I dont remember if a thread has ever been dedicated only to this concept, but I think it deserves one. Especially with all the speculating on Skyrim, etc.

Im not going to start my super spiel just yet, as I want to see what people have to say on it first. I am aware it is not official, but it is the most in depth theory/idea/whatever it is I have come across.

If you havent taken a look at it over at the Imperial Library, I highly recommend you doing so as soon as you're able. Quite an interesting read.

What exactly are you wanting to discuss about it? It covers a fairly wide range of topics, any one of which could fill (and has at some point filled) its own thread.

Well I made this topic primarily to discuss the "tower" concept, along with the "return of the Ayleids" idea.

Edit: Dang-it. Not fast enough on the snark.

Since this topic is here I do have a question: Nu-Hatta mentions eight lesser towers around White-Gold tower, which towers does he speak about? The towers which are part of the Imperial City (but there is 6/9 of them) or does he mean THE Towers (but I don't think that there is eight of them either)?
Also what the Ayleids hoped to achieve by creating the Wheel within the Wheel, I thought that their goal was to destroy the world (go back to the state before the creation of Mundus), so how does creating this Wheel helps them to achieve their goal?

I don't think that has ever been cleared up. It probably works either way.

The Nine known towers are Adamantine, Red-Tower, Walk-Brass, Snow-Throat, Crystal-like-Law, Orichalc, Green-Sap, White-Gold and Orichalc. Presumably there are more.



In the wheel Mundus is connected to Aetherius by the spokes and magic flows in through the stars. White-Gold imitates this structure and because magic is sympathetic, it makes their tower more effective.

Some links to explain the mode of thought behind that:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargo_cult
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sympathetic_magic

If there were more, the model would be broken. Is that the point?

I believe there is one more tower that isn't mentioned though it is debateable I believe it is a tower or well imitates a tower. the staff of chaos. but if it is a tower then what would that make the horn of summoning?

off topic: who's to bet that the horn of summoning is going to be a plot device in skyrim?

I keep waiting for the Staff of Chaos to be referred to at least. I don't think the horn will be used as the staff is not anywhere in the Arena anymore.


Presumably Akavir's got at least one. Though it might be in the form of their ruler (Tosh Raka). More concretely, the Maormer should have one, if you read http://www.imperial-library.info/content/oblivion-father-niben in the right light.

From the perspective of Firsthold, where these ships came from, Northeast lies Adamantine (which Topal pretty much goes directly towards), Northwest lies Yokuda and presumably Orichalc, and South lies Pyandonea.

I included White-Gold in the list of nine. Eight spokes and a hub.

There presumably are more because thats what Nu-Hatta implied, though I don't think it's relevant to the thing working or not.

If the model could be broken in that way, it would have never been not-broken.

It's been [censored] up from the beginning, then.

If it weren't, there'd be no missing god.

is it 9 towers for 9 races?

Nope, tower building was an Elven thing. There are seven towers build by Mer, the first two were build by the gods.

ok, but maybe since the towers manipulate creation then they affected the creation of these 9 races 9 (or if not affected then they were emulated in a sympathetic way?)? I mean it does seem like each province has its own. I havent looked at their locations recently but : Red mountain for dunmer, white-gold for imperials, snow- throat for nords (i wonder if this will figure at all in TES V), ada-mantia for high rock etc??

Black Marsh has none, Morrowind had both Red Mountain and the first Numidium, at least until Vivec sold it to Cyrodiil. Hammerfell has none either.

So the purpose of creating the Wheel was for the White-Gold to be more efficient in collecting creatia than the other Towers?

Well to be exact according to Nu-Hatta it gives White-Gold a power over creatia unlike any of the other power. This was the effect of the setup, if it was also the intend or goal I don't know.

Since Argonians are descendants of the Hist then no tower is needed there i guess. The numidium i think fits in perfectly with the Dwemer. Perhaps their race sprung up emulating it ( similarities between techonology and a giant robot are easy to make, even if they didnt think it was a magical focus of craetion) and then, with a twist of irony, became the skin upon it (as per recent theries).

As for Redguards, they came from another land, which perhaps has a lost tower somewhere. Or perhaps it doesn't and that's why Yokuda sunk into the depths of the ocean. Dunno.

The Dwemer made the Numidium.

The Left-Hand Elves built Orichalc.

Yes, indeed, but now it has existed forever no? It is outside time




Who are the left-hand elves?

We don't know.

Yokudan mer is all we know. Likely a name for the "other Ehlnofey." We don't know.

A quick search in UESP brings up



but no orichalc tower though the intercept mentions it.

So we have these towers that have fallen:
Red Mountain
Walk-Brass [Anumidium]
White-Gold Tower
Orichalc??? (the god associated with it is now a local power spirit after maybe using the tower or stone within to create weapons to destroy the Left hand elves?? ( i dont really know what to do with it)

So the remaining ones are:
Crystal-like-Law [The Crystal Tower]
Green-Sap [Falinesti]
Snow Throat [Throat of the World

Crystal Tower is in Summerset, Green Sap in Valenwood and Snow Throat in Skyrim where we are next headed. So perhaps it is time for snow throat to be destroyed as well making this world even more unstable ?

I don't know what is happening to the Crystal Tower and Green Sap or indeed the Orichalc, if anyone has read anything then do let us know.


The thought of the Redguards fighting the left hand elves using weapons built by destroying the orichalc tower appeals to me. Since the tower was gone and its influence on creation extinguised this could have caused Yokuda to sink and disappear. So in effect the Redguards brought upon them the destruction of their homeland and had to move to Tamrie:l the centre of the eternal struggle of men and mer. Of course this is all conjecture

White-Gold Tower hasn't fallen.