar (B89C695F) (Installed)++ 028 - Insanity's Improved Armoury Compilation 1.1 - Manual Install.7z (E9D2D447) (Installed)++ 029 - Symphony of Violence.7z (78B5C41F) (Installed)++ 030 - Idle_Dialogues_Translated_English_Version-38466-1.zip (59BE478F) (Installed)++ 031 - TNR - Tamriel NPCs Revamped.7z (6D369259) (Installed)++ 032 - LivingEconomy-3_70-4432.7z (4AF6DAF0) (Installed)++ 033 - Storms_and_sounds_Full_version-8711.7z (DAC42E2F) (Installed)++ 034 - SpewBoys_SI_Map.7z (C8D037E7) (Installed)++ 035 - Better Clocks 2.2.7z (045477CC) (Installed)++ 036 - Natural Environments.7z (63129F1B) (Installed)++ 037 - The Lost Spires 14.7z (41D2D44C) (Installed)++ 038 - LostSpires_ULpatch.7z (7D486DE1) (Installed)++ 039 - Bartholm70_Full-5022.zip (E2C8AF32) (Installed)++ 040 - stylish jump.7z (A53267E8) (Installed)++ 041 - RefScope_2_1_2-21862-2-1-2.zip (A57B7DD5) (Installed)042 - ==Last==

Spoiler

Active Mod Files:00  Oblivion.esm01  All Natural Base.esm  [Version 1.3]02  Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esm  [Version 1.34]**  TNR - THE REDGUARDS.esp**  TNR - THE DUNMER.esp**  TNR - THE IMPERIALS.esp**  TNR - THE BRETONS.esp**  TNR - THE ALTMER.esp**  TNR - THE BOSMER.esp**  TNR - THE NORDS.esp**  TNR - THE ORCS.esp**  TNR - THE KHAJIIT.esp**  TNR - THE ARGONIANS.esp**  TNR ALL RACES FINAL.esp**  TNR - ShiveringIsles.esp**  TNR - ShiveringIsles no helms.esp03  Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp  [Version 3.3.5]04  Oblivion Citadel Door Fix.esp05  DLCShiveringIsles.esp06  Unofficial Shivering Isles Patch.esp  [Version 1.4.2]++  LoadingScreens.esp07  Natural_Habitat_by_Max_Tael.esp08  All Natural.esp  [Version 1.3]09  All Natural - SI.esp  [Version 1.3]0A  Immersive Interiors.esp  [Version 0.8]0B  Immersive Interiors - Lights Addon.esp  [Version 0.8]0C  OBGE - Liquid Water.esp0D  Idle Dialogue.esp++  Symphony of Violence.esp0E  Atmospheric Oblivion.esp0F  All Natural - Real Lights.esp  [Version 1.3]10  WindowLightingSystem.esp11  FOV Modifier.esp12  Better Clocks.esp13  Living Economy - SI.esp14  Living Economy - Items.esp15  DLCHorseArmor.esp16  DLCHorseArmor - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.6]17  DLCOrrery.esp18  DLCOrrery - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.4]19  DLCVileLair.esp1A  DLCVileLair - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.6]1B  DLCMehrunesRazor.esp1C  DLCMehrunesRazor - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.5]1D  DLCSpellTomes.esp++  DLCSpellTomes - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.1]1E  DLCThievesDen.esp1F  DLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.9]20  Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esp  [Version 1.34]++  OOO-Water_Weeds.esp  [Version 1.33]21  OBSE-Storms & Sound SI.esp**  LoadingScreens-OOO.esp22  OOO-WaterFish.esp  [Version 1.34]23  DLCBattlehornCastle.esp24  DLCBattlehornCastle - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.5]25  DLCFrostcrag.esp26  DLCFrostcrag - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.5]27  Knights.esp28  Knights - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.1]29  The Lost Spires.esp2A  xuldarkforest.esp  [Version 1.0.5]2B  LostSpires-DarkForest patch.esp2C  xulStendarrValley.esp  [Version 1.2.2]2D  xulTheHeath.esp2E  XulEntiusGorge.esp2F  xulFallenleafEverglade.esp  [Version 1.3.1]30  LostSpires-Everglade patch.esp31  xulColovianHighlands_EV.esp  [Version 1.2.1]32  xulChorrolHinterland.esp  [Version 1.2.2]33  xulBeachesOfCyrodiilLostCoast.esp  [Version 1.6.4]34  xulBravilBarrowfields.esp  [Version 1.3.3]35  xulLushWoodlands.esp  [Version 1.3.1]36  xulAncientYews.esp  [Version 1.4.3]37  xulAncientRedwoods.esp  [Version 1.6]38  xulCloudtopMountains.esp  [Version 1.0.3]39  xulArriusCreek.esp  [Version 1.1.3]3A  xulPatch_AY_AC.esp  [Version 1.1]3B  xulRollingHills_EV.esp  [Version 1.3.3]3C  xulPantherRiver.esp3D  xulRiverEthe.esp  [Version 1.0.2]3E  xulBrenaRiverRavine.esp  [Version 1.1]3F  xulImperialIsle.esp  [Version 1.6.7]40  xulBlackwoodForest.esp  [Version 1.1.0]41  xulCheydinhalFalls.esp  [Version 1.0.1]42  xulAspenWood.esp  [Version 1.0.2]43  xulSkingradOutskirts.esp  [Version 1.0.1]44  xulSnowdale.esp  [Version 1.0.2]45  OOO-Snowdale Patch.esp46  xulCliffsOfAnvil.esp  [Version 1.12]47  OOOCliffsofAnvilPatch.esp  [Version 1.1]48  xulSilverfishRiverValley.esp  [Version 1.0]49  bartholm.esp4A  Natural_Vegetation_by_Max_Tael.esp4B  Harvest [Flora].esp  [Version 3.0.0]++  Harvest [Flora] - Shivering Isles.esp  [Version 3.0.0]++  Harvest [Flora] - DLCVileLair.esp  [Version 3.0.0]4C  Harvest [Flora] - DLCFrostcrag.esp  [Version 3.0.0]4D  quickstart.esp4E  RefScope.esp  [Version 2.1.2]4F  Bashed Patch, 0.esp

Add to that a few OBGE shaders plus Conscribe and OSR.

edit: http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1197524-sudden-fps-drop-for-no-reason/page__view__findpost__p__17812252

» Wed May 18, 2011 11:33 pm

The cpu use may not be in-game. If there are system tasks running while you play (e.g. a virus checker, an email client) they can grab all the power away from the game if enough fire at once to use a core each. You can't eliminate all of them, but playing disconnected from any network, and with all non-essential tasks shut down can get close.

» Thu May 19, 2011 2:32 am

If you're using TNR All Races... do you really need all the individual race esp's?

When you say "sudden", what was the last thing you installed before this happened?

» Thu May 19, 2011 5:53 am

This might actually be normal at a transition between cells or in an FPS intensive area like the waterfront.
You actually could be using enough memory to cause this, Oblivion can only use @1.8 Gb, unless you are using a 64 bit OS and a 4Gb patch.

» Thu May 19, 2011 6:59 am

The cpu use may not be in-game. If there are system tasks running while you play (e.g. a virus checker, an email client) they can grab all the power away from the game if enough fire at once to use a core each. You can't eliminate all of them, but playing disconnected from any network, and with all non-essential tasks shut down can get close.

Being on a dual-screen setup I'm able to drag the task manager window to the secondary screen so I can check what's going on in the background, it turns out that the only cpu-intensive task is oblivion.exe itself. Anything else is pretty much at 0 cpu usage.

If you're using TNR All Races... do you really need all the individual race esp's?

Um, actually, no. It's just me too lazy to read the docs or too dumb to understand them. Thanks for pointing that out, I'm going to clean it up.

When you say "sudden", what was the last thing you installed before this happened?

Hell if I know, I threw in a lot of mods with no problem whatsoever. By "sudden" I mean that it happens suddenly after about half an hour of playing, the fps drops down to 1 no matter where I am, both in interiors and exteriors. Things get back to normal only if I close and reload the game, going back to the main menu and reloading the game doesn't help at all. The only one thing I know for sure, it doesn't happen with no esps enabled.

This might actually be normal at a transition between cells or in an FPS intensive area like the waterfront.
You actually could be using enough memory to cause this, Oblivion can only use @1.8 Gb, unless you are using a 64 bit OS and a 4Gb patch.

I'm on a 32 bit XP with 2Gb RAM, judging from what I see on the task manager it looks like oblivion.exe never gets past 1.3Gb, but I have to admit I've never paid much attention to the memory usage.

I'm going to carefully disable each esp one at a time, it will take me some time.

» Thu May 19, 2011 11:33 am

I'm on a 32 bit XP with 2Gb RAM, judging from what I see on the task manager it looks like oblivion.exe never gets past 1.3Gb, but I have to admit I've never paid much attention to the memory usage.

I'm going to carefully disable each esp one at a time, it will take me some time.

Likely due to the fact that WinXP reserves somewhere around that much RAM (about 500 to 600Mb) for its own use.

I know that a 32bit OS doesn't allow for much, but you can add one more gig of RAM to your system. You will never be able to use more than 3Gb, though.

» Thu May 19, 2011 12:21 am

I might get ninja'd by Thomas Kaira, but between your OS and Oblivion you are probably using all of your available RAM, My desktop has the same issue, but I have Vista and 3Gb, but the OS can use 1.3 GB by itself leaving just enough room for Oblivion to play.

» Wed May 18, 2011 7:45 pm

Likely due to the fact that WinXP reserves somewhere around that much RAM (about 500 to 600Mb) for its own use.

I know that a 32bit OS doesn't allow for much, but you can add one more gig of RAM to your system. You will never be able to use more than 3Gb, though.

Let me check.. I'm pretty sure I have a 1Gb bank somewhere, I might give it a try.

» Thu May 19, 2011 11:49 am

You might want to try out http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=10400 for the streampurge setting. I have a higher spec system now, but on my previous computer streamline solved the exact same problem you're describing, for me. It's also awesome for the timed autosave feature and includes a "no-crash fast quit" function, it's one of my must-have mods.

FYI, Streamline IS a somewhat contested mod, some people have had bad experiences with it. I ONLY use the streampurge and streamsave features (and the configurable fastquit key). The other two features change view distance and LOD on the fly to maintain FPS, and on many systems the CPU load of the scripts is worse than just using a set graphics setting. My main point is that if you try out streamline, you'll really, really want to read the documentation and edit the INI file that comes with it before you start playing with it.

» Thu May 19, 2011 4:17 am

Adding 1Gb didn't help a bit but somehow I've been able to reproduce the problem by going in Crucible in the Shivering Isles and looking at the statue just in front of the main gate, where I remembered I had this serious frame rate issue before. For some reason the fps suddenly dropped down to 1, I did a clean save and after a full game reload it all went back to normal. I'm going to try out streamline and see if it helps a little, thanks.

» Thu May 19, 2011 3:53 am

Adding 1Gb didn't help a bit but somehow I've been able to reproduce the problem by going in Crucible in the Shivering Isles and looking at the statue just in front of the main gate, where I remembered I had this serious frame rate issue before. For some reason the fps suddenly dropped down to 1, I did a clean save and after a full game reload it all went back to normal. I'm going to try out streamline and see if it helps a little, thanks.

Sounds like a busted mesh, then.

Do you know which mod added that statue (if i'm interpreting your comment correctly).

» Wed May 18, 2011 11:41 pm

Doesn't look added by a mod to me, RefScope identifies it as part of oblivion.esm.

edit: oh I see, you misinterpreted the 'clean' save part, it's just me not being able to make myself clear enough, sorry

» Thu May 19, 2011 5:43 am

Well it looks like the streampurge feature is helping quite a bit, it doesn't prevent the fps from dropping to 1 but by periodically purging the memory it somehow resets the cell to a playable state without the need to reload the game. I've been tweaking the ini a bit and found out that an aggressive purge setting is just what I need. Still hunting down what's wrong with my mods though. Thanks for all your support guys.

» Thu May 19, 2011 11:05 am

I had a similar problem of severe FPS drop after playing for awhile. In my case it was the Processor heat sink fins were clogged with dust and the processor would go into a thermal slowdown mode. I blew the dust out with canned air and the problem went away.
Just throwing that out there

» Wed May 18, 2011 8:29 pm

I will check that too.

» Thu May 19, 2011 1:00 am

Well it turned out that the shaders included in Detailed Terrain while working in conjunction with the Liquid Water OBGE plugin were causing the issue. The DT shaders alone with LW disabled didn't trigger the problem, but I might add that DT doesn't look to work at all with LW enabled. I know for sure it used to work before, using the non-LW OBGE plugin. I just got rid of DT entirely and now everything works like a charm. Might be worth further investigation.

» Thu May 19, 2011 5:21 am

SOLVED. For some reason OBMM didn't patch correctly the vanilla shader pack while installing the DT core and for some more obscure reason the fps problem arose only in conjunction with the LW OBGE plugin. It doesn't make sense to me, as far as I know DT should be totally OBGE independent. Anyway, I've been able to solve the problem thanks to md5sum: I made a backup of the corrupted shaders before restoring and patching again the vanilla ones, ran a md5 checksum on each shader file, both corrupted and vanilla, ran it again on the patched ones and it turned out that a few were completely different. I'm glad I've been able to bring everything back to normal but I don't have a clue on how a corrupted shader pack can cause so much hassle. Geez, this was hard to find.

edit: typos

» Wed May 18, 2011 10:37 pm

That's interesting and possibly very valuable information for the awesome people who did Liquid Water and people who code for OBGE in general. I strongly encourage you to post your findings in the http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1197487-obge-liquid-water/page__p__17807731__hl__liquid+water__fromsearch__1#entry17807731.

» Thu May 19, 2011 11:29 am

Um, I don't know if this could be useful given that the problem was triggered by a _corrupted_ shader pack in conjunction with LW, it might be even impossible to reproduce clearly. Add to that that I erased the offending shader pack, so I have no chance to make further tests. I might add some thoughts to that thread tomorrow, time to get some sleep.

» Wed May 18, 2011 11:44 pm

Sounds like you need to change the iHeap something or other settings in OSR. Change it to number 4, or whichever one is the fastest one that says it requires a .dll to run. I had the problem too, and it sounds like what happened to mine, where i slowed right down after 30 minutes or so of play. Try changing the iHeap setting. I'll get the actual name up soon, and add it in an edit.

EDIT:

_comment = Algorithms: 1=FastMM4 (requires external dll), 2=Microsoft (slow on XP), 3=SimpleHeap1, 5=ThreadHeap2
iHeapAlgorithm = 1

This is what I have. Give it a try.

» Thu May 19, 2011 10:43 am

I forgot to edit the first post, now everything works just fine.

Actually, those are exactly my OSR settings.