I was just replaying some FO:NV, and was listening to ED-E's recordings. From listening to this forums members, I had come to believe ED-E's recordings would point to there being one, singular, outpost in Chicago.

However, upon listening to ED-E's recordings, carefully, I came across him (it?) saying this:

"If you are listening to this from one of our Chicago outposts,..."

For as long as I had been playing FO:NV, I had been expecting the Enclave to be the size of the the Mojave BoS Chapter outpost. However, after listening to the recording, I now believe that there seems to be a string of outposts that the Enclave posses, maybe not too many, but a few. That would seem to point to the Enclave in Chicago to be somewhat stronger, in comparison, to the Mojave BoS, even if just slightly. And Navarro is described as just a outpost in the same recording, so Outpost does not mean small from my understanding...

Perhaps the Developers putting in this line was intentional to set up the scene for the next game? I have also heard that Caesar mentions BoS Scribes being caught to the East of Legion Territory, and Bethesda defending FO Tactics as Cannon.

Maybe the Compass is pointing to Chicago for the MW BoS and the Enclave to meet...

You arn't the first to point that out. That Ed-E says outposts

Navarro didn't have that big of a population. Chicago could have small outposts but not manned. It might just be something like OWB, one small bunker with a lab here and another one there. They were most likely built by the Enclave on their way to DC after the events of Fallout 2.

MWBoS are also refrenced in Fallout 3. So they could very well still be incontrol of bunkers from Chicago to Colorado Springs.

Nothing new. Its well accepted that the Enclave still have something in Chicago. My guess is that they are Mojave BOS sized, with some Vertibirds still left, but thats just my personal speculation.

Since I don't pass down a chance:

"I really hope the http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2ZcpcO7C58 is canon. The story would be awesome. Enclave in Chicago would be a lot like the MWBoS that have started to form a fascist military dictatorship that goes from Chicago to Colorado but the Enclave would have had to change as well. Despite the BoS acting a lot like them they are still impure in the eyes of the Enclave but if the Enclave in the area were smart they could become allies with the BoS.

Way I see it. The MWBoS fight a bloody war against the Super Mutants and then the Calculator. They force settlements to aid them by giving food, ammo and their best and brightest. Many people do join willingly but the BoS treat them as cannon fodder. The Elders let mutations join because they can be very useful in places humans can't due to radiation.

Vault Zero falls to the BoS and Barnaky becomes one with the Calculator. The BoS are happy to have General Barnaky back. There is a push to make him the head Elder of the MWBoS. The famed warrior (you) who is also a General backs the move to make Barnaky the new head elder, which he does become.

He soon recalls all mutations from the BoS armies and orders them back to their home bases were they are disarmed and tagged, later to be sent to work camps. BoS stops letting mutations join. Laws are passed and any mutation within the BoS' territory is to be rounded up and also sent to camps (work/death camps) which is the start of the great betrayal.

Elders that were most against Barnaky becoming head elder are removed from power. Soon purges happen with in the BoS, anyone that was against Barnaky or seen to aid mutations are also sent to the camps, entire settlement get put to the flame. Soon the Mutant Liberation army forms. BoS caravans and outpost get hit, work camps are liberated, the BoS see a dramatic fall in people willing to join the BoS, and they start having desertions.

Human numbers are replaced more and more by calculator robots and more purges follow fearing an inside job. The BoS stop trying to contact the West in order to get their own house in order.

Biggest blow happens when rouge BoS members set off several bombs within Vault Zero in a failed coup d'état. Many of the calculators systems are damaged beyond repair. Barnaky lives but finds has less control over the robotic forces. He can't control them all at once and the ability to make more robots is severely hampered.

Mutant Liberation Army makes allies with what’s left of the Reaver movement and are supplied with EMP weapons. The remaining slaver/raider groups once again become strong and prey on BoS settlements and outposts.

Decades of bloody Guerrilla warfare against the MLA and the predation of other factions (slavers, raiders) have driven the MWBoS back to their remaining strongholds such as Vault Zero and Cities in between Colorado and Chicago.

Lyons and his BoS are sent out to make contact but don't really know where they are, they know the MWBoS went East, they took a path that takes them away from the MWBoS strongholds at Vault Zero and the others in the Midwest. As Lyons gets closer to DC he hears rumors of people that have similar tech and a symbol are in the area. Lyon spends a long time hunting down those rumors. MWBoS fearing that Lyons is just the tip of a larger army coming up from the south west, do what they can to not be found by them.

Lyons is persistent and soon the MWBoS send out a group of their own elders to make contact. they tell Lyons that MWBoS are just a few hundred men and women close to Chicago. Lyons having made contact goes on to the more important mission of heading to DC.

Like the Barnaky ending states it’s a war the Mutant Liberation Army is distended to lose. MWBoS have seen bitter defeat after bitter defeat for generations and are now a shadow of their glory days but time is on their side. Mutations can't reproduce and the ones that don't fall to the BoS will be taken care of by father time. Humans and fellow BoS that sided with the MLA grow tired of fighting, seeing as how they have crippled the MWBoS and liberated much of their territory. Most just want to settle and farm, the threat is all but gone (so they think). After generations of war the younger generations don't take up the fight.

Maybe the MWBoS will find an ally in Augustus Autumn and his advanced tech can help the MWBoS take back what they lost."

"The hard times" I see for the Midwestern Brotherhood is a decades long war with the Mutant Liberation Army combined with a very paranoid General Barnaky that caused people to turn away from the BoS and ever rebel against the BoS. Along with Slavers, Raiders and Reavers rebuilding their power and causing problems. The Calculator gets damaged to the Robot Army can't be controlled all at once and new Robots take longer to be built. The Brotherhood are forced back to strongholds across the Midwestern United States.

Midwestern BoS can't produce their own PA so not every member gets one. Only the elite get the best weapons and armour. That is fact.

Enclave would have been worse off the Midwestern BoS. Midwestern BoS surround them and make a deal. Help us or die where you stand. Enclave takes the deal and move on to DC. Only a couple dozen scientists are left behind, which they were going to do any way. The Midwestern BoS give the Enclave supplies and a base in exchange for more advanced tech/weapons. Midwestern BoS make sure they are well guarded.
When Remnants come back from DC they learn more about the Midwestern BoS under Barnaky and their goals. Some see this as a chance to regain some power. A deal is made for Enclave leaders to become elders and the Enclave to remain independent body with in the Brotherhood ranks. Like I.T guys for the Brotherhood.
They help out the scribes and so on developed weapons to fight the enemies of the BoS. The Mutant Liberation army being the most pressing, Enclave leaders now elders start doing what Enclave does best. Become a shadow government with the MWBoS and someday take total control.

Who knows, maybe the Enclave make a deal with Barnaky to help make humanity pure blood again like the Enclave. Maybe that was Augustus' idea all along and why he went against Eden. Maybe he wanted to find a way to make waste landers pure through genetic engineering or breeding. Now he has a willing leader, Barnaky. That is willing to let the Enclave experiment to make humanity pure again, think about it people."

Interesting. But this would all be speculation, their population size, that is. Right? And If the outposts where not manned, why would they include a audio log that is in English, for people to hear?

I have to admit though, a Chicago Enclave vs MidWest BoS vs Wastelanders would be a very fun game. Didn't the non-humans in tactics end up suffering for 2/3 the endings? The Midwest BoS, I could imagine, would be in a war against Mutations, with the Enclave sneaking in under the radar with a similar goal. Perhaps The Enclave would use the BoS to further their own mutation cleansing ambitions, only to turn on the MW BoS in the end?

EDIT: Just saw your theory. But Manned outposts wouldn't just be held by a few scientists. They would need protection and supplies to survive in the wasteland. And for any chance of ED-E running into a patrol, they would need some manpower. Even the Mojave BoS chapter was too small (or weak) for patrols. So it seems lgical they would need to be at least slightly bigger.

They could be not manned most of the time. Like a power station, weather station of fueling place.

The mutants only really suffer under the Barnaky Ending. It is also the only Ending that gives us the Mutant Liberation Army.

I would like the MWBoS to be back and for them to be under the control of Barnaky. I can see a role for Enclave remnants to be allied with them.



Robots can protect them. Auto defence Systems can defend them. One or two people with laser gattlings in APA MKII can protect people.

MWBoS Allies can protect people :shifty:

Yes. BoS as allies would be very interesting, but I doubt the Enclave would trust them all too much unless the MW BoS and West Coast BoS where 100% split off from each other. If I remember correctly, the west coast BoS hunted down and imprisoned the Enclave side by side with the NCR. Ha! I doubt the MW BoS would trust the Enclave for that matter, but one never knows.

As far as population size is concerned, it would be purely speculation so there is no point in debating it, they could be the equivalent size of three Navarros, or 1/2 the size of the Mojave BoS chapter. I just doubt the devs would even mention them or think about mentioning them unless they did have some significance to come :shrug: But thats my opinion.