[ruCkii]

An Elder Scrolls Novel not written for Hard core Elder Scrolls Fans????!!!???!!!!???


If that is really true, then why are we wasting time discussing ... that ... that...

(selfcensored)

[Sheila Esmailka]

Wow, it sure does take a long time to kill an unaware argonian and girl, lol "by the way, who are those guys spying on us?" LMAO, oh gee lets let those two guys watch us have a drug-dealing transaction, ah that was funny, weak but funny.

Yes, in reality they would have had to fight their way out and probably would have been wounded or killed; but it's early in the book. You will see matters get a lot more serious.

I should have said: "Not written SOLELY for hard-core fans." Better?

Did you really think Bethesda would aim their novelizations only at veterans of TES?

[Scarlet Devil]

I think the problem is that writing is telling a story, and the most convincing stories are those from the heart. In other words, what Bethesda did was just hire a writer unfamiliar with the TES universe and pay the story teller to just construct a story... like a contractor. If the writer doesn't love their material, if they don't live and breath it and have it near and dear, then the story is just going through the motions, apply names to prefabricated archetypes and plots. You get a basic plot and then dress it in the terminology of the selected fantasy universe. That's the impression I got from Keyes - especially from his description of the Argonian and the girl. The descriptions were just tacked in there and didn't flow well at all.

As I was walking back from class I was thinking the same exact thing. Keyes' was presented with an entire universe and had to construct a story out of out and knew next to nothing at the beginning about it so some of the things that happened in the chapter seemed like it was fanservice and also because he probably experimented with it when he played Oblivion and threw it into the story(skooma dealer/potion of slowfalling). I guess the closet thing I can relate too when it comes to this is being told I have to write a paper on a topic that I know little about that contains a lot of information in short timespan.

Personally I don't see why they didn't have one of the guys who writes the books in-game or loremasters to write this( I assume they are busy with the next game)

[Bellismydesi]

Wow. Just wow. Flame war much?

I still do not see how I was wrong in understanding his post.

And this is hardly a anolysis, more like a bunch of kids who should be doing their schoolwork and such whining because the author didn't write the way that THEY wanted. Wait till the BOOK comes out to judge, not on a excerpt.

You're contradicting yourself. You know that, right? Now stop whining at us and go do your homework.

By the way, you started this. No one was talking to you.

[City Swagga]

As I was walking back from class I was thinking the same exact thing. Keyes' was presented with an entire universe and had to construct a story out of out and knew next to nothing at the beginning about it so some of the things that happened in the chapter seemed like it was fanservice and also because he probably experimented with it when he played Oblivion and threw it into the story(skooma dealer/potion of slowfalling). I guess the closet thing I can relate too when it comes to this is being told I have to write a paper on a topic that I know little about that contains a lot of information in short timespan.

Personally I don't see why they didn't have one of the guys who writes the books in-game or loremasters to write this( I assume they are busy with the next game)

Yes, in reality they would have had to fight their way out and probably would have been wounded or killed; but it's early in the book. You will see matters get a lot more serious.

I should have said: "Not written SOLELY for hard-core fans." Better?

Did you really think Bethesda would aim their novelizations only at veterans of TES?

Because, like syronj said, they weren't aiming at the hardcoe lore fanatics of TES, but the general population. If it had been written by a loremaster it would of most likely (IMO) been boring or made no sense to the average TES playing John Doe.

[Your Mum]

We should remember that Keyes isn't writing for the hard-core fans like us who have been around for years so much as he's trying to introduce the public to the Elder Scrolls series in a way that won't confuse them with a mass of arcane detail.

I thought that already happened with TESIV?

:bolt:

@nighthawk0110: Actually, I really like the in-game books, and they weren't that difficult to get in to (the short stories type - not the tricky stuff like the Mythic Dawn Commentaries and the Sermons of Vivec).

[jasminε]

I thought that already happened with TESIV?

:bolt:

@nighthawk0110: Actually, I really like the in-game books, and they weren't that difficult to get in to (the short stories type - not the tricky stuff like the Mythic Dawn Commentaries and the Sermons of Vivec).

True I also like the in-game books, but they are a bit different, you are already IN-GAME. You already have some, basic at least, knowledge of TES. If I walked into a bookstore and started reading about Dunmer and Altmer and Dwemer and Khajiit... I would be going like "who was high when they wrote THIS?" In Keyes case he does use lore, but he gently persuades you into it.

Also in my last post I mean READING not PLAYING. :banghead:

[glot]

I thought that already happened with TESIV?

:bolt:

@nighthawk0110: Actually, I really like the in-game books, and they weren't that difficult to get in to (the short stories type - not the tricky stuff like the Mythic Dawn Commentaries and the Sermons of Vivec).

Touche, about "Oblivion". Also, Ted Peterson is a good writer and wrote a lot of the in-game books that you like.

Let's not get into a flame war about the novel, when we haven't read the whole book yet. I agree that the Argonian comes across as almost too human. I wonder, though, if Annaig and he could have been talking in Hist? We don't know that they were speaking Cyrodiilic.

I like the portrayal of the Imperials remaining in Black Marsh. Although I'm no historian, it reminds me of the Romano-Britons who remained after the collapse of the Roman Empire in the 5th century CE. Some returned to Rome, but other families had been living in the colonies for centuries, and stayed. Just as with the fall of Rome, the Imperial remnants of Black Marsh can't get used to there no longer being a Pax Romana.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pax_Romana

[Joey Bel]

Just based on the excerpt, I like Annaig. She's not the stereotypical rebellious-princess "My-dad-is-rich-but-I-just-want-to-get-into-trouble" character.

Isn't she? That's exactly how she came across to me. And I agree that the writing is sub-par.

But.

This is only an excerpt, and I was impressed that Keyes created a decent atmosphere for an Argonian city. Even from this short passage he's created a strong political backstory since the Oblivion crisis in this location.

The characters were appallingly bland, so they had better be improved as the book goes on. The world and its events seem well constructed and described though, and I've heard good things about his previous books, so I still have a lot of hope. The general writing may have come across badly to me, but i've become accustomed to Steven Erikson recently, and there's no way I can expect every author to write as brilliantly as him.

[Erin S]

Heh I didn't get the stubborn princes thing at all, mainly because

Spoiler

Glim said that her dad was underpaid

... though it does seem she likes adventures, trouble or no.

[Ludivine Poussineau]

Really, people. I feel some are expecting far too much. Did we honestly think this would be a fresh slab of MK Kryptospeak? Or even of the same level of writers who've been immersed in the ES culture for a long time now?

I find the excerpt to be good. Does it have flaws? Of course. Does it present some things that I find questionable? Naturally. But, 1) It is an excerpt. Nothing more. Let's wait until the whole novel has been read before lambasting Keyes, shall we? And, 2) It could have been a LOT worse. I started reading the excerpt under extremely low expectations. I never expected this to be a novel for the core of the fanbase. I never expected this to be a high echelon of literary quality. I mean, c'mon. It's a video game novel, for [censored]'s sake. What were we all honestly expecting?

I started reading with the expectation that it would be a really light read that would provide some none-too-deep information about the progress of Tamriel after the events of the Oblivion crisis, while starting to flesh out a plot (which I also didn't expect the world of) and not doing something completely unforgivable of the magnitude of portraying the Dwemer as short bearded scottish men. This is like Oblivion all over again in far more ways than one, because people seem to be making the same mistake now as then: expecting and anticipating far too much than what the actual medium would communicate. Except, this time, Bethesda has no fault whatsoever in stoking that fire. It's not like THEY promised us a masterwork. They said, "A novel about a video game, written by a guy who's not that familiar with it as of yet." And based on that context, I'm both satisfied and fairly relieved. As I said before: it could have been A LOT worse.

[Shannon Marie Jones]

As I said before: it could have been A LOT worse.

This. :thumbsup:

[teeny]

Personally, I have no idea what people are talking about when they say that there wasn't any character. For a single, early-chapter excerpt it had a lot, it just wasn't presented in a boring "Here ios character A who does x, y and z." We get it through thier actions: Both are idiot teenagers (Annaig explicitly stated, Glim implied) so of course their dialogue will seem juvenile, for one. second, I told you all so. Some people have at least semi-legit complaints, some have fully legit ones (based on taste). Of course, then there are some who don't mucvh care about quality but who did or did not write it.

Seriously, simply by random dialogue scraps and actions you do learn a lot about both. So saying that we don't get any character (even though it's the firstkn chapter, so that isn't inexcusable anyway) is surprisingly dull, especially since I know for a solid fact everyone who said that in this thread is almost freakishly intelligent.

[ladyflames]

They said, "A novel about a video game, written by a guy who's not that familiar with it as of yet." And based on that context, I'm both satisfied and fairly relieved. As I said before: it could have been A LOT worse.

What "they said" sounds like the most idiotic marketing plan ever. :rolleyes:

Still, how much did Bethesda pay this Keyes dude to make the novel? Why couldn't that money have been used for TESV's development, or for awesome merchandise (Daedric Alphabet keyboard, NECA action figure series, sountracks, art books, etc)?

Or a comic book? Given how visual video games are, using a comic book as a medium makes sense, since it is also a visual medium. I can think of a dozen pencilers, inkers, and colorists who'd do a fantastic job.

[Marquis deVille]

What "they said" sounds like the most idiotic marketing plan ever. :rolleyes:

Still, how much did Bethesda pay this Keyes dude to make the novel? Why couldn't that money have been used for TESV's development, or for awesome merchandise (Daedric Alphabet keyboard, NECA action figure series, sountracks, art books, etc)?

Or a comic book? Given how visual video games are, using a comic book as a medium makes sense, since it is also a visual medium. I can think of a dozen pencilers, inkers, and colorists who'd do a fantastic job.

Your assuming that the book isn't being used as a promotion/commercial for TES IV. In a sense it is part of the merchandise. They get money from the book, and popularity to the series/game. Win. Win.

[kat no x]

I'm still wondering if Bethesda is going to throw us a curve when it comes to the new dynasty. "Titus Mede" -- is it possible that Hammerfell wasn't hit as badly during the Oblivion Crisis, and 15-20 years later a Redguard officer takes an (ex) legion to the Imperial City to restore order? It will be interesting to see what race Attrebus and his father are.

Of course, this will probably all be blown out of the water as soon as the novel is generally available.

[Poetic Vice]

Speaking of the new emperor, what do we know of this 'Titus Mede' I haven't heard of him before, is he a new guy or does he have history with the empire?

PS

Kudos to ThatOneGuy for reminding us that many were expecting a bit too much of something so small. :thumbsup:

[Celestine Stardust]

And suddenly the professional literary critics come running out of the woodwork. :rolleyes:

The characters are bland? You read like three [censored] pages. Charicterisation isn't instantaneous.

[Jay Baby]

Speaking of the new emperor, what do we know of this 'Titus Mede' I haven't heard of him before, is he a new guy or does he have history with the empire?

PS

Kudos to ThatOneGuy for reminding us that many were expecting a bit too much of something so small. :thumbsup:

That's the thing, we don't know anything about Titus other than the name being mentioned in the upcoming novel. But Bethesda must have approved the name, if Keyes was able to write it.

[danni Marchant]

Titus Mede is an imerial name, not a redguard one. Furthermore, the Attrebus in Redguard was actually white.

[lucy chadwick]

Titus Mede is an imerial name, not a redguard one. Furthermore, the Attrebus in Redguard was actually white.

He's probably an Imperial then. But it would have been interesting if Bethesda had surprised us.

[Stacey Mason]

The characters are bland? You read like three [censored] pages. Charicterisation isn't instantaneous.

Try about 8 pages. It's not a large sampling, but it's certainly enough to tell me what I assumed from the get go: It's really not worth reading unless you seriously are in love with the series.

People are saying that he's writing for a larger audience so that more people become interested. Well that's a horrible excuse given the writing quality. And he doesn't really do anything with the TES world anyway. This is just another adventure novel. It doesn't make me interested whatsoever. Where's the awesome lore this dude could have taken advantage of? That said, I'll still probably read it just because it's TES.

[Your Mum]

And suddenly the professional literary critics come running out of the woodwork. :rolleyes:

The characters are bland? You read like three [censored] pages. Characterization isn't instantaneous.

I know right?

Why does ThatOneGuy get kudos?!??! I SAID IT FIRST!

Eh whatever. No one appreciates me anymore. :shakehead:

As I said in another thread, Titus Mede is the alias of a Khajiit named M'aiq the Liar. Said he liked horses with creme sauce or something. Another Damn crazed Imperial if you ask me.

[Jessica Colville]

Maybe it's a further sign that they've been lifelong friends and that Annaig is the type who can get other people to follow her -- a leader without realizing it.

The answer's pretty simple: She rolled CRAZY high Charisma stats

I feel that the introduction is INTENTIONALLY childish, no need to immediately slap you in the face with the somberness of the 'great dangers that lie ahead'.
Rather the excerpt conveys Annaig's thrill-seeking desire to right wrongs & we apparently have a lazy argonian that desires the path of least resistance who is constantly blocked from leisurely pursuits by the 'active do-gooder' with whom he's shared a childhood & all the bonds created over their lifes (up to now).

[Jaylene Brower]

Your assuming that the book isn't being used as a promotion/commercial for TES IV. In a sense it is part of the merchandise. They get money from the book, and popularity to the series/game. Win. Win.

If I drew a Venn diagram of "People who read books" and "people who are interested in reading a book based on a video game series," the overlap would be incredibly itsy bitsy teentsy weentsy. As small as Todd's perceived estimation of the mod users for TESIV.