Below is my idea for how to tweak the perk and skill system as well as make use of the Attribute system. This is the rough draft of my idea and has some conflictions, but ultimately each Skill can get 8 Perks and each Attribute gets 5 additional perks but are actually mandatory based on level so it’s a flat out reward.

Strength:
Axe
Blunt
Long Blade
Short Blade
Spear

Endurance:
Block
Heavy Armor
Light Armor
Medium Armor
Unarmored

Intelligence:
Alteration
Conjuration
Destruction
Illusion
Restoration

Craftsmanship:
Alchemy
Smithing
Enchant
Mercantile
Speechcraft

Dexterity:
Archery
Duel Wield
Lockpicking
Pickpocketing
Sneak

Conditioning:
Acrobatics
Climbing
Hand to Hand
Running
Swimming

Now, assuming every skill begins at 5 not including racial benefits, let’s see how the “class” system or what I’d prefer to say is specialization. Which I thinks allows the character to start off like they actually DID something with their life before the game starts rather than throw them into the games quest lines like they lived in a box all their life and didn’t do anything.

Select 2 of the 6 major Attributes.

For example we’ll do Strength and Endurance.

Now, the 10 skills governed under these Attributes are given a 5 point starting boost.

The selected Attribute is given a 5 point boost.

Then select 12 Major Skills and each of these skills are given an additional 5 points.

So say we select Swimming, Running, Smithing, Climbing, Medium Armor, Long Blade, Block, Speechcraft, Axe, Heavy Armor, Blunt, and Archery.

So as you can see, this guy is quite the Athletic warrior, versed in 4 weapons, skilled in martial arts, a smith, relies on his shield for defense, and is handy in relatively weighty armors while also being able to tell a nice story.

You guessed it, he’s a former soldier who has been trained in all weapon types, and is a people person as all good soldiers ought to be. In his time with the Legion he’s lost his weapon on a number of occasions and was forced to fight with his fists, his missions took him over long treks across deserts, swamps and mountains putting him in good shape for running, swimming, and climbing.

Ok, so to get a little more serious, you see what I did there? That’s called Role-playing, that’s adding a theme to your character which sets up a standard for how to play the game and it’s always fun to do. No one creates their character and just goes “Psh, whatever, I am just gonna be a whatever, blah!”

Now I know someone is gonna say “I do that!” Well I feel sorry for you and frankly don’t believe you, EVERYONE has some vision of what they want their character to be, do you wanna mage, melee, both, or neither? Whether you put a story to it or not, it’s there.

So, now that we’re off track, let’s get back on. Ok, now let’s take a look at how your skill tree would look.

Strength: 15
Axe: 25
Blunt: 25
Long Blade: 25
Short Blade: 20
Spear: 20

Endurance: 15
Block: 25
Heavy Armor: 25
Light Armor: 20
Medium Armor: 25
Unarmored: 20

Intelligence: 10
Alteration: 15
Conjuration: 15
Destruction: 15
Illusion: 15
Restoration: 15

Craftsmanship: 10
Alchemy: 15
Smithing: 20
Enchant: 15
Mercantile: 15
Speechcraft: 20

Dexterity: 10
Archery: 20
Duel Wield: 15
Lockpicking: 15
Pickpocketing: 15
Sneak: 15

Conditioning: 10
Acrobatics: 15
Climbing: 20
Hand to Hand: 20
Running: 20
Swimming: 20

I won’t even bother taking into account Racial bonuses seeing as there’s now 30 skills rather than 23 or 18. However, if you’ve been a player of Elder Scrolls, you could probably make that out in your head. Needless to say, at most skills will start at 25, so that’s about as specialized as ya get. So now how would leveling work out? Well, let’s do some arithmetic!
Total Skill point
3000 – 450 = 2550
2550 – 50 = 2500
2500 – 60 = 2440

So, not including racial bonuses we have 2440 skill points to spread towards leveling. Now in order to limit the amount of levels you can go up, since there are so many skills. Major skills will take 25 points to level, while minors will take 30. So let’s do some more annoying math.

Major skills:
12 x 100 = 1200
1200 – 60 = 1140 (Major Skill additions)
1140 – 50 = 1090 (Major Attribute Additions)
1090 – 30 = 1060 (Gave 30 Skill points towards Race bonuses)

Minor Skills:
18 x 100 = 1800
1800 – 450 = 1350

Total Skill Distribution:
1090 + 1350 = 2440

So the Math is right on, now, let’s see how high of a level you’re character can be!

1060/20 = 53
1350/30 = 45
53 + 45 = 98

So a maximum level of 98 can be acquired for this particular system. Damn, just one shy eh?

So yes, out of 240 perks, you get to pick 98 of them, given that each Skill would have 8 perks, you can max out 12 skills out of 30 and still have two additional perk points left over. That isn’t bad. It definitely puts some limitations on characters and some replay value, similar to Skyrim with just more Skills, perk and customization.

As for Attributes…

Attributes are going to start off at level 10 and go to level 100; Major attributes get a 5 point lead. Now the attributes are all for the skills and fundamental growth of character, they don’t do anything for your Health, Magic, and Fatigue. I think that the system that Bethesda had in Skyrim was fine where you select which of them you wish to increase. Now, the attributes would level, based on how many of their skills were used.

5 skill points = 1 attribute point
These do stack over time so if you level up skill after being ready to level, they’ll follow over to the next level similar to Oblivion. So guess what now? More math! (Kill me...please..)
6 x 100 = 600
600 – 60 = 540
540 – 10 = 530 (Major Attribute bonuses)
530 x 4 = 2120
2440 – 2120 = 320

So yes, you can max out your attributes before maxing out your character, but as I said, these come as a result of doing ALL skills, so it’s only natural that even if you’re not catered towards certain things, you’re character would become efficient in the fundamentals of a skill set by utilizing all the skills, even if they aren’t specialized.

So that’s about it for now, I’ll try to include some of my thoughts and ideas on individual perks for the skills and the perks that come with Attributes later on. I’m looking for comments and criticism for this, but no, I don’t want your “This system would blow” or “This is too complicated” crap. Tell me what’s wrong with it, give me scenarios, tweaks, advice, but don’t give me your attitude. I see flaws with it, but I’ll address those later, AFTER I get some feedback.

And your Attribute breakdown demonstrates why I'm glad Attributes were removed from Skyrim, and hopefully the series - Warrior-types get hit with Multiple Attribute Dependency, AS WELL AS non-synergy within the attributes. The various weapon and attack-style skills are at odds with each other (You can't be swinging a Greatsword at the same time you're stabbing with a spear and dual-wielding an axe and a mace). You also can't wear four different kinds of armor at once effectively, making Endurance a [censored] to increase. Trying to get the two martial attributes to level at a decent rate requires a worse case of "Efficient Leveling" than even Oblivion had.

You could try to make the case that the improved attribute bonuses help compensate for the overall lower skill levels of someone who uses all weapon types equally, but that's really NOT fun to actually play - Once one skill starts pulling ahead, you have to gimp yourself to level other skills equally.

Mages, on the other hand, can focus on spells exclusively, and watch their Intelligence go through the roof - the assorted schools of magic complement instead of conflict with each other.

Skyrim has had the best leveling system in the entire series when it comes to the way skills have been condensed, and the methods for improving characters. However, that's not to say I approve of them cutting Acrobatics and athletics.

They do need to add Mobility perks, though - Not sure how they could actually implement the skill.

Good feedback, I have been attempting to think of a way to to diversify these particular skills. Attributes in my opinion however are what make characters unique. They are the physical specialization skills that make up the character, I don't know where you got duel wielding a spear and great sword from, they're obviously two handed weapons and wouldn't be able to be duel wielded, however, you simply don't get a specific skill for them. Skyrim has a short supply and cluttered skill system. I mean really, let's take commonsense as a factor. Is swinging a dagger the same as swinging a Mace? Don't think so. This system oviously needs work, but on the other hand, Attributes are not the basic foundation of a player, as I've said, you don't NEED to level them really, just play your character and they'll increase. They rally have no more purpose other then to provide extra benefits to your skills, Health, Magic, Fatigue, would follow the same exact system as they do in Skyrim.

What I need to do is see how to condense the perks from Skyrim to make them fit. Also, if you're getting the idea that "Strength makes you hit more damage per level", No. the higher you get in blade the harder you'll hit, however, Strength will add a bonus amount of damage depending on the perk level. Basically, if a player just plays the game they like to play, they'll have no problem making well balanced character.

This is my personal opinion, but I feel that everyone enjoys some form of variety in how they play. I don't really know many people, and it could just be me mnid you, that ONLY uses blade through the whole game. Everyone I know has used multiple forms of attack for various situations, whether it be Magic and Blade, Blade and Archery, or Archery and Magic.

Honestly, in Skyrim, I've found the Skills as far more definitive to my character than Attributes have ever been in previous games. The last game Attributes actually mattered to me was Daggerfall because they could be chosen at start - but even then, I still started with 80 in everything that mattered. A mace, sword, and axe all handle close enough to be allowed to share a skill - the problem is Daggers are a class to their own, and don't work with anything. There will always be synergy problems - I wish there was a more robust system, but it's not yours, but I can't think of one - I wish there was a way to get Longswords and Greatswords to synergize better.

You just kind of contradicted yourself there - Yes, weapon skill matters, but so does strength.

Weapon skill does matter, but Any swordsman would tell you that it's all in the technique, not the power. Power is of course useful, but not ultimatekly necessary. Strength adds a physical addition to your hits while your skills levels create the base power and attacks. I disagree that Maces, axes and swords handle the same. I've actually swung each of them and it's completely different for each in terms of balance, how you can attack, and the angle of the attack. This sysem isn't meant to be perfect, it's meant to add food for thought, if more of the community was open to the attributes conept, I think there'd be a lot of great input, alas, in my eyes, everyone seems to be going to the way of Bethesda, better to remove a feature than revise the feature.

Suggestions for future ES games go in http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1311878-official-beyond-skyrim-tes-vi-4/ please.