The Forsworn, Necromancers & Dibella. : The Elder Scrolls Series Discussion

» Mon May 07, 2012 6:20 pm

While playing Skyrim, I noticed that in a few locations - that held either Forsworn or necromancers - shrines to Dibella that were surrounded by bloody bones or other (I assume) profane items. So I started wondering about what they could be up to. Are they tying to corrupt not only how the Goddess is worshiped but the fundamental principle of Dibella herself, and is that actually possible lore-wise.

» Mon May 07, 2012 3:18 pm

To add to this, there's a quest in which the forsworn kidnapp the sybil of Dibella.

» Tue May 08, 2012 1:27 am

I don't think there's much information at all describing the religious beliefs of the Reachmen, other than that they worship the "old gods". For all we know, the Reachmen worship a different form of Dibella to whom they ascribe different characteristics which is a prevalent cultural practice throughout Tamriel.

» Tue May 08, 2012 1:04 am

To add to this, there's a quest in which the forsworn kidnapp the sybil of Dibella.

That's where I first noticed it, the second place was the fort that you go to in the Sanguine quest ( who could be seen as Dibella's opposite)

» Mon May 07, 2012 4:30 pm

Love is sacrifice, they say.

» Mon May 07, 2012 1:38 pm

The art book repeatedly describes the Foresworn as profaning nature. While Kynareth would be the most obvious deity of that, Dibella as beauty is also something to be corrupted.

» Mon May 07, 2012 11:59 pm

The art book repeatedly describes the Foresworn as profaning nature. While Kynareth would be the most obvious deity of that, Dibella as beauty is also something to be corrupted.

The Skyrim art book? Interesting. I always thought the Forsworn were all druidic and concerned with living in harmony with nature. Although the numerous animal mutilations struck me as being odd if they were truly druids.

» Mon May 07, 2012 12:24 pm

The Skyrim art book? Interesting. I always thought the Forsworn were all druidic and concerned with living in harmony with nature. Although the numerous animal mutilations struck me as being odd if they were truly druids.

Desperate times and all that.

» Tue May 08, 2012 2:56 am

Desperate times and all that.

I can't imagine the desperation that could cause people to put goat heads on sticks.

» Tue May 08, 2012 12:10 am

I can't imagine the desperation that could cause people to put goat heads on sticks.

They also have Spriggan heads all over the place, and I would have assumed those to be natural allies of any Druidic types.

» Tue May 08, 2012 1:37 am

They also have Spriggan heads all over the place, and I would have assumed those to be natural allies of any Druidic types.

Again, it makes me wonder what their real allegiance is. I had thought they were like the Pagans from Thief, who disdained civilization and killing nature, but the Forsworn do an awful lot of it.

» Mon May 07, 2012 9:37 pm

Again, it makes me wonder what their real allegiance is. I had thought they were like the Pagans from Thief, who disdained civilization and killing nature, but the Forsworn do an awful lot of it.

I'm not sure the Forsworn have a real allegiance except to "the old ways" (which seem to involve an awful lot of hagravens and their briarheart servants, both arguably deeply unnatural beings) and the ending of Nord rule in Markarth.

» Mon May 07, 2012 5:52 pm

I'm not sure the Forsworn have a real allegiance except to "the old ways" (which seem to involve an awful lot of hagravens and their briarheart servants, both arguably deeply unnatural beings) and the ending of Nord rule in Markarth.

Concerning the Hagravens and Briarhearts, I have to wonder what their old ways and old magic refer to, considering that the oldest magic (Magnus-based) would be the Psijic Order. The same goes with the "old gods". I hesitate to say that it's contrivance from the writers, but as far as the et'Ada are concerned, there are no older gods, at least not the animistic ones the Forsworn seem to worship.

» Mon May 07, 2012 3:37 pm

Concerning the Hagravens and Briarhearts, I have to wonder what their old ways and old magic refer to, considering that the oldest magic (Magnus-based) would be the Psijic Order. The same goes with the "old gods". I hesitate to say that it's contrivance from the writers, but as far as the et'Ada are concerned, there are no older gods, at least not the animistic ones the Forsworn seem to worship.

I always took it as their old ways, their old gods, not necessarily the most truly old ways and gods of men. For all we know, their old gods are simply the daedra in funny masks, and, hell, they may have originated in the Third Era for all we know. People do have the tendency to look back to their grandfathers and just go, "well, that's how it's always been."

» Mon May 07, 2012 10:51 pm

I always took it as their old ways, their old gods, not necessarily the most truly old ways and gods of men. For all we know, their old gods are simply the daedra in funny masks, and, hell, they may have originated in the Third Era for all we know. People do have the tendency to look back to their grandfathers and just go, "well, that's how it's always been."

Do you think that the Reachmen are representative of the first Men? Their primitive dress and weapons could suggest such. It makes me wonder if that's what the Heartland men looked like during Alessia's rebellion. Then Pelinal shows up. Truly robot armor from the future in their eyes.

» Mon May 07, 2012 10:44 pm

Do you think that the Reachmen are representative of the first Men? Their primitive dress and weapons could suggest such. It makes me wonder if that's what the Heartland men looked like during Alessia's rebellion. Then Pelinal shows up. Truly robot armor from the future in their eyes.

I have no idea. My perception of them is that during the events of Skyrim, they are more a racial cult than anything else. A quick search suggests the Reachmen really are recognized as an ancient people, however; how true the "modern" Reachman ways are to their history is impossible to tell.

EDIT: Oh, and all this assumes Reachman society was unified--we have no idea whether there are other factions that are poorly represented by those we encounter in the game.

» Mon May 07, 2012 8:10 pm

Could be that the Reachers worship The Eight in the guise of Animal gods.

I recall there being forum speculation as to whether all those animal totems being representative of the divines.

» Mon May 07, 2012 2:35 pm

I forgot all about those, but that was a Nordic belief, something the Forsworn would shun, if for no reason other than Nords believed it.

» Mon May 07, 2012 11:57 am

The quest line about the tree in Whiterun shows hagravens like to butcher spriggans.

» Mon May 07, 2012 7:42 pm

Like I've been saying, the Foresworn are a giant pimple on everyone's ass. Even nature's ass.

» Mon May 07, 2012 8:28 pm

I have found that Forsworn Briarhearts have an add similarity to Lorkhan.

» Mon May 07, 2012 1:14 pm

They have hearts put back in, in the form of artichokes, not left out. There's a similarity, but I'm not liking the taste.

» Mon May 07, 2012 11:19 pm

Corrupted myth-echo is more likely.

» Tue May 08, 2012 12:40 am

Like I've been saying, the Foresworn are a giant pimple on everyone's ass. Even nature's ass.

I've been wondering how they've even stayed alive this long. Every time the Reachmen are mentioned in history they're being pummeled.

» Mon May 07, 2012 7:57 pm

The frequent animal slaughtering could simply be the Forsworn attempting to appease their gods, to help them against the Nords. They've also sacrificed giants; there's the one at the Forsworn encampment by Skyhaven Temple. They could worship nature and practice this at the same time, although the association with Hagravens is kind of damning.