http://forums.nexusmods.com/index.php?/topic/733756-is-the-dragonborn-actually-tiber-septim/

When I saw this topic, I thought: If the dragonborn is a god, why would he worship other gods or even himself? Wouldn't it be strange to be someone who worships himself. Or does the dragonborn don't know that he is Talos and does he entirely follow his own mind sepated from that from Talos?

The Dovahkiin is a walking Enatiomorph trigger, and is most likely by the end of Dragonborn already as powerful as a weak god. He isn't exactly Talos, but there is evidence that he is mantling him.

Gods worship themselves all the time. Just look at Sheogorath! Not only does he worship himself, but he also worships his enemy while wearing his enemies' armor, speaking in his voice, and pretending to be him and attacking his own realm. And then worshiping the mortal who takes his place whom was always him.

Heck, we have Boethiah practically worshiping the ground Lorkhan walked on.

The LDB isn't Talos in the literal sense. But it does seem like LDB is walking in his foot-steps.

Is it even possible to mantle someone who has achieved CHIM? Isn't mantling basically the idea that you mimic a god's actions so much, reality can no longer tell the difference between you and the god you've mantled, thus making both of you the same? Given CHIM's emphasis on retaining your identity in the face of all logic, wouldn't someone confusing reality's perception of your identity put a hamper on your ability to maintain CHIM?

Talos knows Royalty, but the one myth that gave birth to him is now as significant as any other tacked onto it. I know I'm moth-talking here, but the point is that Talos was sorta already three or four people that blurred into each other and still do, and yet we can identify one persona or Will as Talos, and say that it has attained the Tower (actual evidence of this somewhat difficult).

Like, Ysgramor and Pelinal and so on were both several people, but we still know their names. Talos might not have any conscious say in the matters of mortals which emulate him, but then again those mortals might not either. I'm rambling here; I think what I mean to say is that as far as Memory and truth are concerned, Talos always moved just like the you-that-becomes-him moved. If you don't do anything significant, then you get forgotten. If you do something new under the mantle of Talos, then Talos continues to act through CHIM, and your actions are automatically seen as in accordance with his.

It's a compromise between seeing Talos as you, and seeing Talos act through you. Or so I'd imagine. Things get a little confusing when the Hero is involved, because that character (you) is the only thing that really seems to make lucid decisions in Tamriel.

I wouldn't say he's Talos, nor mantling him. Tiber set out to really make it so that the character he played ended up being the actor to play Tiber, and through that play, Talos ended up being born... if that makes sense to you. With the Dragonborn, there is symbolism, but it's more of the constant echo of one half of the universe against the other (Anu vs Padomay, Auriel vs Sithis, Time God vs. Space God, etc), and the fulfillment of the loophole established by the creators of Mundus, so that should it be under a true mythic threat, something would be there to prevent the cycle from repeating itself over and continue the Space God's plans.

Then again, I may be rambling.

He might be mantling him. That is as far as I would go with that anology. Being Dragonborn does not make you the same person as Talos.

Right now, I'd say the closest one has gone to actually mantle something was the CoC with Sheogorath. However, a bunch of cheating was involved, as Sheogorath did plainly make the CoC follow in his very literal steps.

A Talos, Crowned in Storms and Serpents.

at most you could say he/she is mantling Hjalti aka pre-tiber septim..Tiber..but no he/she is not "mantling Talos"

Talos is more of an idea than a man now. He's an Earthbone. You fulfill some of the same roles as Talos, but you don't fully mantle him.

That's not to say his presence isn't somewhat tangible in the world. You can empower your natural abilities with his shrines and amulets, and you get lots of letters from a "friend" with helpful tips on growing your power as Dragonborn. (That one may have been Mora, but hell - the differences there are not as pronounced as you may assume.)

Twisted and evil.

...Wait.

Sounds right for Talos

He's uh..

1. A hero who's original identity is skewed (Septim)
2. Named Ysmir (Hjalti, Wulfharth)
3. Fights Alduin in Sovngarde (Shor's Ghost)
4. Confused for Hjalti
5. Can sit in Shor's Throne
*6. Learned about CHIM (Septim)
7. Participated in an enantiomorphic event with his mirror image (Septim, Wulfharth)

*Waking Dreams of a Starless Sky talks about the nature of the godhead, this is what the LDB reads before fighting Miraak. Just an unconfirmed assumption on my part.

So.. he's not Talos.. but..

If you hum a few bars he can fake it.

The shor's throne part isn't required for the story, just because you can doesn't mean anything >.>

The problem I have with the Enantiomorphic event is that every time I think of it, I find myself in the shoes of Trinimac or Zurin Arctus, not Aka or Tiber. That doesn't sit well with me, mainly because I know how Aka and Tiber rewarded their right-hand servants in the end. More importantly to the thread, though... I suppose it could add to one's connection with Talos (because technically Zurin is part of Talos, too), but I don't know exactly what that means for the Dragonborn's relationship with either Ulfric or Tullius.

Another problem the only time we see a King in the mix is during the battle with Miraak, Mora being the king. In the civil war there is no king in the mix you just have the rebel (Ulfric) and the Witness (LDB) Tulius is no the king and Ulfric certainly is the rebel, in order to actually mantle Talos we would not only need a king but we would also need to be betrayed by them, so for the most part the only potential pairing to mantle Talos is Miraak (rebel) Herma-Mora (king) and the LDB (witness).

edit: Oh and I forgot Harkon and all that but no one gets their heart ripped out like what the other rebels did i.e. Auriel and Wulfharth did though supposedly that's not required since the HoonDing is a entiomorphic(sp) event between two people and as far as I know there wasn't a heart being ripped out of the Prince of Hammerfell in Redguard.

In the Civil War one (if it's legit), the DB is in the role of Trinimac yeah. In the Dragonborn one, the LDB and Miraak are time/space while Hermaeus Mora is Trinimac/Magnus.

In the civil war who is the king? I've already pointed out there is no king in the mix of the civil war theory.

King would be Tullius. Rebel would be Ulfric. Doesn't have to be a literal king, just as LDB/Miraak aren't literal kings.

...Miraak was the rebel and the LDB was the witness, if anything Mora would be the king because he is the ruler of his realm, Tulius isn't the ruler of anything he is just the general of the legion in skyrim. In each instance of the king the king was always a ruler, Lorkhan ruled over everything, Tiber ruled over the empire and Prince A'tor was the ruler of the Crown.

One need not take the title of "King" literally. The King is the person with legitimate authority who is overthrown and replaced by one who does not. In that case, Tullius would be considered the King because he holds legitimate authority over Skyrim based on the emperor's commands. However, since this would have to work both ways, if we side with the Empire and kill Ulfric for Tullius, Ulfric is therefore the King--and it makes some sense, because as far as the Nords who support him are concerned, he holds legitimate authority due to his position as jarl, his appeal to tradition, and his (to the Nords) legal killing of the previous High King of Skyrim. In that case, Tullius is the outsider who has come in to remove the legitimate ruler of the place, and you are his instrument, just as you are (on the Stormcloak side) the instrument of the upstart Ulfric that kills Tullius, the dispenser of the emperor's (again legitimate) authority, in a city that accepts Imperial law and order.

No. Miraak and LDB are the ones who switch roles and usurp one another. Mora is the witness.

Tullius represents the Empire which is the current authority or power. Ulfric is the opposite.

But that doesn't change the fact that he doesn't rule the empire and the LDB only rules over something completely if he was a vampire and killed Harkon, due to the LDB not actually being a ruler or anything (since the guilds of the games are always consider to have been done by someone other then the main hero) so far the LDB is only the witness of said events, the position is always someone else being the king or rebel and saying "Tulius is the king because he represents the empire" is pulling at straws poorly at best.