I'm trying to nail down the correct way to create mannequins. I want to actually understand why, and how, so no "just copy it dude" responses

In the player houses they all seem to be created from the same three components:

• XMarkerHeading (static)
  
• PlayerHouseMannequin (actor)
  
• MannequinActivateTrig (Activator)

The XMarkerHeading has a linked reference to the PlayerHouseMannequin
The PlayerHouseMannequin has a linked reference to the XMarkerHeading

The PlayerHouseMannequin has an Activate Parents entry (delay 0, Parent Activate Only) to the MannequinActivateTrig

Both the XMarkerHeading and the PlayerHouseMannequin are created via drag and drop from the Object Window

The MannequinActivateTrig is created by selecting the PlayerHouseMannequin and clicking on the Create Trigger toolbar button (box with T) and selecting MannequinActivateTrig as the template trigger. Also ticking the "Player Activation" box on the Primitive Tab.

I can duplicate the references the same way as in the player buildings but I cannot seem to get it to actually prompt with "E - Activate Mannequin"

Can anyone enlighten me as to why doing these steps doesn't produce a working mannequin?

Try giving your activate trigger some dimensions in the primitive tab. Make the box bigger than the xmarkerheading box dimensions.

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Cooking up some mods
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Sorry I can't be any help orcman00. I'm having the same problem, with two additions.

1) The mannequins (4/4) are not posed in the default idle position of the original model. They obtain a pose similar to a standing NPC.
2) The two unworking mannequins walk around or move around in the xmarker.

Two of my four mannequins work, but are not posed correctly. The only difference between them is the directions they're facing.

@n8pants: if you look at the script tab on the mannequin and click properties, you can set a pose variable. that might help there

@Jopon: will try this and report results soon

I found it was necessary to go to the "EnableParent" Tab, go to the "Cell" drop-down menu, and select "WhiterunBreezehome"

The "Reference" Tab's drop-down menu should be "MannequinActivateTrig ###" where "###" is the number of the ActivateTrig you are using.

Not sure if this is necessary, I copied my Mannequins from the Markarth house.
Have had problems with some Mannequins being female, others just randomly move, and one won't wear the Ancient Nord Helmet.

Please do, I'm interested in seeing if this will work.

@orcman00 tried that already. i've tried about everything except McQ83's recommendation, but I didnt copy my mannequins from anywhere. One was made on location and then copied around once working.

update: my mannequins have started working since the creation kit update. is it possible that the kit is the reason why they arent working? however, the walking mannequins still walk and only stop when armor is added to them. Then, they pose like a zombie jesus.

@n8pants: did you create a new actor from the Mannequin one (right clicked, selected new), or just dragged and dropped it onto the render window?

I'm thinking that if you created a new actor, you have actually created a walking, talking npc / follower with a mannequin skin

@jopon,@Exorince tried making the trigger box way bigger than the mannequin box, didn't make any difference.

Crazy thing is that I once made it work but cannot repeat the steps, as it was late at night and I was trying all sorts of random stuff. ref links to self, reversing parent activation links, etc. Now I appreciate the methodical approach.

One thing I'd like to add is that if you are trying to create a bookshelf/mannequin/weapon rack in an interior location (i.e. breezehome), then make sure you are loading a save located outside of the interior area where you created your mod. For some reason, if you load an already existent save that places you in the same interior location, the game has problems integrating your existing save data with the new modified game data. I spent three hours last night trying to put together a bookshelf, and it had turned out that this issue was the source of all my headaches.Finally after I loaded an earlier save in a different location, when I fast-travelled to my home and went inside the mods worked perfectly. Hope this helps anyone having problems...

Easy way to place a mannequin.

Copy from one of the player homes all three pieces.
If you have your own version of the '>Actor >PlayerHouseMannequin' then you can do this:
Select the objects surrounding the mannequin object and press '1' to make them unselectable. Do this until you can select your mannequin.
Once selected, use the toolbar >Edit >Search & Replace
Then select your new mannequin in the second box, and it will replace the object, leaving all the links and properties of the original assigned to your new mannequin.

I think what orcman is after is the method of creating these things from scratch so he can know HOW it works and WHY you have to set things up a certain way. He's like one of those algebra students that would rather work it all out on paper than use a calculator

If the work is all done for you, how can you learn?

you have my thinking correct G. B. Jackson

I've finally worked out what was stopping the mannequin working correctly.

It seems that when you create the trigger, it needs to rotated 180 degrees on the vertical axis to become active. All other steps were correct.

I found this out when I copied an existing working one and rotated it and it stopped working. Spinning only the trigger made it all work again.

I think this might show how the player interacts with the trigger boxes and may be linked to how the rendering is done (backface culling?)

So the TLDR version is:

1. drag PlayerHouseMannequin actor onto render window
2. drag XMarkerHeading static onto render window
3. create new trigger via toolbar button, selecting MannequinActivateTrig as the form
4. tick the player activation box & resize the trigger bounds to approx 48,34,128
5. spin the trigger 180 (so trigger face that was at the back is now at the front)
6. add a new linked ref from XMarkerHeading to PlayerHouseMannequin
7. add a new linked ref from PlayerHouseMannequin to XMarkerHeading
8. add a new Activate Parent from PlayerHouseMannequin to MannequinActivateTrig
9. tick Parent Activate Only in PlayerHouseMannequin
10. center trigger and heading onto mannequin center
11. position and rotate whole assembly +-90 to suit
12. enjoy your working mannequin

note: if the trigger is rotated more than 90 degrees it may stop working, so swap the trigger bounds to 34,48,128 and rotate to suit

now to figure out bookcases

also rotating the entire setup by a few degrees works as well.

Kia Ora

I didn't see this post before I posted but maybe here is best

I have read that it's not a good idea to have more than 10 bookselves in a cell or you get CTD's

I cut back my Bookselves to 10 and have 12 manniquins and about 25 sword mounts 3 sword & sheild mounts

I can not leave the cell without CTD.
I want to fix this I coppied most of the item from the local cell sword & sheild from the warehouse cell the manniquins from Proudspire home.
I did this because there is no tutorials at this time on how to make them. (you listerning beth, tut's from you on these item are missing)
I'm not sure if that create issues at all.

I need to clear up some thoughts here and any help would be neat Beth

1/ is there a safe limit to how many maniquinns we can have in a cell

2/ if I have 10 bookselves in that cell does that effect the manniquinn count

3/ do sword sheild mounts count in this issue

@Orcman00

Thanks for the wee tut mate, as for bookcase's

theres two on here
http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1343653-creation-kit-video-tutorials-merged/

btw, i just tested mannequins that are facing each other, the 180 degree offset does not work for one of them.

you can set one of the mannequins' triggerbox 180 offset, but the other one needs an arbitray offset angle, something like 5 degrees works.

so for example:

one mannequin is at 0 degrees rotation, its trigger box at 180 degrees (works fine).
another mannequin is at 180 degrees, its trigger box at 5 degrees (this works, 0 degrees does not.)



as i mentioned before, i think the easiest rule of thumb for any activation type furniture (mannequins, weapon racks etc) is to use non-square angles (such as 1 degree, 89 degrees, 179 degrees). then you don't need to worry about the 180 degree offset.

@ Kiwi_Hawk: I've created a room with over 60 mannequins (my display house I'm working on) and over 480 weapon plaques. Doesn't seem to be a problem yet.

@Amethyst Deceiver: I'm not sure on how the engine works with the triggers. (Boy is that something Beth could elaborate on or what?)
I'm thinking there is one "active face" that is tied somehow to the trigger script and that one needs to be facing front.
Certainly a slight angle on the invisible trigger is not going to change the playability

I'm going to do some more testing on trigger angles and see if I can't dig up what the factor is.

i'm not sure if the face-forward is the issue because i have gotten it to work with all 3 elements facing the same direction.

i think the triggers just stop working mysteriously is somehow related to hard-aligned square angless (0, 90, 180). they always seem to work fine at any in-between angle.

Kia Ora

Ok so that now why I get CTD when I leave, wonder if copying them from Proudspire is part of it

something else i just noticed.

i went through the cell view and looked at every mannequin i have in the edit window, and apparently duplicating a mannequin set (copying the actor, trigger and xmarker) does not carry everything over.

some of them have lost their link-ref values, and others have odd spaces placed randomly in the window. i also noticed that if you leave the cell travel to a new city, then come back, the mannequins may have shifted. sometimes their poses change, sometimes they turn their heads. many odd glitches happen, even though they still function.



i would suggest if you're making multiple mannequins in a house, you do them all manually one by one from scratch and dont duplicate.


edit: another very stange thing i found. i decided to make all of my trigger boxes all have a 95 degree rotation, regardless which direction the mannequin is facing. it seems putting the trigger at 95 degrees eliminates the untouchable underwear bug (LOL)

I'd like to qualify my numbers above after a little testing.
It looks like i am hitting a texture limit once I fully load up 12 mannequins
Some armors are starting to be shown in both the inventory preview and in game without a texture (in a lovely lilac color!)
It isn't giving CTD's though.

Going to have to do a complete redesign my display house to work around this. There goes 2 weeks work

Kia Ora

Orcman00

Maybe devide the room into a sub cell via a door,.. or would subspace's work do you think

that will be the idea for the next layout, but it wont work for the current one; it's a vast cathedral with three levels. Almost teracotta warrior tomb like. It looks beautiful, but alas can't work properly in game (can't clothe all the mannequins).
I can't work out how to attach a pic yet in this forum.

Kia Ora

Any way to make each level a cell, stick a door at the end of the stairway maybe