I had a different idea: Have a short-term fatigue bar like Morrowind's, a long-term fatigue (or survival) bar, and no magic bar, have it come out of first fatigue and then health.

Exactly, i know here six is kiiinda a "no no, i can't hear you, lalalalalala" topic but still it needs discussion.
I really don't mean having six scenes in the games or, as mentioned, six minigames but it should at least not act like evreyone is born from a cabbage.

Games should finally be allowed to grow up.


EDIT: On the topic i might also link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFsQM6o4uoY&feature=sub that talks about controversial topics. People should really look though the whole video series, it's really informative about games as an artistic medium and not just a past time.

I agree 100%. BUT, what you are suggesting is an impossibility considering the size and scope of TES.

Also, Bethesda didn't develop Cthulhu. They only published it.

I don't think it's impossible, i actually think it's NECESSARY for a game like that. Who would want hundrets of NPCs are are nothing more than walking dull. They where nothing more than actors wearing bad masks and had no time to learn their characters, no real expressionas or emotions, just saying my lines and done.
Honestly, which NPCs did you really care for after having delt with their missions? Once nothing was left to do they could have just as well dissapread.

And yea, i forgot that part... still take a look at that game, it did some GREAT things.

The Elder Scrolls V (if its confirmed)
needs werewolf subrace

Let the blasphemy be stricken from the record


I would like to see proper dynamic flame physics. Snap a branch off a tree hold it in a campfire and watch it ignite as a torch. I want to be able to hide in trees and jump people as they walk underneath

Hello,
Please look into what I have to say:
Me and everyone at work have never played a game that gave us a really life sort of characteristics eg, Like you need to buy food to eat or drink to survive in order to do that you need coins or to explore for food or hunt! This would give the game its lift it needs and what about you need sleep sometime or you pass out? Why not add a virus that makes you sick and the only way you can fix it is that you can buy the cure or make it with potion making skill?

But my final thing I would love to see is: that it should be hard to find money like the only way to get is stealing to survive, joining guilds for money looking treasures in ruins and selling what you find, And don't for get jobs. It keeps the game good if you had some of these features gives you that feeling that you need survive first then do what you want after you had something to eat!

This you would have to put this on you to do list!

Jack

I'd like the longevity of more common weapons and armor increased. I think that iron and steel weapons and armor should be considered the norm. Even into the higher levels, I don't want to walk into an inn and see that all of the inconsequential NPC's are sporting elven or glass attire.

When I find my first weapon better than steel, I shouldn't start seeing NPC"s all of a sudden with them. And the higher quality weapons and armor need to become WAY more difficult to find and repair.

:liplick:
That was one long amazing perfect post :thumbsup:

Keep material like that coming, please

On eating and sleeping:
I'd implement it a way that it isn't a full blown necessity as in you die if you don't eat or pass out when not sleeping enough. But more that you can regenerate better when you eat and sleep regularly

On diseases:
They should be more severe, same with injures. They're simply "poof and gone" and add no real pressure. Some diseases should take a while to cure and some wound a bit to regenerate. Potions and magic should only AID healing but not be a wonder cure.

On money:
Yea it shouldn't be that easy to get rich, even if you DO find valuables it shouldn't mean you're rich instantly.

One of the features I enjoyed in Fable 2 was the ability to take on a profession. It gave the player another means of earning gold. I think the Elderscrolls can use something like this. Theres only 3 very obvious ways of obtaining gold.

1) Selling/fencing
2)Stealing/looting
3)Quest Reward

Im not sure how this would be implemented into TES while staying original. Be a taxidermist? A sewing mini game you say?

Fable 2 De Ja Vu. Really what was bethesda thinking when they made the physics engine? That all of us loved morrowind too much to notice?

Maybe it would be a first person experience, like you just pick up the needle and thread, target what you want to sew, and then you just sew it. Or for a Blacksmith you pick up your tongs, pick up your wanted item with the tongs, put it in the fire till it's nice and yellow, and then you equip your hammer and target what you want to hit, and you hit it which would cause it to deform and possibly alter its stats. (I'd love to make silver cups into flying disks o' doom that stick into you after being thrown and cause you to bleed. )

Using Oblivion's grab function would make for a pretty funny occupation. You could be a maid? Grab crumpled up pieces of paper and throw them in the trash for some Nobleman.

• There would be a notice posted in the city wall. saying generic names of whos house needs cleaning.
  
• You'd then enter the house (cell) to find it litterd with trash.
  
• You'd have to put it into a large basket.
  
• The more pieces you put in the basket in a certain span of time, will give you a higher gold bonus.
  
• You can stop, at any point and say your done, and if the house isn't 100% clean, the remaining % will be deducted from your earnings.

I think its pretty solid!

Speaking of maids, 'twould be pretty damned cool to have the ability to purchase a maid for your house, and have two extra dialogue options. The first would run a script, saving the positional and angular data for every physics-enabled object in the interior cells, and the second would tell the maid to tidy up the house based on those saved positional and angular data entries.

Probably altogether too much work, though.

Yeah I think so...how would she know where to put the stuff? What if it didn't originate from the house?

Slaughterfishing would be a good occupation.

I'll use skyrim as the setting.
Theres a snow hut on a frozen lake.
You go in and you're in a small cell with a hole and a pole.
You click on the hole and begin a mini game.

Im still working out the mechanics

Other than having to worry about making all of the additional stuff added in later not just magically disappear (garbage can anyone?) and making it so that you can't dupe items by removing them then having your maid restore the defaults of your home it'd probably be rather easy.

Then again i haven't actually programmed any video games (yet! ) so don't lynch me if I'm just stupid.

Being able to have a mundane job like an NPC would greatly increase the immersion of a game, especially if the NPC's are witnessed performing those jobs.

Some jobs I think could be included:

The Fable 2 jobs (woodcutter, blacksmith, bartender, etc)
Farmer - you could be tasked with watering the crops on a daily basis, and the yield of that crop reflects how much time you put into its growth
Courier - you need to travel between cities (no fast travel ) delivering parcels or letters.
Fisherman - you guys already mentioned this one, I remember Zelda 64's fishing mechanic/mini-game was pretty good

I wish I could add user created mods to my xbox Oblivion game, this mod seems relevant to the topic at hand,
http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=OblivionMods.Detail&id=1427

Having a job should not be considered fun, it should be a grind. It should represent an income that is modest and reflects the in-game world's standard of living, but it should be by no means a replacement or substitute for the greater source of income that is adventuring. I don't mean to sound like a broken record, but I feel like Fable 2 did it really well.

Alright, I figured out the mechanics for Slaughterfishing!


Like the maid mini game, there is a penalty for messing this one up. You have to purchase your own line and bait. Different lines make it easier to catch certain fish. Different types of bait can catch different kinds of fish. It can be broken if you put too much tension on it. Unlike the maid mini game, this game does not take place in real time.


I'm gonn use Skyrim as our future location..

• You find an ice covered tent on a frozen lake. This is indicates a fishing spot.
  
• You will find a pole (static object) lying inside. There will be a decent size hole in the ice. Click it and a menu will appear
  
• The menu will ask you to select your bait and line.
  
• The mini game will then appear, determing the fish by the bait and the line. http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a328/Mikeandike1/slaughterfishing.jpg (there would only be one fish on the screen at a time, though)
  
• The bigger the fish, the deeper down its going to be. The deeper down it is, the harder its going to be to get it up.
  
• Basically you must drag the fish icon to the top or surface in order to obtain it. Its not that easy though, the fish will put up a fight.
  
• The fish icon would be scripted to spiratically swim down, like any fish does. At that point its up to you to ease the tension on line by either letting go of the control stick or Arrow/W key or you'll end up breaking the line or losing your bait.

Well, the first script would save the data for every physics-enabled item within the house at the time in some form of object checklist, regardless if they originated from the base house cell. The character save-files do much the same thing; things don't (usually) fall randomly or disappear if you reload a save. So the saving of the XYZ position as well as the XYZ angles for all the objects in the house can easily be done. And from that data, that's how the maid would know where to put the stuff. If an object is in a chest, then either the maid could ignore those objects, or checklists could be created for those chests as well (the objects stored within wouldn't need positional or angular data, though).

The stuff added later wouldn't disappear after a tidying up; since it wouldn't be on the object checklist, it wouldn't be altered (though a problem presents itself if a new item is occupying the 3D space that a checklisted item was saved as occupying; I suppose an override could be included to pass over putting the old item into or onto the new item). Duping would be easily circumvented by giving each item saved on the checklist a Reference ID (or using the already-given one if it has one already) and only bothering to reposition an object w/ the R-ID if that object is actually in the house. And of course, if characters are carrying the items within the house (including the player), then those items should be exempted from the object checklist so the maid doesn't have to resort to pickpocketing to get the stuff.

So let's say I have a sword in a display case, 5 books on a bookshelf, a collection of plates on a table, and a soul-gem on a desk. I talk to the maid and tell her to remember where everything is (activating the script that creates the object checklist; let's assume the checklist is made in the order of Sword, Books, Plates, Soul-gem). Then, I take the sword and put it on the floor. I place the books in a nearby container. The plates I take outside and drop them there. The soul-gem I pocket. And I tell her to tidy up. She'll walk to the sword and perhaps use a kneeling or looting animation. The sword will disappear and be put into her inventory as she picks it up. Then, the position and angle of the sword will be called from the object checklist, and she'll walk over to the display case. There, she'll either open up the case, or she'll just need to get close enough to it, and the sword will be removed from her inventory and placed in the house with the positional XYZs and angular XYZs pulled from the checklist. For all intents and purposes, the maid will have put the sword back into the case with precision accuracy. Next on the list would be the books, and functions would search the house interior cells and containers within the cells for those books' Ref IDs. Once retrieved, the maid'll go to the container I placed them in, take them, and place them exactly on the bookshelf using the same method as with the sword. Next will come the plates, but when the functions can't find the plates in the house cells or the containers, that item will be skipped. Finally, the soul-gem, but when the functions determine that the I am holding the soul-gem, that also will be skipped.

Is it sad that, the whole time I'm picturing this in my head, I'm seeing the Lusty Argonian Maid? :shifty:

EDIT: Of course, this is way too much work for something that I would actually expect to make it into the vanilla game. Fun idea for a mod, though.

Sounds like a lot of work for the maid! Another easy way to do it is simply have a dialogue option that says, "Have my house clean the next time I enter," doing everything you said but without having to see it.
I know, this renders the maid useless, but we can still make her walk around the house with a low budget dusting animation!

Afterall, it'd be tricky to get the maid to walk up to a static object like a shelf and place something on it. Ordering her to the items location will cause a collison issue because its been placed in the shelf. Activating a container is a little easier. You'd have to map out the shelf itself, and well thats a lot of work!

i don't know if its been suggested but the PC showing guilt for somthing like if they steal from the homeless they fell guilty it won't overall affect the PC but the PC may mutter somthing about how guilty he fells doing this


Also depending on the relase maybe 2 lands instead of one for example randomly High Rock and Hamerfall or as a expasion for example say High Rock was the main game and Hamerfall was the expasion

I did mention Guilt a bit before but it should NOT work as some kind of punishment unless it comes as a consequence for an action.

What i mean is actually making the PLAYER feel somewhat guilty for doing something. This means you can still mess around if you want to, there's no in game punishment save for law enforcement and consequences but no "divine force" that says "YOU DID BAAAAAD".
The whole trick is making NPCs less one dimensional, you feel no guilt killing or a NPC who didn't do anything, had no back story and people who see him just say "dead guy, nasty". But try the same with a NPC you heard some backstory about or who actually begs you not to kill him.
You feel more bad about stealing from a homeless who really suffers, is sick, hungry and really has to search trash and beg for money just to make the day than the ones seen in Oblivion who just seemed like they prefered to sleep on the streets and the mean time walk around and ask for coins.

It's all about having characters that SEEM alive instead of just placed there for info or slaughtering.
That's also what i hated about the whole "necromancers are EVIL" story, it made them one dimensional evil guys with NOTHING to think about and in effect made the whole mages guild questline flat and boring. You had NO conflict to think about or weigh of the consequences of actions... maybe think about WHY they oppose the mages guild and if their actions might be justified somewhere.

Definitely. To add on, the problem with things like the player character mentioning guilt is that it forces a certain personality onto them, something TES tries to avoid with roleplay-encouraging player choice. What if I'm playing as a Dark Brotherhood assassin? I don't need my character saying "boy, I feel bad about this" every time they toss an orphan into traffic.

A good example of making evil feel evil is Jade Empire. I've played a LOT of games with moral choices, and typically go through twice to see everything, but that's the only one that really made me not want to do some of those heinous things by the end of the game. Things are being realistically protested as you do them, whereas in Oblivion people just fall down limp with an "oof" like a cartoon character I dropped an anvil on, and the only backlash is a feeble law enforcement that does nothing if I wasn't seen and immediately stops caring if I pay a fine.

A few street musicians would be nice. Or some playing in a bar somewhere.

I've always wanted an in-game journal I can write in as well. I would love to make myself a few little notes as I play without alting out or the game. Like an in game notepad.