Do you believe that if the technology allow the developers to do some really awesome things in the game and the gameplay they wont do it because of the lore? i really dont believe that, i didnt made that thread a poll because i dont want just yes or no, i want you to say why you believe what you believe

I think they won't give or show us certain things because a lot of Elder scrolls fans are lore freaks. If they changed up the game just to make it better and changed it not according to lore then 75% of Elder scrolls fans would have a cow. :flamethrower:

So the lore its something that is holding the game back, is that what you re saying???!!!!!!

Jimis, you know how I feel, but I will explain so you understand how I feel and why.

In The Elder Scrolls, lore is important. The games may have the technology to do the neat things you suggested, but the Elder Scrolls has a lot more lore than just the games. A LOT! The Elder Scrolls may have the tech to summon dragons of flame or create horses of water, but the huge world they've built disagrees with it. The world of Mundus, Oblivion, and Aetherius is far bigger than any of the games, or even all of the games.

If you delve into the world as I have, it isn't a series of games, it's an entirely different world. That's why I'm so fanatical when it comes to the lore. I'll give you a few examples so that you understand what I mean.

In Oblivion, we met Uriel Septim (as well as Arena and Daggerfall). But what do we not know about the Septim Dynasty? Pelagius is the craziest emperor to ever rule (think Nero of the Roman Empire). Tiber Septim was either betrayed by or betrayed the Underking, Zurin Arcturus and became known as Talos Stormcrown. That Uriel Septim isn't the direct descendent of Tiber Septim, but rather a cousin (2nd cousin or 2x removed).

In Morrowind, we met Vivec. But did you know that the mer (even dwemer) all came from the long lost land of Aldmeris and were all part of the Aldmer race (proto-mer). One branch of Aldmer followed Prophet Veloth and worshipped Boethiah, Azura, and Mephala. These eventually became the Dunmer, because Azura cursed them for the mistakes of three members of their race.

In Daggerfall (and again in Oblivion), we met Mannimarco. But did you know that he was an arch-rival of the founder of the Mages' Guild? He was also the first lich.

Just a few examples of the world. Again I say, it's not a game series, it's a wondrous world that is vastly different from ours. If given the opportunity, I'd love to travel to Morrowind and see Azura's Coast. Or see Cyrodiil's White-Gold Tower. Or view the Summerset Isles. It's an amazing universe that is so unique that I can't help but be immersed in it. Jimis, I hope this better enlightens you on why I contested you in your thread about controlled magic.

I understand all these, but what they have to do all these with what i say about the gameplay and be able to handle your spells, can you please answer to me that question?

Jimis, in some regards it holds it back. But it holds it together. It prevents things like dragons that lead armies of daedra against the Empire. But it also helps bind the franchise together so that everything makes sense. Retconning lore too much makes it hard to follow. A lot of Elder Scrolls fans play for that lore. It's like a planet. You have to keep the fundamental stuff (the core) the same (the continent, the races, etc). You can modify the stuff outside it to a degree (the mantle) (magic, nobles, royalty, etc). You can modify the outter stuff as much as you like (the crust) (basic stuff like villains and heroes)

Jimis, the topic got outside of remote-control fireballs and into conjuring creatures that do not exist in the Elder Scrolls lore. Which is as I stated above, the core of TES.

You are not answering my question and this really worries me about the developement of this discussion, what the lore has to do with your mage being able to handle his spells after casting?

*sigh* Being able to have remote control fireballs is one thing. Being able to dominate conjured creatures is another. It's mentally straining to even have them in the same realm as you, after ripping them out of Oblivion or the Waters of Oblivion (depending on where they are in the life-cycle), much less being able to manually control them.

*rubs tempols and breathes deep breaths* It'd be a bit time-consuming to script it to be able to turn fireballs into monkey-heads or arrows, or shields, or whatever it is you want. It's easier on the developers to just have it all be a fireball, lightning bolt, or icebolt.

If it really is set 200 years later, there's little they could do that wouldn't fit.

There's little politically... But in the metaphysics and magicka laws of Tamriel won't change.

Time in TES world isn't the same as in our world... so you can't compare it with that. It's like in LOTR.

Having deleted several posts for flaming this topic has become out of hand. Either discuss constructively without name calling or you will be hearing from a moderator via PM.

I don't understand why it can't go hand in hand. What type of technological advance in game would prevent the lore from being done properly? Or do you mean technology advances in the actual gameplay?

I think he means that lore prevents some technological advances from being used.

I see. In that case, I don't see how so. Better graphics/more realistic or fluid dynamics and the ability to 'do more' in game will only effect what type of visuals we can achieve or how much can be done in game.. The core basis of the lore won't be affected by that?....

Mind giving some examples for those "really awesome things in the game and the gameplay" that might be hold back by lore? I have a hard time picturing anything...

They are making a game, not a book. But it is important to stick with the series, as it is in ANY game. You don't play sequals of other games where they go back or do something totally different to what has been said.

Well in his previous thread he spoke of dragons being summoned by the player made of pure fire and horses being summoned by the player made of water. I think that's what he's referring to, but I'm not sure (I AM NOT SURE!)

I don't think technological advancement and new shiny things a game engine can do really effect the lore, I don't think they go hand in hand. But if this summoning dragons made of fire and whatnot that the OP apparently stated in a previous thread happened then I think its inconsistent with the other games. If I could do this really fancy spell in Skyrim, why couldn't I do it in the previous games? Take a really basic spell, like fireball from Morrowind to Oblivion, all it did is look better and had a nice effect when it the target, but it was still in essence the exact same spell, just a technological improvement on how its delivered.

I assume this is the sort of thing we're talking about? It was a bit vague reading through

I'd rather play a game with an awesome story and poor gameplay than the opposite.

http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1153506-handling-your-spells-after-casting/

It is mainly us arguing over whether said ability should be allowed. I don't know if this is what he's talking about, but I'm pretty sure it is.

I agree, no new spell effects unless the lore explains it (don't know how much Bethesda could or would play around with this, if at all).
Otherwise leave it to the modding community to make this kind of spells.

Amen to that guys. I argued for like 4 pages on why it shouldn't be, due to lore. I'm a total lore freak. If I want cool gameplay or combat, I'll put in CoD. I love tobe immersed in The Elder Scrolls Universe. Mundus, sorry.