The amulet of Kings : The Elder Scrolls Series Discussion

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 6:36 am

Just a quick question, Back at Paradise, I noticed Mankar Camoran had the amulet of kings equipped, is he from the septim blood line then?

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 6:01 am

Oh man, you've opened up a can of worms! :bolt:

I will edit this post and try to give a half-way decent opinion in a few min...

___TWM

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 1:03 pm

I suppose it was a mistake?

Or perhaps he bought an "authentic amulet of kings replica" from http://masterreplicas.com/index.php

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 8:28 am

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Amulet_of_Kings "The amulet may only be worn by certain individuals- those who can be said to have the 'Dragon Blood' in their veins. It is a popular misconception that this refers to the heirs of the Septim lineage. This is obviously false since the majority of wearers were not Septims."

The short answer, I am sure other will provide more detail.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 2:38 pm

I suppose it was a mistake?

It specifically wasn't though the clue's didn't quite come out right. There used to be something in the preview stuff about Mankar Camoran being from another line of Kings and from the Remanada we know the Amulet has an Elven name, and from the intercept we know it is the stone of the White Gold tower, so presumably the King of the White Gold tower (and by tradition high priest of Akatosh/Auriel King of hte Aldmer) can wear the Amulet of Kings.

http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=634837&st=0&p=9215533&hl=amulet%20Kings&#entry9215533

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 12:20 pm

Why do you never talk about the Dragon Blood, Proweler?

I'm waiting for someone to give me a good explanation of what MK told us. TWM! Over here.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:16 am

I don't see anything about the Dragon Blood that warrants special attention, it seems to be just a form of divine mandate given by the King of the Heavens to the King of the Earth.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 1:29 pm

:meh:
So the Septims can wear it because of Dragon Blood but Mankar only gets it because of genetics? Batw.
Ghostly six with Alessia is worth mentioning.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 8:02 pm

:meh:
So the Septims can wear it because of Dragon Blood but Mankar only gets it because of genetics? Batw.
Ghostly six with Alessia is worth mentioning.

Divine Mandate, the right to rule. You know the term blue blood right? It's the same thing, doesn't make any sense, doesn't have any reason other then some established president and social conventions. Hell, if Cyrodiil were a democracy every elected president would have had Dragon Blood.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:39 am

Then Mankar has a right to rule Paradise, not lucky genes.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 3:26 pm

Then Mankar has a right to rule Paradise, not lucky genes.

If Martin as a unknown heir can wear the Amulet, so can Mankar as an unknown heir. Blood or ancestry don't have anything to do with it, it's more a matter of "who you are" in the storytelling sense.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:25 am

...so in short, anyone who is accepted as a leader can wear the amulet?

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:40 pm

...so in short, anyone who is accepted as a leader can wear the amulet?

Probably even worse, anybody in a position to rule, accepted or not.

Though you can't separate it from the story telling because while the divine mandate might be nothing but a fancy here, it certainly exists in Tamriel, along with all those other things such as destiny, faith and predestination. So whom ever it is, will certainly have some supernatural claim before hand.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 8:37 am

Probably even worse, anybody in a position to rule, accepted or not. Though you can't separate it from the story telling because while the divine mandate might be nothing but a fancy here, it certainly exists in Tamriel, along with all those other things such as destiny, faith and predestination.

...so basically, anyone who wants to lead or is predestined to or has the right blood can wear the amulet.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 8:55 pm

...so basically, anyone who wants to lead or is predestined to or has the right blood can wear the amulet.

So practically anybody the gods ordain with a roulettes wheel and a shotgun.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:03 am

I have been reading a bit about the amulet, and sometimes it is said that Lorkhan was the one who made Alessia into the first gem, and sometimes it's said it was Akatosh, and some say they are the same? Is there an official story here?

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:42 pm

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Amulet_of_Kings "The amulet may only be worn by certain individuals- those who can be said to have the 'Dragon Blood' in their veins. It is a popular misconception that this refers to the heirs of the Septim lineage. This is obviously false since the majority of wearers were not Septims."

The short answer, I am sure other will provide more detail.

Either that or the Arcturian Heresy was wrong. It could happen.

Either way, the Amulet was probably so that as long as Cyrodiil had a ruler, and therefore order, the Divine barriers would keep Mehrunes Dagon from invading. No point in shielding a land when it would be an improvement to get taken over by Dagon. Of course, the Mythic Dawn sort of found a loophole; assassinating off those that can wear it, and when Akatosh was summoned/mantled/whatever, it was a situation where the Divine Barriers no longer worked as they were meant to, so when they were re-established, they would supposedly never be destroyed.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 3:16 pm

Either that or the Arcturian Heresy was wrong. It could happen.

Either way, the Amulet was probably so that as long as Cyrodiil had a ruler, and therefore order, the Divine barriers would keep Mehrunes Dagon from invading. No point in shielding a land when it would be an improvement to get taken over by Dagon. Of course, the Mythic Dawn sort of found a loophole; assassinating off those that can wear it, and when Akatosh was summoned/mantled/whatever, it was a situation where the Divine Barriers no longer worked as they were meant to, so when they were re-established, they would supposedly never be destroyed.

What does this have to do with the Arcturian Heresy?

Calling them barriers is simplifying things enough. Regarding them as 'what keeps Dagon out' is even worse.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:09 am

What does this have to do with the Arcturian Heresy?

Calling them barriers is simplifying things enough. Regarding them as 'what keeps Dagon out' is even worse.

Well, that's what is presented in the game's central plot. Even Mankar Camoran mentions them.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 12:26 pm

Well, that's what is presented in the game's central plot. Even Mankar Camoran mentions them.

It's like saying that atoms only exist in order to create nuclear bombs. Actually, it's almost exactly like that.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 8:06 pm

It's like saying that atoms only exist in order to create nuclear bombs. Actually, it's almost exactly like that.

Well, the Amulet did light the Dragonfires, keeping Dagon out, and when it was smashed, the Avatar of Akatosh appeared and closed the gates. I don't think it could be meant for much else.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:59 am

Well, the Amulet did light the Dragonfires, keeping Dagon out, and when it was smashed, the Avatar of Akatosh appeared and closed the gates. I don't think it could be meant for much else.

I'm talking about the Liminal Barriers, the Lunar Lattice. The Amulet is meant as the Stone of White Gold, a construct that was NOT intended to keep anyone out. Somewhat the opposite, in fact.

When the barriers weakened, it was not cracks in a wall, Nirn itself was fading.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:25 am

I'm talking about the Liminal Barriers, the Lunar Lattice. The Amulet is meant as the Stone of White Gold, a construct that was NOT intended to keep anyone out. Somewhat the opposite, in fact.

When the barriers weakened, it was not cracks in a wall, Nirn itself was fading.

But the Amulet was supposedly given to Alessia, and the Tower was initially built by the Ayleids.

I don't know where people get these things. It couldn't all be from the Imperial Library.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 11:31 pm

But the Amulet was supposedly given to Alessia, and the Tower was initially built by the Ayleids.

The amulet is Alessia (the first gem).

Or so I have read, at least.

» Sun Jul 25, 2010 2:59 pm

I'm talking about the Liminal Barriers, the Lunar Lattice. The Amulet is meant as the Stone of White Gold, a construct that was NOT intended to keep anyone out. Somewhat the opposite, in fact.

When the barriers weakened, it was not cracks in a wall, Nirn itself was fading.

*jaw drop* Could you walk me through that one, slowly?