Talos, was he truely a nord? : The Elder Scrolls Series Discussion

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 7:15 am

So I've gotten into a few debates about this before with stormcloak fans but the thing is...Tiber Septim was described as being a breton from his aging and height and the fact that he could be a breton is further shown by him being born in a High Rock kingdom, now could he be part nord? Sure but that still means we should recognize the fact that he was part Breton too, the only real thing about him that was nordic in origin was his name which he got rid of in favor of Tiber Septim.

So what do you think, lore community? Do you think that Tiber was 100% nord?

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 9:52 am

I was always under the impression that he was from Atmora, making him from Nordic decent. I thought he later invaded High Rock as the strat to his military life. I could be wrong though. I havent done too much research into it though.

» Mon Jun 25, 2012 11:29 pm

I was always under the impression that he was from Atmora, making him from Nordic decent. I thought he later invaded High Rock as the strat to his military life. I could be wrong though. I havent done too much research into it though.

The "he was from Atmora" thing is imperial propaganda from the First pocket guide, which many people know should not be trusted.

As for his military life he was the General of Emperor Zero who he later betrayed, according to some stuff it was by an assassin who was sent after them both but the Assassin only managed to cut off Tiber from ever using the Thu'um again, a thing he only did once in the Battle of Sancre Tor, but many reports suggest that it was a plot that he and Zurin came up with.

» Mon Jun 25, 2012 8:18 pm

The "he was from Atmora" thing is imperial propaganda from the First pocket guide, which many people know should not be trusted.

As for his military life he was the General of Emperor Zero who he later betrayed, according to some stuff it was by an assassin who was sent after them both but the Assassin only managed to cut off Tiber from ever using the Thu'um again, a thing he only did once in the Battle of Sancre Tor, but many reports suggest that it was a plot that he and Zurin came up with.

Like I said, I haven't done much research as I really care mostly for my Dunmer. I have read from many sources though, that Atmora was his place of birth, but if that is incorrect, I will defer to those that know more.

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:05 am

What is the origin of the name "Hjalti"?

I've heard rumours that a ghost from the time of his early conquests had haunted somewhere near or in Old Hroldan and the name he spoke of was Hjalti. Assuming the rumours are true and assuming the ghost was referring to to Talos and not some minor general, would it not be safe to conclude that was his real name, as he was called by people that knew him directly, at the time he was alive and before the propaganda about him began?

Find the origin of the name and you find the origin of the man.

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:31 am

Hijati/Tiber Septim was a Breton. He is often confused with some other people like Ysmer who was a Nord and Zurin Articus.

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 8:54 am

Hijati/Tiber Septim was a Breton. He is often confused with some other people like Ysmer who was a Nord and Zurin Articus.

Once you CHIM though, he literally is everyone.

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:09 am

Where does it say Hijati was born in High Rock? Everything I read says he is from there but not born there. If he conquered Alcaire then any conquests or exploits coming from him would have him coming form there.

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 1:30 am

Once you CHIM though, he literally is everyone.

We're talking about Tiber, not Talos the god. The god was three people in one while Tiber was just Tiber Septim/Hijati.

Where does it say Hijati was born in High Rock? Everything I read says he is from there but not born there. If he conquered Alcaire then any conquests or exploits coming from him would have him coming form there.

Alcaire IS his birthplace, states it in The Arcturian Heresy which was written by the Underking himself thus its more reliable also he didn't really conquer anything until he betrayed Emperor Cuhlecain the true founder of the third empire, aka Emperor zero. He then conquered skyrim not because he felt some kind of birth loyalty or honor to the Nords but because he saw them as a threat and potential tool to aid in his conquest of Tamriel.

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 9:26 am

Where does it say Hijati was born in High Rock? Everything I read says he is from there but not born there. If he conquered Alcaire then any conquests or exploits coming from him would have him coming form there.

Arcturian Heresy. It's also a Breton sounding name. 1 + 1 usually equals 2

» Mon Jun 25, 2012 8:58 pm

The reason I single out his name Hjalti is because any reference to him that calls him be any other name has been written after the fact and is subject to fiction. Were you to focus solely on works calling him by his birth name, you will be much closer to finding out about the man and not the legend.

It is disappointing that whomever banished the ghost I mentioned did not bother to question him further.

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 6:11 am

Arcturian Heresy. It's also a Breton sounding name. 1 + 1 usually equals 2

I've read that and it does not say he was born there. It only says he was from there and the context of it sounds more military than origin.

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 1:51 am

Arcturian Heresy. It's also a Breton sounding name. 1 + 1 usually equals 2

Really? Hjalti Early-Beard sounds more Nordic then it does Breton, and his birthplace is a fair distance from the boarder to Skyrim. That being said, I do believe he does hail from Highrock.

» Mon Jun 25, 2012 8:55 pm

Really? Hjalti Early-Beard sounds more Nordic then it does Breton, and his birthplace is a fair distance from the boarder to Skyrim.

I have to agree with this

» Mon Jun 25, 2012 10:28 pm

Really? Hjalti Early-Beard sounds more Nordic then it does Breton, and his birthplace is a fair distance from the boarder to Skyrim.

But then thing is people say he is a true nord but in all terms we know he really wasn't, thats partly the arguement.

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:12 am

Arcturian Heresy. It's also a Breton sounding name. 1 + 1 usually equals 2

Coincidently, I was searching my library for that very book. I believe it may be the best source on his early years, though it clearly contains much fiction. Perhaps this is a question that we can not answer in truth.

» Mon Jun 25, 2012 9:15 pm

We're talking about Tiber, not Talos the god. The god was three people in one while Tiber was just Tiber Septim/Hijati.

My bad, the thread title threw me off

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 4:01 am

Coincidently, I was searching my library for that very book. I believe it may be the best source on his early years, though it clearly contains much fiction. Perhaps this is a question that we can not answer in truth.

Its hard to believe that the underking would write fiction.

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:16 am

Ahh, I found the passage from Arcturian Heresy I was looking for,

Hjalti was from the island kingdom of Alcaire, in High Rock, and would become Tiber Septim, the First Emperor of Tamriel.

The way that is written, it would suggest that was considered his origin. I know not why the author would state this if it was any other way. That in itself does not make him a Breton, but it is certainly compelling.

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 4:10 am

Its hard to believe that the underking would write fiction.

Perhaps I should say, "creative exaggeration", or "misremembered truths"? I place not total faith in words written by anyone or anything. Everything has an agenda.

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 10:00 am

Ahh, I found the passage from Arcturian Heresy I was looking for,

The way that is written, it would suggest that was considered his origin. I know not why the author would state this if it was any other way. That in itself does not make him a Breton, but it is certainly compelling.

I read it differently. Also his name does sound very Nordish and coupled with the other readings that suggests he is from Atmora and attacked High Rock further lends to my theory he was from Atmora and not initially from High Rock

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 8:07 am

Well its more so that he looked, was as tall and aged like a breton.

» Mon Jun 25, 2012 9:42 pm

Well its more so that he looked, was as tall and aged like a breton.

I still say more Nord in recent statues but come to think of it, in Oblivion, he does look more Breton.

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 4:06 am

Myes, I think Talos, I mean Tiber Septim, I mean Hjalti Early-Beard was a Breton who, as the Acturian Heresy dictates, was confused with Ysmir (Wulfharth), who was just -very- clever with hiding the truth, thus making him seem... shall we say godlike?

» Tue Jun 26, 2012 6:57 am

I still say more Nord in recent statues but come to think of it, in Oblivion, he does look more Breton.

Notice the statues in skyrim look nordic because for some reasons the nords really want to believe Tiber was a nord.

Myes, I think Talos, I mean Tiber Septim, I mean Hjalti Early-Beard was a Breton who, as the Acturian Heresy dictates, was confused with Ysmir (Wulfharth), who was just -very- clever with hiding the truth, thus making him seem... shall we say godlike?

I think it was more because the greybeards named Tiber "Ysmir, the dragon of the north." Thats why people tend to get confused by it.