Vertibirds were not designed as a long range aircraft and sure as hell can't fly across an ocean.

I have to say Styles, that quote there seems to suggest that the distance is upwards of 175 miles. As in they can fly at least 175 miles but are capable of more.

Im not as particularly well versed in Fallout 2 as other people (didn't play it as much as Fallout 1) but is there a more specfic quote from the game that limits their mileage?

Edit: not saying they can fly across to other countries or anything but its possible that its more than what we initally assumed.

If they have a fusion reactor, then yes, they are in fact long-range aircraft as they have no need to refuel.

However, a fact to consider: a World War One Sopwith Camel biplane has an effective range of 300 miles. Your interpretation of that statement (which at no point gives a concrete definition of Vertibird range, merely a minimum) would have the effective range of a Vertibird, the U.S. Army of 2077's cutting-edge VTOL aircraft, at roughly 87.5 miles (175 if they aren't refueling at Navarro as stated earlier). That's less than a third of the range of a World War One aircraft.

Does that seem logical to you?

Hmmm... So maybe it is possible for them to cross oceans. Interesting.

Cheers,
Mk II

I have to agree with this. I just did a little research and it seems the record for the longest distance flown for a helicopter was set in 1966 by The Hughes OH-6 Cayuse, a single engine copter, and it was about 2213 miles. Its seems to me that a fusion powered craft would be able to last longer than that.

If they have a fusion reactor, they should theoretically be able to fly for weeks on end with no need for refueling. Nuclear-powered carriers and submarines can operate for years on end without refueling, and that's using inferior fission technology.

Now, I've no idea how parts and equipment degradation would affect that duration, but a fusion-powered aircraft should have gigantic range.

That said, I personally don't support the overseas bases theory, even with long-range Vertibirds existing.

In responce to this post http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1167059-the-enclave-in-americas-future/page__view__findpost__p__17191156


Don't tell me you are using "SCIENCE!" to explain how they could have pulled FEV and then an Inculation out of their butts! You can't do it. So just stop. If it could be done the Enclave on the Rig would have done it.

People of Vault 13 could not leave because the Overseer wanted them to stay and had the means to keep them there, and still some did leave to help found Arroyo. Enclave in another parts of the world would not even know about America. For generations there families would not know about America. No contact with the Government, why keep going?

Yeah so the Enclave have a Raven Rock every couple hundred Miles? :banghead: Fallout 3 explains that Raven Rock was not manned. Could be other bases in America but they were not manned because they would have been mentioned in Fallout 2.

FEV plan failed in Fallout 2 and they (anyone not on the rig) would have died because they would not have the inculation. No they could not pull it out off their butts with random crap in a lab. Second part about this. If they could then they could have just done the plan again.

Enclave base guy across the ocean:

Sir the plan did not work and the oil rig was destroyed!

Thats to bad. Well ok then let us try!

So then, It would be possible for the Enclave to physically transfer the F.E.V inoculation to other bases? I would like to see what exactly Styles opinion on this is...

Cheers,
Mk II

Why Am I debating with a individual who denies in-game canon and the writings of the WRITER of the game?? Lets try not to make this personal...

And seeing as i very well is possible for Vertibirds to travel across a ocean... Innoculation is no longer a concern.

Cheers,
Mk II

Neither do I. But long range verties do help explain the West to East coast movement of the Enclave, why there were vertibirds in Raven Rock, and how they could have picked up more men on the way to fight in DC.

BECAUSE THE FALLOUT BIBLE IS NOT CANON! The games trump the damn bible! You are going by one line in the bible and I explain to you its wrong with logic and in game proof. And you resort to nothing but maybes and random nonsense.

Vertibirds could not travel across the Ocean.

No IIRC the techs at Navarro stated that the whole point of the base was that it was a refueling point for the Vertibirds. Since they can't make the trip from the oil rig, to Navarro and back with out refueling. Also Tune who says they have fusion reactors? No vehicle in the FO universe has fusion reactors. why do you keep insisting they have fusion reactors? Judging by the layout of the Navarro base you can clearly see what looks like a fuel dump (of fuel barrels) So thats an even stronger claim to them using gasoline stocks from the oil rig. At best they use ELECTRIC engines RUN ON BATTERIES just like your car.

haha. Yes, but you have nothing to say there can't be other bases. FO2 says they are all dead, but they show up in FO3. So that means FO2's ending (concerning the Enclave) is wrong.

In FO3, Raven rock is destroyed, but they still have the Crawler (IT IS OPTIONAL TO DESTROY AND THERE IS NO CANON END TO IT).

All I can (AS I HAVE POINTED OUT SOOOOOO MANY TIMES BEFORE) answer with is maybes because that's all there is. Ask me questions that can actually be answered by FO canon.

YOU HAVE GIVEN ME NO IN GAME PROOF. At least I have given some ingame proof that BACKS UP Bible.

Fallout 2 does not say the Enclave are all dead. Navarro was never explained. Van Buren was to explain it. New Vegas ends up explaining it. Fallout goes by the Good endings and the good ending for Fallout 3 would be Enclave get destoyed. I have given you in game proof, I can't help it if you never played Fallout 2 or choose it ignore my posts.


Also your "proof" is just some blinking lights on a table :facepalm: Its called speculation.

Virtually all derilect vehicles in Fallout 3 and New Vegas have nuclear reactors.

Fallout 3 seems to suggest that Vertibirds have been adapted to run on nuclear power as well.

Taken from the wiki

"It is powered by an internal nuclear fusion reactor, which has been known to detonate under heavy fire. "

Lolz Enclave mk II the same way the Imperial province in oblivion isn't swamp, like it is in the TES lore. gamesas FUBARED it all up.

Another lore contradiction. *shrugs* Another reason you can't trust anything added to the lore from FO3.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYDGu_F3lbQ

watch 9:17 onwards.

President Richardson erased from history? No, that would mean Navarro would fall too, and that no one was around to remember him. We know that not to be true. That would require the complete destruction of the Enclave.

So thats your proof?

here is mine: In FO:NV, you have a little robot companion called ED-E. Secret Recordings in him state there are Enclave in Chicago that are human. Look at the FO2 Emap (on the Rig) and you will see that Chicago is marked. So are the Oil Rig, Navarro, Washington. All the places where Enclave bases are (manned/not Manned). Seeing as 3/4 have been manned, its makes sense that more than just 2 of the 30+ dots had people in them.

And there is no Rule stating: GOOD ENDINGS ARE CANON! So thats just your take on it. Until Chris or some other FO writer makes a continuation or reference to it, then its up in the air.

Chris even writes that the Enclave retreated around the globe. It would explain how they manage to stay powerful in FO3.

So what exactly is your proof? FO2's ending??

Cheers,
Mk II

I would have to say Andaius that even with them running on fuel the vertibirds should be able to reach a range beyond 175 mi. As Tuninator explained this is virtually below WWI aircraft range. Not saying that they can make trans-oceanic flights but they should be able to reach a range of 500-700 miles at least. I would venture to say that the typical range would be nearly 1000 miles.

Quoted directly from The Vault's Vertibird entry-
"The Vertibird has a heavily armored fuselage and can be outfitted with a variety of offensive weapons and defensive countermeasures, the most common being Gatling lasers and missile racks. It is powered by an internal nuclear fusion reactor, which has been known to detonate under heavy fire. "

Fusion reactor=near-unlimited range.

Even if they're running on fuel (which they aren't) as I've indicated in earlier posts there is zero way the Vertibirds could have such pathetic range. How could it have a third of the range of a World War One biplane? I've yet to see an explanation for this. Even on fuel it should have a range in the thousands of miles. A 175 mile range is absolutely preposterous. I hate to say it, but if Black Isle cited the maximum Vertibird range as the oil rig-Navarro transit then they had no idea what they are talking about. The UH-60 Blackhawk, a helicopter fulfilling a role similar to that of the Vertibird, was first flown in 1974 and had a maximum range of 1,380 miles. That's like sixteen times the Vertibird range you and Styles support. It just doesn't make sense.

A combat aircraft that had to operate at airbases no more than 87.5 miles from the front (less because more fuel would be used under combat conditions) would be utterly unusable as it would be nearly impossible to safely maintain a number of airbases that close to the front lines.

Simple logic dictates that there is no way Vertibird range can be 87.5 miles.

Unlike you I played Fallout 2. I don't need Wiki and youtube.

The Rig gets blown UP but NAVARRO was never explained!!

Van Buren was to explain what happened to Navarro.

New Vegas tells us what happened to it.

Your proof if just speculation. You saw a table with blinking lights and came up with a theory. There is nothing in Fallout 2 saying that table represents bases. Chris Avellone wrote the bible years ago back when he was workin on Fallout 3 aka Van Buren.


All you have is speculation and a line from none-canon lore. I support my statements with things said in Fallout 2, Fallout 3 and New Vegas! I also use better known widely accepted lore that is backed by things said in the game such as world went to hell and so on.

Hang on where are we getting the 175 miles number from? I find it incredibly unlikely that the Oil Rig is only 175 miles away from the Navarro or any part of the coast for that matter. I always assumed it was much, much, further out in the Pacific. Hence the competition with the Chinese. 175 miles is way too close to American shore for it to be plausible that:

A. It wasn't noticed by the USA until very late in hunt for oil.
B. The Chinese could plausibly attempt to develop it.

It's from a statement taken from Fallout 2 that is rather ambiguous and really shouldn't be used as a measure of Vertibird range in any capacity.

It was stated in Fallout 2 that the Oil Rig was "just off the coast".

Lolz so your honestly going to go by gamesas, "Hollywood you shoot it and it blow's up in a mushroom cloud" lore? Your also going to say that you know exactly 100% that fusion reactor in FO gives Unlimited range? When clearly in FO2 that wasn't the case. I'm not using any of FO3 lore because I'm trying to show how it's wrong in the first place.

Also Lt. So you know exactly the vertibird specs so you can get the exact numbers for it fuel tank, and engine fuel efficiency. IF they could fly so far why does the techs at Navarro say the MUST STOP at Navarro because they can't make the return trip? You guys seem to be making up answers to why they should go further while ignoring the fact that in FO2 they couldn't do it. I don't care what we can do today that doesn't factor into what Vertibirds can do. they are clearly short ranged. I just looked up a few Sea helo's in use to day. they have ranges of about 500 miles or so. So it's not that far off for the Vertibird to have such a short range.

By who? I think we can chalk that up to a mistake on the part of the NPC. 175 miles would even be within exclusive US economic rights I believe. Doesn't make sense for it to have gone unnoticed and been open for Chinese development.