As you all know, the Dwemer went Poof. The denizens of Tamriel took this as a sign that technology is bad. Of course, someone has to get over that fear sometime, right? How long would it take for Tamriel to hit a point of technological advancement comparable to now, and would they still use magic?

You've got to remember (and I think Dwarven technology reflects this quite well), that it's unlikely Tamrielic machines would resemble our own technology in any way- they have magic, and it'd be incorporated into the machinery in some way.

However, I have a theory (pure speculation on my part) that there's some kind of divine conspiracy that prevents Tamriel from developing their technology. Look at the Dwemer. Almost all dead (ie. Yagrum). Then there's Sotha Sil. Also dead. Combine magic with machinery (and really, with magic around, it's the only logical way to go) and you'll have an untimely demise.

Also: So, there's another example why magic and machines don't mix- even though they kinda have to on Nirn.

They will NEVER reach our technological area, unless Bethesda decides, "We've made enough money off the TES series, lets just end it here."

There's a reason that most magical cultures in fiction are not technologically advanced as well. If you've got magical staffs (staves?), spells and enchantments, what exactly is gunpowder and machinery needed for?

However, I think this only holds up for Nirn if you assume that normal magic is more varied than it is represented in games - which I think is fair. Maybe there are spells for simple things like cleaning clothes and automating tedious work, but the player doesn't see them. Then again, the Dunmer keep slaves, but I don't know if this is to make work easier/faster or mostly because it's tradition and they want to feel superior! We know that they don't need modern medicine since they have cure disease spells/potions. I highly doubt that the disapperance of the Dwemer is the main motivating factor for people not having technology; after all, Sotha Sil has his clockwork city and such and people don't seem particularly disapproving or afraid of that. Also, I think the main message about the disappearance of the Dwemer is against arrogance, not technology - they thought they could gain divinity or harness the power of the heart, and it destroyed them (or did it?). The Tribunal suffered the same fate in some ways.

So yeah, I think technology won't play much of a role unless magic wanes or they devise some machinery for harvesting and things like TV, internet etc (which don't have much of a magical anologue). And outside of lore reasons... it wouldn't have the same kind of atmosphere and be the same kind of game if it was focused on the beginnings of a technological modern society. Not necessarily worse, but different.

And you have to consider: does Nirn have fossil fuels? We use dead dinosaur and plant remains from hundreds of millions of years ago. The mundus hasn't been around that long.

That's one of the fun things I find with fantasy worlds: you don't have to make the available resources the same as they are on Earth. You can also tweak physics. Cold fusion? Why not?

Yet the machines they have now look pretty similar to what Earth would have in a technologically equivalent era. Magic does not seem to have as much an impact on the development of technology as one would largely expect to be the case, most likely because coming up with plausible worlds that are dramatically different from our own is hard, so most creators of fantasy prefer to just take our own world and throw in some elves and wizards and dragons, change the geography and names around, sugarcoat some of the more unpleasant details, and call it a completely original world.

But the Dwemer didn't just make technology, they combined steam powered machines and magic, and played around with the heart of a god, that's a bit different from just making more complex machines, no one is going to dissappear just because they did that, and if the research scholars have been doing on Dwemer has not gone to waste, they would know this, and would not let it hold them back from progress.



It's hard to say, but if there is not fossil fuels as we know them, I'm sure that there are other things the people of Tamriel could use to achieve the same effect, if nothing else, they might be able to use machines fueled by magic to achieve similar functions to modern technnology.



Probably true, but not for any sort of logical lore reason, rather, it's simply because putting guns and cars into the game would dramatically alter the feel of the series, and would likely drive away the current fanbase, not to mention new players looking for a good high fantasy RPG might be put off somewhat by their being guns in their fantasy.



By that logic, if you can just burn someone with magical fire, what's the point in using a sword or bow? And why would you need bridges to span rivers if you can just walk on the water or levitate over it? Why would you need stares if you can just levitate up to your room?

That sort of argument falls short because it fails to take into account one thing, any given fantasy society probably uses a fair amount of things that they wouldn't need if they can just use magic for all their needs, some settings will try to justify this by saying that not everyone can use magic or anything of the like, yet if that is the case, then those people who can't use magic would want to improve their technology so that they could do things they can't do at the time. Other settings will just offer no explaination at all and expect audiences to just accept it because of the MST3K Mantra. It's hard to say if the Elder Scrolls falls into the latter category or if it's just gameplay mechanics that allows a simple peasant to use some spells, at least as far as I know, since I haven't read the novel, maybe that provides a more accurate representation of how pravelent magic use is in Tamriel, and how much it effects the daily life of average people.

The only reason that Nirn might get Technological upgraded if something from another unknown world comes in , which would make one hell of crazy side story.

every being on nirn is capable of harnassing some of Magnus's power, and some more than others depending on how much "spirit" they have. however, spells are expensive. even the cheapest ones in oblivion cost 100+ septims, and the average cyrodillian makes around 5 a year. In morrowind, the Tevivani's keep the prices down to 20 or so gold, and the average Vvardenfellian makes around 200 gold (So i'm assumin that septims are much, much more valuble than the Morrowind currency.) This explains why magic was more widespread in Morrowind, and even required to get some places.

Or more likely, it's simply that people complained about having too much gold in Morrowind, so Bethesda reduced the amount of gold you're likely to get, which also meant reducing the value of most items, of course, it still didn't work out, but that's beside the point. Sometimes poor game balance is just poor game balance, and doesn't mean anything as far as lore is concerned.

Well, not everyone is good at magic, so they have to use swords and bows instead - or staves so they don't have to know magic themselves. We can see this in the player character, or any of the people you are sent to cure who can't cure themselves with magic. Telvanni DON'T use stairs, because they are all skilled with magic, and should be able to levitate. I agree in general with your point (this is a problem in lots of magic-oriented fantasy books), but for Tamriel I think it's true to say that the majority of people do need bridges and stairs because they're just normal people, not mages.

Oh yeah, and Don't forget makes a good point... though it's never really clear how much the average citizen makes per day (some NPCs mention such things but it's always a really silly amount of gold like 5 septims that can't possibly be true). But enchantments and spells are too expensive for the general public.

Well...technically, all of the magic and some of the technology on Nirn DOES come from another world, or the place that existed before the world to be more specific.

Which is why fantasy is both the most difficult genre to write well and the most rewarding when successful. The only time a person can assume the rules of our world apply are where specifically stated.

As for technology, there's no phobia, but when you can cure almost any disease with a hand wave and incantation, why bother developing vaccines? When you can telekinetically lift a massive crate, why build cranes? If you can make an exploding fireball, why make bombs?

Also, magitechnology doesn't necessarily fail in TES. The ingenium only failed because of

Hm is there any clue of the world before.

Two words: [censored] up. Non-sequential space-time and constant shifting of what does and does no exist. At least that's how it got explained to me.

So in short terms nothing left at all. Is Nern in a continuous cycle which this happens. After a while somthing has to happen technologically but I don't think anything close to us. All I can see Higher tech angers the gods which leads to some great disaster like stated in previous post. But hey who's says a portal won't open from a different world unknown. But there's enough of unknown stuff already so most likely Bethesda won't add something with drastic lore ripping.

Actually, the Gods themselves probably used tech, or at least their first offspring were said to arrive in a space ship, which is now one of the Towers which holds Mundus together.

So Daedra are alien offspring ? Well this is getting a tad odd.

Effort. Most of our machines are actually there to reduce effort, not bring a whole new idea into the world for which we can or can't imagine a magical equivalent. For example, before dishwashers, they had these things called rags. And before cars, people were forced to wear much more practical shoes or make space on their land for horses. If magic were effortless, it wouldn't cost gold, it wouldn't cost magicka, you wouldn't need to train in it to be good, and the time/cost/battles/items required to make enchantments would never be worth it.

I mean, Selbeth asked why swords and bows instead of fireballs. The answer is the same reason some of us prefer to play as warriors instead of mages. Carrying around 30 restore magicka potions and having to wait to cast your next fireball while the enemy keeps attacking you is annoying. Also, magic is flashy and not at all sneaky in the way that shooting an arrow from out of the dark is.

Some technology exists because it is easier than magic. As long as the rich people have a combination of slave labor, commoners, and magic to solve their problems, there is no reason for that technology to catch up to ours.

The other thing is that technology doesn't have much way of spreading, unless it's needed to fight a war or something. Even if some eccentric altmer mage-scholar somewhere invents the dishwasher, there are probably so many lesser daedra and ancient mechanical traps between his laboratory and the nearest town that nobody will ever discover it. If someone did, without the concepts of assembly lines and mass production (at least, I haven't seen those yet), it would just mean that there were two people on Nirn with dishwashers.

No..not the Daedra..they never reproduced in that way.

The other guys..the "good" gods..the Aedra. Their offspring became the mortal races in most creation myths. Only a few Daedric cultists and the Dunmer believe the Daedra produced the mortal races, and that's because they were tricked by lies of "good" Daedra like Boethia.