That can't be right...

Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:02 am

True, and you can still end up feeling like a bad ass. The balance is good and rewarding.


Exactly. I remember one playthrough on Fallout 3 where I had decided not to use fast travel, and so I had scored a lot of loot and was just slowly walking towards Megaton with my over encombered backback when I happened upon a Super Mutant little hold out thing. Nothing was as cool as slowly walking through the complex blasting everything away. And then afterwards I did finally get to Megaton, sold my stuff and stored the rest, and then set out again this time just wandering north.

Next thing I knew, I was getting chased by Death Claws, running for my life while trying to cripple the damn things.

Edit: I've also been playing Oblivion again recently and I realized something. Death claws are like Daedroth but on bloody steroids.
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asako
 
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Post » Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:54 pm

Why? Morrowind is too easy at a high level. There should still be some danger.

I think the simple solution here is to make the maximum difficulty of dungeons (the ones most remote and with thebest loot) much harder, so there is always a challenge, but you are still actually achieving something by gaining levels and skills. You have access to better stuff and can more easily beat tougher monsters, but it still doesn't come too easily to you.
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Laura-Jayne Lee
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:09 am

As long as we never see a starter dungeon with leather clad bandits that somehow found glass armor while we were away leveling to 20, I'll be happy.

I think the system is in place to give us a feeling of growth. If we are always fighting the same scaled baddies, we could never feel like the god-like hero we are by the end. If I'm the dragonborn who saves the world, I don't want bandits to give me trouble.

*This
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Enie van Bied
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:05 am

And I thought, 'What the hell?' that can't be right! Does that mean then that if I go into a cave at level three, then return to the cave to make some money at level 21, the monsters/NPC's will be all what I would have fought at level three?

Pretty much. Thats how it worked with Morrowind. Or atleast with a couple creatures within morrowind.
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alyssa ALYSSA
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:21 am

At the risk of sounding like a heretic, I want the dungeons to be easier when you're a high level. The way Oblivion did it was just stupid, dungeons (and creatures overall) became progressively more difficult as your level rose. It's easier to beat the game at level 1 than level 50. If I get to a high enough level, I want to feel like I can coast through everything (well, most things) by blowing them up with mind lasers.


No doubt about that. How Oblivion did it was stupid. Completely stupid.

What I would like to see - and it's was Todd has said - is some zones being instant death if you go when you're low level. As you became stronger, low level dungeons would be a joke, but you would still find some challenge in other zones.
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jennie xhx
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:16 am

Personally I find the scaling will work this time.

The game itself being able to calculate/choose from a min to max will help balance the game and lead to the satisfying feel of overpowering enemies who troubled you later on while still keeping enemies who are a little or vastly more powerful than you.

I think this is the compromise Bethesda was looking for but couldn't figure out in Morrowind nor Oblivion.
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Robyn Lena
 
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Post » Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:48 pm

Then someone pops up and blows Taps over your corpse. I prefer the MW method, but I'll play either of course.

Agreed. I liked how you could easily be over-whelmed in MW, because when you could actually come back and clear that dungeon out, I at least, felt a sense of growing in skill
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Lilit Ager
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:17 am

Ohhh thats cool, im ok with that.... So that's randomly generated.. :celebration: :celebration: :celebration:




only problem is, what if i go into a cave which has powerful equipment in it, will i have to fight rats at lvl 1 to get it? i rather sometimes it be much higher level enemies
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Chloe Lou
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:40 am

Agreed. I liked how you could easily be over-whelmed in MW, because when you could actually come back and clear that dungeon out, I at least, felt a sense of growing in skill


Except when I'm trying to do the main quest and the skeletons in the one ancestral tomb were you need to get the skull for the orc necromage lady in Balmora's mages guild and there shooting over powered poisoned arrows that do more damage then there upgraded versions and I die over and over and over and *hyperventilates*

Anyway...
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Jessie
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:57 am

I think the 5-10 etc leveling is great, however make it so if you enter the dungeon at lvl 6, and leave. Then go back within the same span, it stays locked, go back at a later spawn (say 10-20), it resets to what your at. So if you enter a cave you didnt want to, or didnt need to, you can go back later.

Though the best type of dungeon would be a level dunegon (as in levels/floors) where the deep your go, the harder it gets. So you can still explore stuff, and bite off more then you can chew.
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Johnny
 
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Post » Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:06 pm

I think the 5-10 etc leveling is great, however make it so if you enter the dungeon at lvl 6, and leave. Then go back within the same span, it stays locked, go back at a later spawn (say 10-20), it resets to what your at. So if you enter a cave you didnt want to, or didnt need to, you can go back later.


I think it's more each specific dungeon has level spawn, and it locks to whatever level you first entered it. So 1-4 entered at level 3 would be 3 but at 8 it'd stick to 4. To reiterate for the 100th time in this thread.
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Stephy Beck
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:07 am

I think the 5-10 etc leveling is great, however make it so if you enter the dungeon at lvl 6, and leave. Then go back within the same span, it stays locked, go back at a later spawn (say 10-20), it resets to what your at. So if you enter a cave you didnt want to, or didnt need to, you can go back later.



What they should do is make 90% of all caves level +10 and when your level 20 then the level 10 in that cave gets changed to a level 20 cap permanently...
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cheryl wright
 
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Post » Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:37 pm

The game does not lock the dungeon to your exact level, but the closest level of its level range to your level. As mentioned earlier, say a dungeon was a level 5-10 dungeon. If you enter the dungeon at level 3, it locks to level 5, its closest level to you. If you enter at any level between 5 and 10, it will lock to your current level. If you enter at level 20, it will lock to level 10, its highest level and closest one to your level.
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Katharine Newton
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:56 am

It also wouldn't make sense if everytime you revisited a place it was inhabited by tougher things. Where were the tough things when you first went in?

You don't find it strange that an entire cave would magically be filled again by things to kill, but you would find it strange if they were a little stronger?!?
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Heather Kush
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:03 am

Ohhh thats cool, im ok with that.... So that's randomly generated.. :celebration: :celebration: :celebration:




only problem is, what if i go into a cave which has powerful equipment in it, will i have to fight rats at lvl 1 to get it? i rather sometimes it be much higher level enemies


No because caves that have powerful equipment would have a higher level minimum.
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Kim Kay
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:56 am

how would that not make sense? You did not kill them so they lived on became more experience over time... of course it needs to be like 7-10 days it resets then you enter they adjust again


Just no.
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Louise Andrew
 
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Post » Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:13 pm

only problem is, what if i go into a cave which has powerful equipment in it, will i have to fight rats at lvl 1 to get it? i rather sometimes it be much higher level enemies

If a cave has powerful equipment in it, then the level range of that dungeon will be high. For example the level range could be 10-15. If you'd enter the place when you are level 10 or lower, the cave will have level 10 enemies. Those won't be rats obviously. If you enter the cave at level 20, it'll have level 15 enemies.

That's how it worked in FO3.
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Scarlet Devil
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:15 am

You don't find it strange that an entire cave would magically be filled again by things to kill, but you would find it strange if they were a little stronger?!?


It's not magic, stuff moved in. I'd find it weird if it was stronger stuff cause why would the strong stuff wait for the weak stuff to die before taking over the place.
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R.I.p MOmmy
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:39 am

If you eradicate a dungeon I think it should repopulate over time according to your new level and everything just to keep things interesting and the treasure should repopulate as well according to your level. It would make me want to go back through a dungeon to find more gold and fight new monsters.
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Jah Allen
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:03 am

You don't find it strange that an entire cave would magically be filled again by things to kill, but you would find it strange if they were a little stronger?!?

This.
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Baby K(:
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:28 am

I played Oblivion and Fallout 3 on console first.

When I got them on the PC I sat down and looked the mods over and started to plan all the wonderfull things I would do with my favorit games.

End result.
Oblivion: 200+
Fallout 3: 1 (Body and clothes/armour.)

If the balance in Fallout 3 equals Skyrim = :)
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CYCO JO-NATE
 
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Post » Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:52 pm

It's not magic, stuff moved in. I'd find it weird if it was stronger stuff cause why would the strong stuff wait for the weak stuff to die before taking over the place.

Why would the same-level stuff wait for the other stuff to die before moving in?

Your assuming the new stuff was just sitting around, waiting for the stuff inside to die, so they could go in. What if you wipe out all the level 5 stuff, then the cave it totally empty for a week. Then, a nice troup of level 15 stuff wanders in through the wilderness, finds the empty cave and desides to stay. That makes perfect sense, and it allows stronger stuff to be inside the cave upon reset.
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Haley Merkley
 
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Post » Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:13 pm

Why would the same-level stuff wait for the other stuff to die before moving in?

Your assuming the new stuff was just sitting around, waiting for the stuff inside to die, so they could go in. What if you wipe out all the level 5 stuff, then the cave it totally empty for a week. Then, a nice troup of level 15 stuff wanders in through the wilderness, finds the empty cave and desides to stay. That makes perfect sense, and it allows stronger stuff to be inside the cave upon reset.


I tend to get into a lot of arguments about stuff I don't give a damn about..

Bandit's would make sense, as long as they're equipment is kept low even at high levels, seriously if you have glass armor just sell it you'll make more money then hitting up peasants.

Ghosts and Draugr and what have you wouldn't. What are they just floating around from tomb to tomb? No. Why would treasure replenish? The undead don't horde stuff, they may protect stuff, but there not going to pick up an axe from some dumb adventurer and put it in the respawn chest. Why would the ancient undead guard a rare deadra helm or something and use there weakest people before there toughest. "Oh we lost the helm, next time use the grade A guys. for .when that guy who stole the helm comes back in for some reason."

If anything when the tough things die, it's probably more probable for weaker stuff to move in, with all those skeletons dead some bears and rats move in. It shouldn't just be straight up everyone gets tougher, it needs to flow or just stay the same (which would be the easiest for the devs)

or something.
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Tracy Byworth
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:10 am

It sounds like it will be a lot better than OB just off the shelf. I personally prefer incredibly hard settings on games, so no level scaling they can implement would really apply to that.

Making it so that dungeons only have level 5-10 enemies or 15-20 enemies makes it so that only the big baddies hang out togher, and only the little guys hang out together right? Never played Fallout, but its what it sounds like. I'd much rather that a dungeon could contain some regular skeletons, as well as a Skeleton Champion, or a pack of rats and some low level bandits in one section, and several mid level zombies and a Lich in the next section. Variety and predictability. That's how I built my own custom overhaul mod for OB anyway... Oh, and the loot is the same, good items are incredibly rare, and you are just as likely to find a good item (random ones) in a chest guarded by rats and skeletons as by Daedroths and Storm Atronachs, but most hand-placed good loot would be guarded by a strong enemy. I know that part about the loot is certainly not for everyone, but why should every treasure chest magically have better loot in it just because its guarded by Liches and Gloom Wraiths? Seems perfectly logical that it might be just as likely to have an iron dagger and a skull as it having the Sword of Awesomeness just because you are level 40.

However, the system they are putting in place by making the dungeons have a level like that may make it really easy to mod a system. It sounds like instead of having to edit every single leveled list, you can just adjust a dungeon's flag to be an exact number instead of a range, add a small percentage chance for stronger and weaker enemies to the dungeon range lists, and boom. Done. I hope its easier to mod that way.
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Mimi BC
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 8:22 am

The game does not lock the dungeon to your exact level, but the closest level of its level range to your level. As mentioned earlier, say a dungeon was a level 5-10 dungeon. If you enter the dungeon at level 3, it locks to level 5, its closest level to you. If you enter at any level between 5 and 10, it will lock to your current level. If you enter at level 20, it will lock to level 10, its highest level and closest one to your level.


This man is correct, and I actually think it's a good solution.
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Mariaa EM.
 
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