Yeah, before this discussion I didn't think there were that many holes in the story, but the more I think about it, the less sense the whole thing makes.

Unless they decide to let the minutemen fester right under their noses, Diamond City is the biggest waster threat to the BoS, so not much. They have no reason to think that they can't take on the wasteland by themselves unless they're completely oblivious.

Speaking as a professional writer, portraying real life would always be viewed as bad writing given the bad nonsensical decisions people make.

Albeit, this one makes sense as the BoS are a pack of enormous racists while the Railroad isn't aware they are.

It's kind of funny the BoS comes charging in against every side with no motivation other than, "Technology! GRRRR!"

There is an ending where Railroad destroys the airship that proves that destroying them first wasn't unjustified. It's quite possible that Railroad can intercept their communication, because of the technology they have.

Yeah, but the Brotherhood launches an attack on the Railroad first.

Given their conflicting goals it makes more sense than letting the Minutemen proliferate under their noses. I haven't played a character that joins the Railroad yet so I have no idea how comparably convoluted their takedown of the Brotherhood is. I mean, at least they also operate in the shadows, unlike the minute men who operate out in the open.

I have a depressing feeling that the strategy amounts to "throw this vault dweller at the problem" since that seems to be every faction's solution to their problems.

See, therein lies the beauty of it, though. We know the Brotherhood won't hestitate to act in order to destroy targets it sees as potential threats, even if they aren't currently hostile. Poor minutemen logically shouldn't stand a chance.

I think the BoS will annex the Minutemen and make them part of the BOS in the Brotherhood ending, personally.

Like they did all the Rivet City scientists but Doctor Li.

The Minutemen disappeared, because they refused to help the Colonel when, because of internal struggle. Think about how dikeish that is. How can Preston trust them and how can they even trust each other.

Aye, they should do that as soon as they see that they can hold their own against the super muties (ableit only with the vault dweller's constant intervention).

I really wish we had more opportunity to fight alongside factions rather than just fighting for them. The only experience I've found like that so far is the Minutemen retaking the castle. You still lead them, but at least there is a whole force fighting alongside you. Maybe I haven't gone far enough into the BoS quest chain yet.. but there was already the vertibird assault mission on super mutant island with a grand missed opportunity. They should have put a few more birds in the sky and dropped some Knights alongside you to take the island, perhaps just letting you secure the building on your own while the Knights mop up. The rest of the Minutemen chain has been 'do this for us', but at least there was one 'go team!' moment. I assume the end-game quests have some moments like that... at least I hope they do.

To be fair, there was also the Quincy Massacre.

There was a power struggle after the Colonel's death but it wasn't the Death Blow.

That required both the Castle's destruction and Quincy.

Also, anyone think the Institute had Synths involved with it?

If you join the Brotherhood of Steel, there's a badass mission you undertake where you swoop in on a Vertibird and annihilate a Super Mutant outpost with your squad. Doing it made me downright giddy. I, too, wish there were more missions like that.

While I went Railroad (rather than Minutemen--in part because of this thread), the BoS have my back throughout.

They're constantly intervening in places I pass through, killing Raiders and Super Mutants alike.

But yes, I chose to do the Railroad ending rather the Minutemen ending because I think the Brotherhood of Steel are too dangerous of an enemy for the organization to make at this critical stage in their history. The Minutemen I firmly believe could build their Howitzers in secret (or convince Maxson to believe they're HIS howitzers because Maxson is 20 years old and kind of a [censored] despite all of his fighting skill and Charisma stat) but that isn't going to help them several months or a few years down the line.

The Brotherhood does NOT forget.

Nor does it forgive.

The Railroad destroying the Brotherhood, however, leaves the BoS with no targets to vent their rage against.

They might even believe the Institute did it.

Would have felt better if that wasn't the first mission that crashed my game.. twice. But seriously, yeah that was pretty cool. I was all against the BoS, ideologically, before but idk anymore... they're oddly compelling.

The Paladin Danse mission convinced me otherwise.

It was like, "screw these guys if this is their definition of loyalty."

Even with their ideological baggage, they make a pretty good case for strangling the use of technology in the context of the Fallout universe. Pretty much every instance where Super Science gets used results in extremely negative consequences for the world. The War, Super Mutants, Cazadores, etc.

Irresponsible use of knowledge has led humanity down a pretty dark path. I just wish the Brotherhood were a bit more open minded regarding individual cases (Danse, Valentine, etc.). Sometimes idealism is a good thing.

I admit to having a thing for fundamentalists, and well-intentioned extremists in fiction.

My Survivor kept thinking, "Guys, the problem isn't the Synths. It's the Institute which enslaves and produces them and uses them. Why is everyone so damned thick headed?"

Sadly, there's no "Make peace between Stormcloaks and Imperials" option.

How did you manage to get that and still join the railroad? As soon as I entered the Institute, I was barred access to them and failed their recruitment quest.

I played the Brotherhood of Steel quests right up until they ordered me to destroy the Railroad. You become their enemies if you accept that quest so, well, I didn't.

By that point, I'd already joined the Railroad, though. In fact, I got into the Institute with their help as well as Sturges.

I still haven't joined the Institute but have been given my first mission, though.

Which means my Survivor has assembled Liberty Prime, recruited Doctor Li, and retrieved a bunch of nuclear missiles for the BoS (which is kind of insane but he wants to play everyone off against one another and doesn't want to make an enemy of Elder Maxson until he's sure he can take them down).

:/

I wasn't given access to that mission until after I entered the institute. Maybe I needed to complete the first railroad quest to avoid being locked out, or give the signal transponder tech to a faction other than the Brotherhood (giving it to them made the most sense to me. They have lots of extra resources and tech junkies at their disposal).

Yeah, that's rather convoluted.

There's a lot of good stuff here in Bethesda but I think the overlapping Faction stuff is a bit unnecessary.

Better to be like Skyrim and you can join anyone at any time until it's war.

While I knew it wouldn't happen in-game, my Survivor didn't want the BoS getting the teleporter tech because he assumed they might just beam in a nuke.

Shaun be damned.

Which is, of course, the sensible thing to do.

If you make a holotape of the Institute's information, though, you can give it to Sturges, have him make a copy *AND* give THAT to the Brotherhood. All the while working with the Minutemen and Railroad to take down both Institute and BoS while befriending various people inside the former to work against it (Doctor Li, a scientist helping smuggle out Synths, and others).

I feel like I'm Littlefinger crossed with James Bond at this point.

Man, How It Should Have Ended needs to do a spoof where they do exactly that. Liberty Prime is cool and all, but who needs a giant robot when you're sitting on a giant stockpile of nukes you found in the Glowing Sea, and can build a device that hijacks the Institute's teleportation abilities?

Albeit, it begs the question how the Institute hasn't just wiped the Brotherhood off the map.