It's really frustrating to see how obscurantists manage to impose their views so much that science is considered as religion and religion is considered as science; this is a soulcrushingly sad confusion of two completely orthogonal concepts; but this is a game-related forum anyway.

The Aurbis is an universe driven by stories, not by science. It's the shared hallucination of the fragmented personalities of the Mad GodHead. This is why you have Dragon Breaks. This is why you have Enantiomorphs. This is why you have these "hero-ines" (Shezzarine, Nerevarine, Aevarine etc.) which are resurrection of older archetypes. This is why Morihaus can be a man, a minotaur and a bull at the same time.

There's no hard science behind all this -- just symbolism, mythopoeia, and a lot of psychoanolysis of diseased minds. Evolution doesn't apply.

The devs try to sneak it in. Probably the same dev who called vampirism "porphyric hemophilia."

Morihaus is never a Minotaur, you're getting confused with his and Alessia's Son, plus he is a Bull and a Man at the same time because he is an Ada, Space and Time do not define him, such as with Talos been seen as a Dragon, which relates to the Metaphysics of God-Hood/Ascension rather than Mythopoeia. You have Dragon Breaks because of the Metaphysics that exist in Mundus aswell, not because of Mythopoeia; the only true examples of Mythopoeia are the Entiamorph, and the formation of the Grey Maybe (included the spliting of Aldmeris; the people and the oringinal land of Twelve).

Stupid rules...
In my opinion biological evolution in TES is dependent on cultural and philosophical evolution of men and mer, so the basic units for evolution in TES aren't genes but memes and it isn't darwinian evolution but more likely lamarckian evolution.

MK said he had been represented as a minotaur by artists trying to convey the "man and bull at the same time" without going all Picasso. It doesn't matter what he actually were, anyway. It's all representations created by mortal mental stress.

The metaphysics are caused by myth, because TES is nothing more than a story created in a single but fragmented consciousness. The Mad Godhead thought of the same events in different ways, and can't tell which "really happened" because none of them really happened. So, loss of linear time, and dragon break.

Time is nothing more than the illusion of sequentiality in the fabricated memories of the Mad Godhead.

Time is the physical (as in appearing as a Force, not within the physical Boundries of Space) emodiment of AE (the eventual posibility), Space is the eventual response to AE, forming from O, the illusion is sequencality to mortals, when they can't realise the loss of linearity during a period of chaos, as when the GodHead becomes whole (the fusing of Space and Time, Lorkhan and Akatosh, when the Dragon Breaks, and the First Mortal Wakes again).

Metaphysics aren't merely myth, they are what define the limitations of the Godhead. They exist before even Anu and Padomay exist, and well after into the infinite, they are the laws of existence; even Vehk knows this is truth (though these laws may be leapt over, in the case of Kalpa jumping, but AE corrects this, as seen in the case with Dagon).

AE is law; everything will eventually happen. Time is born of this, in response to Space dynamically being created paralel.

O is law; everything will eventually be. Space is born of this, in response to Time dynamically being created paralel.

These are not illusions, these are Metaphysical fact, the GodHead is merely a description of the sentient One and All that is governed by these rules and interprets them to mortal perspective, those who become One with the GodHead then can also interpret these laws, but they cannot be undone (if you were to try and undo space, time would also colapse, and everything would Zero Sum and O would be acheived, which AE would eventualy split, and recreate the universe, for it is an infinite law of existence).

There was evolution, but not the kind people would usually associate with it. Mer believe they are descendant from the gods, gods that upon creation of the world became weaker and weaker and had to make children to last. Each generation was weaker then the previous one, but also more adapt to the limitations of Nirn.

What really happened was devolution.

It was probably lost in the noise, but did no one realise that the OP was mistakenly talking about technological progress as if it was the same the same thing as biological change? And did no one answer his questions about technological progress, which really should be a resounding "YES!"

Context:



Er, except the last part, because the gods really are their ancestors...

Land Dreugh are just a different life stage of water Dreugh. There's no evolution involved.

Well spotted.

Yeah, they undergo a stage known as "Karvanisim", during which they walk on land for a while. They consume their land-dwelling organs once they return to the water. One wonders why this wasn't mentioned in that book in Oblivion, though.

"Karvinasim, but very good, nonetheless," said Adanorcil.

I don't think that they're the land phase. Besides the fact that there are no aquatic Dreughs in Cyrodiillic waters, Land Dreughs are much larger and more powerful than most aquatic Dreughs.

There are no water Dreugh near Cyrodill beacuse they're all on land...

http://www.imperial-library.info/mwbooks/worn_and_weathered_note.shtml

What I meant was that if the Land Dreughs in Cyrodiil were actually the younger phase, then there would be the aquatic advlt ones around Cyrodiil. And the meaning of that note is debatable.

From 2920, The Last Year of the First Era
"What is this?"

The students understood this test. It asked them to cast a spell of identification on the mysterious object. Each initiate closed his or her eyes and imagined the ball in the realm of the universal Truth. Its energy had a unique resonance as all physical and spiritual matter does, a negative aspect, a duplicate version, relative paths, true meaning, a song in the cosmos, a texture in the fabric of space, a facet of being that has always existed and always will exist.

"A ball," said a young Nord named Welleg, which brought giggles from some of the younger initiates, but a frown from most, including Sotha Sil.

"If you must be stupid, at least be amusing," growled the sorcerer, and then looked at a young, dark-haired Altmer lass who looked confused. "Lilatha, do you know?"

"It's grom," said Lilatha, uncertainly. "What the dreugh meff after they've k-k-kr-krevinasim."

"Karvinasim, but very good, nonetheless," said Sotha Sil. "Now, tell me, what does that mean?"

"I don't know," admitted Lilatha. The rest of the students also shook their heads.

"There are layers to understanding all things," said Sotha Sil. "The common man looks at an object and fits it into a place in his way of thinking. Those skilled in the Old Ways, in the way of the Psijic, in Mysticism, can see an object and identify it by its proper role. But one more layer is needed to be peeled back to achieve understanding. You must identify the object by its role and its truth and interpret that meaning. In this case, this ball is indeed grom, which is a substance created by the dreugh, an underwater race in the north and western parts of the continent. For one year of their life, they undergo karvinasim when they walk upon the land. Following that, they return to the water and meff, or devour the skin and organs they needed for land-dwelling. Then they vomit it up into little balls like this. Grom. Dreugh vomit."

The students looked at the ball a little queasily. Sotha Sil always loved this lesson.

Land dreugh are not a different species from water dreugh. They are juveniles.

The note is pretty clearly a Dreugh.

And who says they haven't swam away?



No, They're adolescents. The juvenilles are water Dreugh (as are the advlts)

It's not clear at all. On anything.


I find it odd that there would be no advlt ones in the area where the younger ones are, either to lay their eggs (if they lay eggs) or if they are ones that recently became aquatic. Also, the land Dreughs are far larger than aquatic ones; I don't think that adolescents would be that much larger than the advlts.

Besides, we know there are no water dreugh because it would just take to excess the breathtaking biodiversity of Cyrodiil's marine life.

Seriously, there isn't a reason why there shouldn't be water dreugh in the waters of Cyrodiil. Especially considering we see them on opposite ends of Tamriel, from the Iliac Bay to Vvardenfell. My guess is that because you hardly ever go in the water, which are about as empty as the void, they decided to cut off yet another thing they considered to be superfluous.

In that case, they probably left out adolescent water dreughs as well.

Its not like Morrowind's aquatic biodiversity was much better.

It had 100% more creatures. That's a pretty big difference!

It had only one more creature. It depends on your viewpoint.

True, but they at least had water dreugh, which are a neat example of those unique creatures those guys who want a bit of the fantastical in their fantasy were talking about. I've loved them since Daggerfall.

Still, I've always maintained the Elder Scrolls hasn't done much with their waterscapes. When you have a spell like water-breathing, the freedom of adventuring through underwater ruins and architecture really shouldn't be neglected. And yes, there should be more aquating monsters. It could be a whole other world to explore down there.

Need more tentacle monsters. Then TES V would sell like hotcakes in Japan.

Two more.
Oblivion has slaughterfish (one model) and mudcrab.
Morrowind has small slaughterfish, big slaughterfish (two models instead of one), mudcrab, and dreugh.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dCUS8AcJr4&NR=1