The Daedra, Aedra, and Talos aren't gods. : The Elder Scrolls Series Discussion

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 9:49 pm

A god?

None of the Daedra or Aedra are gods.

A god is a being that is omnipotent, omnipresent, omnificent, cannot be killed, who has always been and isn't bound by time, etc.

Daedra and Aedra were born at some time, they can be killed, tricked, aren't omnipotent, omnipresent, or omnificent.

They are just monsters with strong or unique powers.

Talos was in no way close to even being as weakly strong as a Daedra.

The blessing he gives is just that. A blessing. He isn't a god or even close. He is like Hrothmuund, a ghost that watches over his people.

Defining a TES god by real-life views of a God is a hollow argument.

Would you care to elaborate?

Please define to me what a god is.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:12 pm

Which Daedra was killed? You mean the lesser Daedra? Their souls don't die, only their bodies.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 9:30 pm

Which TES Games have you played?
You really dont think the nine divines are gods?

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:13 pm

The Daedra can not be killed, and the Greek gods were born at one time, doesn't make them not gods.

Eric Clapton is God, and I'm pretty sure he can be killed.

» Thu Apr 25, 2013 1:13 am

Not everyone's definition of a god is the same, excuse us for not adhering to yours.

» Thu Apr 25, 2013 12:04 am

Well I'm glad other lore-savvies jumped in while I poured a drink.

*Sips*

Continue...

Interesting for you to quote me in the OP. It seems a bit like you're challenging me, Robert.

» Thu Apr 25, 2013 2:56 am

If Talos is not a Divine CoC never succeed to open the portal to Mankar Camorans Paradise and so the Tamriel was never saved from the invasion of Mehrunes Dagon.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:19 pm

it's relative and debatable.

The Aedra are gods in that they are the laws of physics and nature (earthbones) and magic can't be worked without "bargaining" with them. The Daedra are gods in that they are immensely powerful and incomprehensible. They both are literally ideas, virtues, and sins. And mythopoeia and belief are also what makes them gods.

But.... if you consider that the Aurbis (universe) is the surreal dream of a comatose godhead; then no, they are not gods.

It's all relative and debatable.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 5:46 pm

A god:

being or object believed to have more than natural attributes and powers and to require human worship; specifically: one controlling a particular aspect or part of reality
(in some religions) a being or spirit who is believed to have power over a particular part of nature or who is believed to represent a particular quality
(lowercase) one of several deities, especially a male deity, presiding over some portion of worldly affairs.
a spirit or being believed to control some part of the universe or life and often worshipped for doing so, or something that represents this spirit or being

I really don't see what the problem is.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 7:19 pm

A god doesn't have to be omnipotent or omnipresent. The Aedra and Daedra have pretty much complete control over the spheres they represent, and those are the spheres that make up the Aurbis. They are gods.

The 8 divines are directly responsible for the creation of Mundus, and the Daedra have created their own realms.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:43 am

A god is a being that is omnipotent, omnipresent, omnificent, cannot be killed, who has always been and isn't bound by time, etc.

That's one definition....

Please define to me what a god is.

'A being of supernatural powers or attributes, believed in and worshiped by a people, especially a male deity thought to control some part of nature or reality.'

or

'A being or object believed to have more than natural attributes and powers and to require human worship.'

or

'A superhuman being or spirit worshipped as having power over nature or human fortunes.'

No mention of omnipotence omnipresence, or omnificence :shrug:

'd

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 11:39 pm

Greek Gods - Were born, fought the Titans in a war (you can only have a war with death), and 'mingled' with Mankind to produce Demi-Gods. I think you're thinking Talos and ilk are Demi-Gods.

Roman Gods - Practically the same.

Again, you're seeing Gods in the modern sense, in which they cannot be killed. This is because in reality, mankind is strong. And could revolt. That's probably why modern gods are immortal and omnipotent.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:59 pm

A god:

being or object believed to have more than natural attributes and powers and to require human worship; specifically: one controlling a particular aspect or part of reality
(in some religions) a being or spirit who is believed to have power over a particular part of nature or who is believed to represent a particular quality
(lowercase) one of several deities, especially a male deity, presiding over some portion of worldly affairs.
a spirit or being believed to control some part of the universe or life and often worshipped for doing so, or something that represents this spirit or being

I really don't see what the problem is.

That's one definition....

'A being of supernatural powers or attributes, believed in and worshiped by a people, especially a male deity thought to control some part of nature or reality.'

or

'A being or object believed to have more than natural attributes and powers and to require human worship.'

or

'A superhuman being or spirit worshipped as having power over nature or human fortunes.'

No mention of omnipotence omnipresence, or omnificence :shrug:

'd

This and I love you both.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 5:22 pm

Deadra cannot be killed. The Aedra on the other hand, can.

» Thu Apr 25, 2013 2:56 am

Deadra cannot be killed. The Aedra on the other hand, can.

They are not the only gods in human fiction or real belief who can be killed.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:16 pm

Deadra cannot be killed. The Aedra on the other hand, can.

I don't think they can be killed, necessarily Just... mostly dead. Not all dead. Like Lorkhan. I think the closest you can get is removing pretty much all of their influence. Anybody think otherwise? I could be wrong.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:04 pm

The Daedra can not be killed

My mistake.

The lore says that they cannot be killed but that doesn't make them gods.

The Greek gods were born at one time, doesn't make them not gods.

The greek gods aren't gods.

If they were born (created) then how are they gods?

How can a being that was created by something else be considered a god?

Not everyone's definition of a god is the same, excuse us for not adhering to yours.

Tell me what a god is.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 6:50 pm

The greek gods aren't gods.

If they were born (created) then how are they gods?

How can a being that was created by something else be considered a god?

You can't attribute your personal definitions to someone elses work.

» Thu Apr 25, 2013 12:15 am

Tell me what a god is.

Three people have.

And go on, I dare you. Call up a classical mythologist and tell him that the Greek and Roman gods aren't, by definition, gods.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:00 pm

I don't think they can be killed, necessarily Just... mostly dead. Not all dead. Like Lorkhan. I think the closest you can get is removing pretty much all of their influence. Anybody think otherwise? I could be wrong.

The original 9 divine gave up their immortality to create Mundus. This why Magnus left the creation before it was too late.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 5:44 pm

My mistake.

The lore says that they cannot be killed but that doesn't make them gods.

The greek gods aren't gods.

If they were born (created) then how are they gods?

How can a being that was created by something else be considered a god?

Tell me what a god is.

You seem to have a habit as percieving your own opinions on the matter as fact and challenging anyone who doesn't agree otherwise. (Which so far is virtually everyone)

Calling the Greek/Roman Gods 'not gods' is a foolish notion. They are gods, as goes their mythology and stories. The mythology and stories is what makes a God. Not their power of person, but there power over people by belief.

You can't attribute your personal definitions to someone elses work.

See?

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:52 pm

The original 9 divine gave up their immortality to create Mundus. This why Magnus left the creation before it was too late.

They couldn't have given up their immortality. I think you're thinking of the Ehlnofey. Again, could be wrong. Got any sources?

» Thu Apr 25, 2013 2:46 am

The greek gods aren't gods.

To the Greeks they were gods.

Your modern, somewhat parochial viewpoint, doesn't change that.

Tell me what a god is.

It would appear your opinion is already locked and loaded :ermm:

» Thu Apr 25, 2013 2:12 am

They couldn't have given up their immortality. I think you're thinking of the Ehlnofey. Again, could be wrong. Got any sources?

If I'm not mistaken, they did become mortal when they became apart of the creation of the world, which is why Lorkhan had to trick them.

» Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:55 pm

You can't attribute your personal definitions to someone elses work.

WHOA! OFF-TOPIC! When did your avatar move!?