TES V Ideas and Suggestions #168

Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 5:24 am

Welcome to TES V Ideas and Suggestions # 168

This thread is for ideas and suggestions for TES:V and to keep all the general discussion in one series of threads.

To discuss major issues, use a separate topic, such as the levelling topic.

Other general topics on this will either be closed or moved here.

Please at least try to read the previous few threads to avoid too much repetition: Note, there has been a lot of off topic and unnecessary discussion in past topics, please ensure that any posts you make in this thread are suitable to the subject being discussed. The moderators will be keeping a close eye on the content.

http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=1068896
http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=1070974
http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=1071845
http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=1073698
http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=1075858
http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=1077394
http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=1078557
http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1080894-tes-v-ideas-and-suggestions-thread-%23157/
http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1082671-tes-v-ideas-and-suggestions-thread-%23158/
http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1084035-tes-v-ideas-and-suggestions-thread-%23159/
http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1085256-tes-v-ideas-and-suggestions-thread-%23160/
http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1086102-tes-v-ideas-and-suggestions-thread-%23161/
http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1087658-tes-v-ideas-and-suggestions-thread-no-162/
http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1089003-tes-v-ideas-and-suggestions-163/
http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1090035-tes-v-ideas-and-suggestions-164/
http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1090714-tes-v-ideas-and-suggestions-165/
http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1092018-tes-v-ideas-and-suggestions-166/
http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1094008-tes-v-ideas-and-suggestions-167/
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Liii BLATES
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 5:58 am

I would love to see a "party city" where there is a huge nightlife with constant socialization going on. It would be cool to have skooma dealers there too and games to gamble on. One thing about Oblivion was in alot of places there was nothing to do at night,but this would be fun to kill some and be fun.

Also getting married and having a family would be fun, If done right. Or at least some form of relationships.
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rae.x
 
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Post » Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:30 pm

There shouldn't be any armorers who sell the armor they make out of their own shop. Not that they'd get a lot of customers coming in every day or anything, but once you start working on a piece, you can't just drop everything to help a customer. If you want armor or repairs, you need to talk to the sales rep at the store that would sell the armor. Then you haggle for how many days the repair will take and how much you will spend for that, and come back when it's ready.
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Samantha Mitchell
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 1:50 pm

There shouldn't be any armorers who sell the armor they make out of their own shop. Not that they'd get a lot of customers coming in every day or anything, but once you start working on a piece, you can't just drop everything to help a customer. If you want armor or repairs, you need to talk to the sales rep at the store that would sell the armor. Then you haggle for how many days the repair will take and how much you will spend for that, and come back when it's ready.


This sound good enough, but this also means that the player has to take more time when repairing his own armor.
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Kortniie Dumont
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 7:37 am

This sound good enough, but this also means that the player has to take more time when repairing his own armor.

More time than zero seconds? I'm completely with you there mate.
Shades has a point. In TES2 repairs took a day, that is another thing where improvement was abandoned for easiness.
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Jeffrey Lawson
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:38 am

With recent threads about it and being a current subject, I figured I'd repost some stuff on how I'd like to see general equipment working. Mostly old, a little new, entirely too long as always.

Ideally the damage of a weapon would be based on its type and the momentum behind it, instead of a direct number. A more skilled fighter can swing a blade faster and efficiently, getting in harder strikes more often, but the blade itself doesn't somehow get sharper. Combat is about not getting hit in the first place, and armor is there to protect you when you do. Armor that simply reduces by a % the damage you take is, by definition, terrible armor because apparently the weapon is going right through it every time. Penetration would depend on factors such as weapon material vs armor material, damage type vs armor type, and momentum vs contact. Armor skills (in my set) would be reduced to a single dodging-in-armor skill; the same attack directed at a stationary target will be much less effective against someone skilled at moving in armor, as the strike will only land glancing blows and scraqe across armor instead of punching through it. Skill with a weapon would increase the speed and efficiency of swings, making it easier to get past someone's guard and land solid hits, doing more damage faster without actually increasing a flat damage number. The job of the armor is to prevent damage in most cases (extra important in a deadlier combat system, but that's not the subject here), with the most successful attacks puncturing it and doing grievous damage. Any random character would not suddenly become invincible to lighter attacks by putting on some heavy plate, as they need the dodge ability and stats to use the armor in order to move well, making them an easy target for those light attacks that they're too slow to deal with. The odds of being struck in weak points such as joints in the armor increase significantly if the character cannot use their armor effectively to redirect those attacks toward stronger points, or who lack the skill to ward off those light attackers and not be swarmed.

Armor would have several stats instead of "defense", some of the most important being recommended stats and resistances. There is no set requirement to put on a piece of armor, but depending on the item there would be recommended stats for strength, agility, endurance, etc. The further you are from recommendations the larger the penalties to things such as movement. Resistances determine the armor's ability to absorb attack, and are broken up into two parts. Damage resistance determines how effectively the armor blocks that type of attack, such as "slashing 40%." Higher resistance lowers the odds of that attack type penetrating, and reduces damage when it does. Armor resistance is how well the armor itself can withstand that attack type. For example, a plate made specifically to be fireproof will have high values for fire in both categories. A more common plate might still protect you somewhat effectively from fire by keeping it an inch or two away from your skin, but will have low resistance to it itself and suffer severe melting damage with repeated strikes. Softer, padded armor might protect you well from cold, but be much more vulnerable itself to freezing than metal armor, dramatically lowering its physical resistances for a time. Both resistance tend to vary with armor type and material.

Weapons are less obvious, generally showing the same recommendations as well as a few damage types. While how the weapon is swung affects the damage type, the damage type % shows what types it leans most heavily toward. Weapons aren't made for damage absorption and do not list resistances, as much of their wear and tear comes from striking armor whose values you can't see. The higher the damage and armor resistance against the damage type the weapon uses, the more its durability will be damaged by being used against that target. Likewise, damage taken while blocking strikes depend on the skill of the attacker and the defender's parry skill, as well as the respective materials and weapon types. The lower a weapon's durability, the less likely it is to penetrate armor and the more likely it is to break (heavy durability drop) if used to block a heavy attack with comparitively low parrying skill. The lower armor's durability, the more likely it is to be punctured. More skilled fighters can dodge more effectively in armor, lowering the damage it takes, and can also strike more efficiently and aim for points of least resistance, lowering damage to the weapon.

Equipment of both types would be capable of suffering from "wounds", similar to the player, though obviously of different types. These would be shown in icons in the item's stats. Metal armor with melting damage might be more brittle, dropping its resistance to blunt attacks, while a suit with many holes has a greater chance of being bypassed entirely. Many forms of armor damage are resolved with basic repairs, but some require special intervention. As with character wounds, armor damage would present a percentage value when hovered over to show its severity, such as "Frozen: 38%". Alongside reduced durability this also shows how easily the armor might be repaired. Dents can be hammered out anywhere, but once the "Dented" effect drops to zero and vanishes, further durability cannot be restored if other forms of damage are not so simple. Likewise, the trade-off is never 100%. If the armor lost 30 durability to the denting damage, it will not get all 30 back when it is fixed. Field repairs, as such, will not last forever and eventually the suit will need complete repair, although the player's skill will improve this ratio.

What complete repair entails depends on the armor type, and will generally require more time and effort. If the player lacks needed skills, this typically involves finding a professional to repair it for them, for a fee. If they can do it themselves, they will still need the appropriate supplies and workspace, such as a forge and some of the same material for metal armor. Equipment, like many items, also carries a 1-100 "quality" value. Separate from durability, this is an overall representation of the item's quality, and in the case of equipment, typically is a measure of the skill of whoever created it. A basic iron plate, though still basic iron, is more effective when forged by a master smith. This quality can change slightly during repairs; a high-quality item, when repaired by an unskilled smith, will lose some of its quality level. If one wishes to retain the masterwork quality of an item, they must treat it as such, having it repaired by a highly skilled smith and avoiding field repairs, which retain quality much less efficiently. A skilled craftsman can increase the quality of an item during repairs/reforging if their ability exceeds its current level, but the same item can only be improved so much. High quality generally involves making a new item, instead of improving a bad one.

Materials are not a direct quality scale, but instead have varying influences on the armor's stats. A mithril suit may have reduced weight and higher values of some resistances, steel may be easier to repair without quality loss, ebony might have higher resistances due to its hardness but considerably higher recommended stats because of its weight. Rarer materials are harder to repair, but may have unique effects. A skilled and wealthy adventurer may own several suits of varying design and material, and pick depending on the nature of the danger they plan to confront. Armor suits are more valuable and difficult to obtain than previously, but also have a much longer value period, instead of being promptly replaced by something better.
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Dean Ashcroft
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:50 am

i read the subtitle as "we want hokers!" was mildly surprised that Ratwar would make such a suggestion.
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Steven Hardman
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 8:47 am

With recent threads about it and being a current subject, I figured I'd repost some stuff on how I'd like to see general equipment working. Mostly old, a little new, entirely too long as always.
Epic post. And I don't mean the length.

i read the subtitle as "we want hokers!" was mildly surprised that Ratwar would make such a suggestion.
Yeah, they prefer to be called "Escorts".
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James Shaw
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 7:03 am

i wouldn't mind seeing some bonfires i know its a odd idea and its a pretty small maybe religions events? or travelers

also it would be great to see characters travel from city to city or town for purposes it would be a nice little feature make the game more alive
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Dark Mogul
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 4:10 am

There shouldn't be any armorers who sell the armor they make out of their own shop. Not that they'd get a lot of customers coming in every day or anything, but once you start working on a piece, you can't just drop everything to help a customer. If you want armor or repairs, you need to talk to the sales rep at the store that would sell the armor. Then you haggle for how many days the repair will take and how much you will spend for that, and come back when it's ready.

There was something like that in Dragon Age: Origins. There was an armorer in Denerim who would be making the armor in the back while you talked to his boy toy/sales rep in the front over pre-made armors or if you had particular items, you could commission some but it took time.

So yeah, the thread subtitle is also basically what I want. Give me back some Horkers.
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x_JeNnY_x
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 5:50 am

Why are the TES V Ideas and Suggestions threads # 1-129 deleted? Were all those discussions and suggestions for nothing? :shakehead:
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Gen Daley
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 9:23 am

Why are the TES V Ideas and Suggestions threads # 1-129 deleted? Were all those discussions and suggestions for nothing? :shakehead:


I believe so..... :sadvaultboy:
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Andrew
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 3:55 am

Why are the TES V Ideas and Suggestions threads # 1-129 deleted? Were all those discussions and suggestions for nothing? :shakehead:

Bandwidth, pal.

But I'm sure if there are particularly good suggestions, like that "two fatigue bars" system, they'd keep some notes on it someplace.
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Etta Hargrave
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 3:30 am

But I'm sure if there are particularly good suggestions, like that "two fatigue bars" system, they'd keep some notes on it someplace.


I don't think so. I'm not sure if they even have read those deleted threads. There were great ideas in the beginning ( thread # 1-20 ). But now its all gone. I'm getting the impression that Bethesda really don't care any more about it's fanbase. :shakehead:
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Eilidh Brian
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 1:50 pm

I don't think so. I'm not sure if they even have read those deleted threads. There were great ideas in the beginning ( thread # 1-20 ). But now its all gone. I'm getting the impression that Bethesda really don't care any more about it's fanbase. :shakehead:

And there was facepalming.

There was a lot of "do they read it?" stuff a while ago, I think. I'm reasonably sure they do. And why would a company dependent on sales not care about its money-making machine (blarg, alliteration)? We pay for the games, so they care. They know we will pay for a TESV, but because they aren't [censored]s like SOME game companies, they are taking their time to make sure it's worth the $60 American I'm going to bleed for it.
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Matt Terry
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 3:43 pm

And there was facepalming.

I'm reasonably sure they do.


Is it so difficult for them to go to his thread and say that they are reading our suggestions?
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x_JeNnY_x
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 2:49 pm

Is it so difficult for them to go to his thread and say that they are reading our suggestions?

Yes. That would indicate that TESV is being worked on, which they aren't allowed to do until announcement, which is who-knows-when. But now we're getting into the "speculation thread" territory. Look there for good arguments as to why you should just buck up, square your shoulders and have a little faith.

As for suggestions, let me expound upon the Heroic Cycle so far.

Daggerfall lacked it completely, opting, bravely and cleverly, for the player character to be naught but a messenger-boy/girl, an average person, a pawn of the greats but a pawn with choices ahead.

Morrowind, it had the Nerevarine undergo every facet of the Heroic Cycle. Absent parents, receives divine/holy aid, kills monsters, finishes the quest and either goes or obtains a home as well as fame and honor.

Oblivion also bravely did something, where the protagonist is, like Daggerfall, not the hero. In this, he is the Lancer, and Martin is the hero, also fulfilling all the aspects of the Cycle, but aided by the protagonist.

I really think that TESV should go all out with the heroic cycle with the player as the hero, particularly if it is in Skyrim. Use the culture of the Nords to give opportunity for valorous heroics, or the culture of the Empire for a morre Odysseus-type "smart guy" hero.
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jennie xhx
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 8:33 am

I'd like to see the extensive armor and weapon system brought back, like Pauldrons, Spears and Tower Shields.
They should also bring back the travel system, Silt Stryders, Mages Guild Teleports and Boats. (Yes, I know Silt Stryders are only available in Vvardenfell)
Morrowind had it all! And it all was removed from Oblivion, Bring It Back!
And please Bethesda, Don't remove any of the good stuff from TES V that was in Oblivion, like horses.
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CHANONE
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 2:38 am

So, how would spear combat work? Is it just stabbing? I've always had a hard time imagining what true spear combat would be like in The Elder Scrolls. In Morrowind, it just borrowed the staff combat animations. What kind of moves would there be, and how would you implement it in the game when you can simply use a sword instead?
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Jeneene Hunte
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:08 am

And there was facepalming.

There was a lot of "do they read it?" stuff a while ago, I think. I'm reasonably sure they do.


I would hope they're far passed the ideas stage by now, so really I hope they don't read these threads any more. Sure, at the beginning they may have done, but now I would hope they already know what's going to be included and are well into working on it.

I still read through these threads and occasionally post, just because I think it's an interesting discussion, but I don't think any of my ideas I post are likely to be implemented... wow, that sounds a very pessimistic thing to say, but my pessimism stems from my optimism that TESV is already well on the way.

Gone off topic a bit here... erm... mounted combat please! :goodjob:
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Abi Emily
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 6:24 am

So, how would spear combat work? Is it just stabbing? I've always had a hard time imagining what true spear combat would be like in The Elder Scrolls. In Morrowind, it just borrowed the staff combat animations. What kind of moves would there be, and how would you implement it in the game when you can simply use a sword instead?

A sword usually can't keep your opponent at 2 meters distance, out of reach of his own weapon, and can't be jabbed forwards with a force that can simply punch through armors.

Though with TES' habit of making all kinds of damage exactly the same and just vary how much damage you do and armors pretty much just being a kind of "damage multiplier" instead of really protecting from hits having different weapon types is generally pretty much useless except to extend the skill list. If they'd really want to make using different weapons different they'd have to make damage really differ and armors offering more a protection from "getting hit" rather than damage sponging.


EDIT: In fact they even did that better with the bullet proof vest in GTA4, it protected you from gunshots and direct attacks (blows on your body got partly absorbed while hits on your head directly damaged you), falling from great hight, fire or explosions still hurt you directly.
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Rude Gurl
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 2:34 am

So, how would spear combat work? Is it just stabbing? I've always had a hard time imagining what true spear combat would be like in The Elder Scrolls. In Morrowind, it just borrowed the staff combat animations. What kind of moves would there be, and how would you implement it in the game when you can simply use a sword instead?

I think one thing that would be vital for "genuine" spear combat is for the game to recognize the weapon as a solid object, and not just a damage-causing animation. Meaning that if it's held in front of you, and someone's at the end of it, they can't just walk forward so you're in range unless they want to get impaled. It would also benefit from stances/styles. While those are an iffy subject, since they'd be great but would also involve a fair amount of effort (especially from Bethesda's less than perfect animation department), they would go a long way for real spear combat. Say there's a button to scroll through stances. You start out holding the spear pointed straight ahead in a ready position, which makes more sense than it not existing until you attack. Enemies could be kept warily outside its range with light jabs, which aren't very strong but will still easily punch holes in a soft spot. If you spy an opening, a power attack could be used for a legitimate, piercing thrust. If the enemy is quick, or you are not, they might slip past the point; it being solid would also mean you can't simply turn and have it aimed at them again, since you'd be uselessly bumping against their side with the staff portion. So you change stance to quickly bring it to yourself, holding it more in the center like a combat staff. This sacrifices the range you didn't need anymore and lets you quickly parry with it for defense. You can still make stabbing attacks, or maybe sweep their legs with the blunt end, then look down and power attack to impale them while they're on the ground. With that finished, you switch back to the ranged stance for the next enemy.

It should also be possible to use them (maybe shorter javelin types) http://cd7.e2bn.net/e2bn/leas/c99/schools/cd7/website/images/greek-spartan-warriors-5.jpg. While it doesn't have the sweeping arc of a sword, a spear can still quickly stab forward, darting from behind the shield, while carried one-handed. Speed and range are the main advantages of a spear; in the time that your enemy is raising up his sword for a swing, you've already stabbed him in the gut. A warrior might also choose to throw it, either taking down an enemy at range or creating an opening while they block it, as a backup short sword is drawn to attack with.

Imagine the threat of Argonian hunters, if the long range and power of a strong spear thrust is fully utilized. Someone is walking alongside a road next to a river, when suddenly a spear shoots out from the water, its wielder not even visible, and nails the surprised target right in the throat. They're yanked back into the water like a fish, the end.
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Dan Stevens
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 5:20 am

Combat AI!

Really, in Morrowind and Oblivion, all enemies, NPC or creature, had the same two sets of AI: Charge at you mindlessly as soon as it detects you and hit you mindlessly over and over, or run away. Now, a lot of enemies would have a different setup. will-o-the-wisps, for example, should have tried to trap you, and most animals should have ignored you. Anyone see where I'm going with this? Make the enemies have more than two actions.
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Brιonα Renae
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 12:04 pm

Learn from the latest Harry Potter game, Bethesda! We the people demand a cover-based shooter! Litter the environment with chest-high walls and to hell with immersion or atmosphere! :evil:

Spoiler
[/sarcasm]

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Rusty Billiot
 
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Post » Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:53 am

Learn from the latest Harry Potter game, Bethesda! We the people demand a cover-based shooter! Litter the environment with chest-high walls and to hell with immersion or atmosphere! :evil:

You really should put a [/sarcasm] in there.
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Shianne Donato
 
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