Konnichiwa!

I think that Force-users (I put 'Jedi' because it's more recognizable) have what are among the most powerful abilities throughout the multiverse of fiction. But I just started wondering: are they more powerful than mages from TES?

As a super-duper Star Wars nerd, it almost feels like heresy to say this, but I'm starting to think that mages are ahead. They can:

• Increase their physicl abilities
  
• Influence other people's minds
  
• Move things with telekenesis
  
• Summon forth creatures to do their bidding
  
• Fly
  
• Walk on water
  
• Create a physical shield around their bodies
  
• Cause elemental damage
  
• And more!

Many of these things Jedi can do, and a few they can't.

I'll withhold my own vote until someone has convinced me one way or the other. Discuss!

Mages in TES can do precisely whatever they want to do. They are only limited by their own personal power. Force users, to my knowledge (not a big Star Wars fan. Never seen the movies either for that matter), are not capable of that.

So, Mages win. /endtopic.

I'm a total Star Wars fan (I read extended universe, play extended universe, watch movies, etc.) and even Darth Revan wouldn't stand up to the pathetic Hannibal Travern. TES mages are just so much more versatile and aren't limited by the light, dark, or whatever order they follow. As well as the fact that TES Magic has far more abilities than the Force. Sorry guys, I don't care if a Dathomiri Night Sister comes tries, she'll lose. I don't care if the entire Jedi Order (of all the ages), the entire Sith Order (of all the ages), the Witches of Dathomir, the Nightsisters, the Jen'saari, etc. band together, the mages'll win.

?

You can't go on your "knowledge" if you have never seen the movies... that's just plain silly.

Even if you are right.

There are definite limits to how the Force can be used in the Star Wars universe, and there are so many unending iterations not bound by Lucas that TES has a scope to evolve and with limits of magic essentially removed you do have a natural imbalance towards the mage.

I may not have seen the movies, but I know enough second hand. It is hard, after all, to find someone these days, at least in the US, who doesn't at least know what Star Wars is.

There are one or two exceptional Force users mostly in the EU who can perform feats such as destroying star cruisers using their powers, but that takes a lot of focus and concentration and leaves them vulnerable.

I'd say the average Mage would more than adequately defeat the average Jedi, even taking into account the lightsaber. Beings like Darth Vader would be particularly vulnerable, as a simple shock spell would completely undo his life support system.

Yeah, and I know what Pokemon is, but I don't have a clue whether they are better than Bakugon... I know what a television is, but I have no idea how the magic waves make pictures... I'm just saying he asked a question that you could answer, but just not have any faith in.

I don't know a lot of starars lore, i've only seen the movies, but i'm pretty sure that Yoda (I think the best force guy) would get epically poned by Zurin Arctus.
The Jedi rely on technology a lot because the ability to use the force is rare and can only be used in special occasions, but in TES almost everone can use magic, and levitation and guild guides are part of common life.
An apprentace of... even illusion could best a padowan: parilize, etc.

The Force is not as weak as it appears in the films.

In the books, the Emperor is actually killed some 10+ times because he uses the force to keep his essence intact, which he then moves to a new cloned body that he creates using multiple cloning facility and hidden laboratories. He even takes over other, living people using these powers.

But considering the seeming ease with which magic can be used to do harm against others compared to the difficulty of that same task presented in the books (using force lightning, for example, drains the user nearly as badly as it damages the target), I might be more inclined to say a TES mage, at least on a lower level.

Perhaps a graph of power over skill level is required? Force most definitely wins at higher levels (what with keeping yourself alive, and even resurrecting others, powers that do not exist magically in TES), but TES magic has the upper hand at lower, and even medium levels of skill. I attribute this to the mysterious nature of the force vs the scientific nature of TES magic.

Dude necromancers may be shunned but they do exist. Even low level necromancers can raise the dead...

Meh. Star Wars is such a cultural phenomenon that is hard to not know something about it even you haven't seen the movies. I just happen to be one of those people who knows a bit about the Star Wars universe despite never actually watching any of the movies. And even then, a google search or even Wikipedia can tell you the extent to which the Force could be used, so its not like it is impossible for someone who hasn't seen the movies to figure out what you can and cannot do with the Force.

The Force and Creatia (Magic) are almost the same, conceptually. Each is the life-force coursing through creation, unifying all things (which is the basis for their manipulation).

That's how Galerion preferred to teach his students, by dividing Mysticism into schools. It does not mean they are more versatile.

No, I mean 100% alive, thinking, just like new.

That doesn't happen in TES. You get a husk of a human, it can't even compare. Its like digging up a corpse and rigging animatronics to it compared to using some sort of futuristic who-ha to poof someone back to perfect life, as if they'd never died.

Very true.

Interestingly though since it isn't quite just about mages at this point, but with the Nereverine and the whole Tribunal, and also with Talos you have all of these other transcendences and rebirths that are quite powerful in their own rights.

IIRC, TES mages can resurrect a person fully and entirely. Though the example I am thinking of might be due to having powers most other mages would not, due to being outside of Nirn and all, I don't think that is the case.

Luke and the Nerevarine would be a good fight, but Luke would totally curb stomp Vivec and Tiber.

I like to think that Jedi have an ideological victory here, seeing as they have a strict moral code, while mages are just willy-nilly magic users. Not to mention, Jedis have swords that are made of FORCE.

Yes, but aren't those related to the God-Head, which is on a totally different level than magic? I mean, what Talos does with CHIM is comparable to the big bang, whereas magic is more like manipulating simple physics of the universe.

If Talos and the like WERE brought into the fight, well of course they would win. They're literally more powerful than the gods themselves and I do not think that the Aedra or the Daedra can even achieve CHIM due to their tendencies being tied to aspects of life. They can't think outside the box because they ARE the box.

Edit:
No they aren't.

The containment field is force energy, but the blade itself is simply super hot plasma.

Forget mages. Jedi are knights, so place Vader against Pelinal.

AND VADER MADE LOVE UNTO A HILLOCK

Well, are you saying that Pelinal is a mage or that Jedi shouldn't be compared to Mages?

If we're talking about strange love rituals, we may as well include Vivec.

Truthfully, I don't know which group I believe is more powerful.

I agree with Orzorn -- I don't think anyone understands the extent to which the Force can be used. It can destroy people's souls to commandeer their bodies. It can be used to make stars go supernova or allow humans to traverse the vacuum of space without a scratch. Can't count the Force out.

...well truth be told I forgot about flow walking, which allows them to travel in time... a feat I am not sure has ever been explored in TES (though I am no lore expert).

A Jedi's use of the Force is only as limited as their imagination, making the playing field the same for both. Vivec and the Emperor, I put my money on the emperor. Would be EXCEPTIONALLY awesome if someone could do a well done short film about this topic.