If its anything like my attempted fruit bowl, far too long.

Another realy anoying thing about spell casting in Oblivion, was no matter what spell you cast, you would light up like a cristmas tree, alerting every hostile NPC in 100 feet. I dont see why I would light up when casting anything other than a destruction spell.

I think the lighting effect exists so that the player can tell when an NPC is using magic. I think the PC lights up so that mages have something more than raised hands with which to display their abilities to the player. Reasonable though it may be that magic would not require a fireworks display, it is satisfying to see for most players.

I assume that the devs felt that this was necessary for balancing the gameplay so that magic wasn't somehow overpowered when in the company of a high Sneak skill. If I recall correctly, an enemy hit by an arrow is immediately alerted to the PC's presence (though a very high Sneak skill paired with a distant proximity could cause the PC to be almost immediately hidden once again). Magic includes many abilities other than long distance damage though and so perhaps they thought it overpowered for a mage to be able to cast any number of spells on Self without revealing his presence. Though, I am sure this could be remedied with a percentage chance to be spotted rather than a definite one.

Actually, a quote I heard before heading into the backcountry of Glacier National Park was that deer kill more people than bears. First they're eating trail mix outta your hand, then, gouging you in the face and chest with trail sharpened hooves.

Edit*

I get real geeky when it comes to organizing my house. Biggest complaint in Morrowind? Overflow loot bag, In Oblivion? Sensitive physics. Some type of dumbed down sims version of housebuilding. There's an awesome a mini game right there. I can't explain how much time I've spent organizing suits of armor on the floor, trying to put helmets on top of skulls, getting every bottle of wine into a wine rack.

I spent hours moving things in Oblivion, so I've just learned how it works and gotten used to it... I don't want to say I'm a master at it, but I'm pretty good...

I've made fruit bowls (and soups, sandwiches, put bowls in fireplaces for cooking and filled them with ingredients, etc.), set tables, organized bookshelves, sorted out clothes, put those fabric rolls into their racks, put swords into sword racks, etc. It takes a ridiculously long amount of time to get used to, which is why I think it should be better...

Wasn't it better in Fallout 3? *runs to check*

By better, things accross the table didn't spill if you picked up a cup. The actions you mentioned should be completed in your inventory. So you drag a flower over to the vase, for example, and when you drop the vase, the flower's in the vase. I don't know, I hate houses and clutter, but I hate leaving the houses I rob with things strewn about on the floor.

How about *REAL* sneak sounds?
When you're trying to perform a stealthy action not only should the sound be quieter but it should be an entirely different sound. Try this (IRL) go to a squeaky door and open it. Pay attention to the sound. Now open the same door again trying to make as little sound as possible. It sounds entirely different. Not just quieter, or even quieter and slowed down, it is an entirely different sound - THAT'S what I want to hear when sneaking...

Edit - SS

That always bugs me too, and they never clean it up!


What bugged me the most wasn't the sound, it was the lacking of feeling that you were sneaking. There were some things to hide behind, but your character never pressed-up against a wall while sneaking, or ducked their head down so people couldn't see them.

However, sneaking has mainly to do with sound IRL. If they look your direction and you aren't hidden, you're as good as caught if it isn't pitch black, or if they have a light. However, if you're silent, you don't give them a reason to look in the first place.

P.S. Zenimax Online is working with http://www.umbrasoftware.com/index.php?page=clients2, so Bethesda already knows about it, for those of you who've suggested it in the past.

I'd like to see some longer spells, for example instead of pushing a button and you shoot a fireball you could hold the same button and fire a more powerful fire ball depending on how long you held that button for, this would also give the chance to make some more animations!

Well I think for the most part we will have agree to disagree (I hate doing that haha). My sis (who provided me with most of this information and places where I obtained my information has dual degrees in horticulture and conservation. But this entire debate is flawed for a great many reasons: 1. Of each animal talked about there are many species with different behaviors, they also live in different parts of the world and therefore have different habits. 2. Elder Scrolls does take place in a fantasy world and therefore you could never truly argue how a creature should act, a wolf in real life can't be used as a base to judge a fantasy wolf (no matter how similar they may seem). 3. Real hard data and facts are hard to come by due to politics, dated information, or not enough information.

That being said, I can certainly understand many of the objections you have with how I would like to see the next game done. I still do believe that the animals in the game were completely misrepresented in their behaviors. Several of your arguments are still up for debate (such as: whether animals are not conscious of their own mortality, and how wolves gained a negative association, human/animal interaction.) Also if you could provide a link to an article from a reliable source instead of the San Fransisco bay area newspaper, newspapers have printed plenty of false stories before.

I believe the natural thought process and instincts of nearly all animals (lemmings aside) is to survive. So when an animal attacks a creature that it wants to eat but the creature fights back in almost every case the animal will retreat and risk wounds, or death. Also, I believe wolves gained a negative reputation due to their size (much larger than most domesticated dogs), their association with the night (howling at night), the deep growl they can produce, their raw strength and power, as well as the fact that most predatory animals have a negative association due to the fact that they prey on other animals (humans have a natural instinct to fear the unknown as well as fear any possible threat). Also until you know all the details and facts with a missing person you can't really assume anything. Hikers die most often from underestimating the duration of their trip, loosing the trail, hiking related injuries etc.


PLUS there has never been a documented attack by an Orc against a human.

Seriously though, like you said it is a video game... but I would rather have animals act identical to their real life counterparts to create a more believable immersive experience. This would also allow for a hunter style character in order to harvest pelts, teeth, meat, claws, bones, etc.






Yes you are correct, I shouldn't have said never. I just think that the vast majority of misunderstood animals that are used in video games are portrayed in an even more negative light. I also think that it's a shame for those of us that like to immerse ourselves into the game.




By the way, what do you all think of my new magic system idea?
"I would like to a more intuitive magic system.

Magic is supposed to be this dynamic ability in which a person can manipulate an unseen force through the use of certain energies.

Rather than having everyone in the land be able to cast certain spells at level 1 then others at level 2, etc. I suggest magic should be much more energy based and the system should remain invisible.

In my opinion: mages who specialize in a certain kind of magic would have to practice manipulating the energies involved in that magic. So if a aspiring necromancer wants to raise a body they must study among the dead and interact with the dark energies which power their magic. The same goes for druids in the forests, in order to become a good druid you must spend time in the wilderness.
So when the player works with the church and makes pilgrimages they are becoming more proficient at using divine power to their advantage.

In order for higher level casters to benefit from their experience why not make a system where they can specialize (buy) in certain "magical components". These magical components could be (for example) impact, area damage, piercing, wall, explosive, range, accuracy (I dont know i'm kind of throwing these out there as an idea)

So rather than learning "Level 1: Flare" the mage would learn a simple spell similar to flare but pertaining to the energy they study the most. By level 2 they would have points to spend on magical components, so lets say they buy impact and explosive. The spell now has a chance at knocking back opponents as well as exploding causing damage to others nearby. These magical components work to extend how the mage uses the energies to be more effective.

So the mage who ONLY uses fire abilities could eventually walk into a room and cause a massive explosion destroying everything. But if mages want to study more than one form of magic they could do so as well (slightly weaker in each field but more rounded).

Each element of magic (fire, water, wind, divine, undead, etc) would have it's own magical components to spend points into. Also the mage would be able to customize each spell, so if you want to bring up a wall of vines to stop your enemies you can and then another spell that shoots a thorned wooden arrow to pick them off from afar you could.

The system would change the appearance of the spells as you add certain magical components to them.

I feel this would make mages much more unique, as well as making magic a much more immersive and believable experience."

Related to this...

If you pick up an item (not adding it to your inventory, just physically lifting it up) for one, the NPCs shouldn't throw a fit if I knock something over then put it back. I think they should only react if I move it out of a specific area. Even then, instead of reporting it as stealing, they should first say something like "Where do you think you're going with that?" or "Hey, get back here!" If I don't within three to five seconds, THEN report it as a crime.

Secondly, if they don't want me going in and moving stuff, then they should react when I draw my weapon and begin bashing things all over the place. That should be a crime (destruction of personal property.)

I want to see some creatures that actually take strategy to kill. Not just pressing the same button over, and over again until it's dead.

After watching a bunch of martial arts movies I think it would be awesome if a very detailed hand to hand system would be in the game(Blocking, counterattacking, holds, kicking etc). Maybe even several different styles.

Of course seeing how fast paced the gameplay is in TES, you would need to have great reflexes.

Naturally-occurring animals are overly aggressive in TES so that players feel that there is more of a point to traveling long distances in real time. Dungeons & Dragons has always remedied this by having an unsatisfying, inconceivable amount of unnatural-looking monsters all bunched up together in small ecosystems that would never arise on Earth nor any other planet in the universe. Though in both cases, the real action is to begin when the PC enters a dungeon.

Personally, I do not like either of the aforementioned scenarios but they are both preferable to having an expansive environment with zero gameplay offered while traversing it. Some games (including D&D to an extent) remedy this by implementing streamlined movement (possibly on an overland map) that is sometimes interrupted by a random encounter. I thought Dragon Age did this particularly well. Random encounters allow individual types of monsters to appear much less often, improving believability.

Traveling on an overland map is obviously contrary to TES tradition, but it is the only palatable alternative to an abundance of aggressive creatures (whether naturally-occurring or not) in my opinion.

Did you see Havok's behavior demo with the ninjas?

That'd be awesome (with better animations/graphics/characters) in TES, and it's using Havok!!

Perhaps Beth is making a mistake making this an RPG, maybe it could just be a fantasy themed home design game. Seriously, I did some of that too.

I would love to see something similar to hardcoe mode in Diablo. At least to me it would make the game more realistic and strategic trying to survive at all cost knowing that if you die your character will get deleted, it makes it that more exciting. It would also make it so you cant just rush the hell out of like 7 enemies at once thinking well if i die i will just go to my last save and try again, you would actually have to think and approach each situation with caution.

Personally, I think that is a tad too extreme. A TES game can last you hundreds of hours, even thousands with mods, and to have that all disappear if you die even once is waaaaay too "hardcoe." It may work for Diablo, but it wouldn't work for TES.

I know what you mean, but im not saying that every character you make will be on hardcoe. Like you can have your main character but also create a new one on a hardcoe mode and see how long you can last until you die. Ive spent as many hours on diablo characters as ive had on tes characters, but it gets to a certain point at which i need something more exciting or challenging from time to time. Like in diablo me and my friends would make new characters on hardcoe and see who can get to the highest level before you die.

Not a bad idea. Old fan of Nethack and ADOM likes. Of course that would be just an option, very easily added, mind you. Not for casual players at all... would make every single fight meaningful, and every single succes feel better, while dying almost as terrible as dying irl

I guess they could use it for an "insane" mode.

What I'd really like to see in a hardcoe more is no fast travel. So if you start a game in hardcoe mode, you wont ever be tempted to use fast travel because it isn't there. Of course it would be nice if Bethesda would put in a Morrowind-esque travel system in it's place.

What I love about Morrowind systems, is it creates "drop-off" points. It's like you're on a trip to go exploring, a person takes you on a bus, drops you off, and can only offer to bring you back to where you came from, as apposed to "And this, is the beautiful scenic location #3 full of water, we aptly named: Lake."

I think what would make it better, is if it was active. Not just a "teleport to this location" but if you could actually ride the Silt Strider, take a boat ride, or go on a caravan to another major city (and have things happen along the way).

The only thing is, they have to be fast, so it isn't just like running except the inconvenience of having a group of bandits trying to raid your caravan.

Lets add some bigger wildlife into TES. Mastodons, titans, kraken, sea serpents. These should be rare but awe-inspiring/terrifying. And while this isn't lore friendly, I'd love it if Bethesda adds a dragon, similar to the high dragons in Dragon Age: Origins (and ability to tame it).

In TES, dragons are just as intelligent, if not more so, than men/mer. With it's intelligence, you wouldn't be taming it, you'd be enslaving it. Even if there were dragons in the game, their function would be the same as any other NPC, not a creature. I'd like to see other big creatures, but not dragons like in Dragon Age: Origins.

I know it's not a very reasonable request, but after seeing the Akatosh mounts mod and the awesomeness of the high dragon in DA:O, how great would it be to fly on the high dragon over Skyrim?

On a separate note, here are some ways to add immersion:
- Ability to see your legs/feet in first person. For those who played Mirror's Edge, you know what I'm talking about.
- When running, add a subtle up-and-down vision effect to simulate this. Pants and heavy breaths should follow continuous running.
- When attacked / or the verge of death, there should be blurring of vision / blood splattering/ blacking out.