Well, in the case of a BOS Sole Survivor who turns against them after the Railroad mission or Danse, they think the Minutemen work for them.

Also, you keep mentioning a military without proper commands.

Where are you getting they don't have a proper command?

It helps the Minutemen are a pre-existing organization which has traditions, artillery, weapons stockpiles, and large numbers of existing trained members who are just "retired" because the organization disintegrated after the Battle of Quincy.

Also, the Settlements were already ready to begin their own NCR-like arrangement when the Institute sabotaged their efforts.

Obviously, I think the Minutemen winning against the Brotherhood makes more sense if they're allied with the Brotherhood and the group is demoralized, scattered, and in retreat after the murder of their dictator in a curbstomp battle.

I also imagine the Laser Weapons and Artillery strikes are the only reason the BoS would be able to be beaten even in a small "revenge" force. Artillery is pretty much MADE for two things, taking down slow-moving aircraft and painted targets after all.

Why I am getting that? Just compare them with any real military.

They are like a neighborhood watch compared with the BoS or the NCR military.

And who pays for their training? Shooting radroach doesn't prepare you for a fights against super mutants. And you can draw as many stars on your coat as you want, but that won't help if your "soldiers" get the jitters and retreat in the face of danger. Have you seen any Minutemen training camps?

Yes, it's called the Castle.

Artillery is not good for fighting aircrafts.

Flak has been used to shoot down countless helicopters.

The NCR recruited anyone. The Brotherhood of Steel recruited a select few.

The BoS lost against the NCR because they were outnumbered, not because they aren't good at fighting.

It's good for slow moving blimps.

Without Prydwen Brotherhood in doomed.
1. Their HQ and command structure is no more.
2. There is no docking bays for Vertibirds, remember that thoose things run on OIL. I bet that 99% of BoS oil supply is inherited from the Enclave, so no more fuel. No fuel = no flying.
3. Their main supply base is also destroyed. You know, that base under the blimp... That falling, burning blimp...
4. No supply base = No ammo & fusion cores. BoS groundforces are doomed, they cannot flee the Commonwealth back to Capital Westland.

BTW, using artillery against BoS only shows Minutemen strategic ingenuity, not stupidy.

I think the enclave converted them to run on fusion cores didn't they?

Really? I don't recall that shift. Where was it stated?

I think it's implied since they would have ran out of oil quickly after geting to d.c. and that would be the most logical choice.

The New Vegas branch of the Brotherhood of Steel didn't need a giant blimp to operate in the Mojave, nor did the DC branch need one to operate in the Capitol Wasteland.

The main operating base may have been destroyed, but much of the Brotherhood of Steel was out on patrol when that happened. Sure, they may have lost their massive stockpile of Fusion Cores, but so what? The player is able to find enough in the wasteland to use his many suits of Power Armor, so why couldn't the Brotherhood of Steel?

The Minutemen had only a single advantage over the Brotherhood of Steel, and that was surprise. Now that they no longer have that, they should be easily overwhelmed by a group of well-trained Knights in T60 suits of Power Armor.

You know that Enclave have/had refueling bases across the nation? And Adams Airforce Base probably had quite a stockpile.

@Greed: Bringing NV branch and Lyons era DC branch to the disscusion is irrelevant. BoS is doomed, becouse in contrast to You they have really bad PR in the local community, sure they will randomly raid some bases for fusion cores (and find only one or two... For a whole squad), but the won't buy them, assuming they will be allowed to enter major cities.

To me it seems impractical to rely on stockpiles when you could easily change them to something you make more of.

Who said it is easy? And key word in Your statement is "To me it seems...", just becouse something for You doesn't make sense, doesn't mean it don't have it

They didn't have stellar PR in the Mojave either, but that never stopped Veronica from being able to go out and fetch supplies.

Hell, the Minutemen had a terrible reputation after Quincy. Look at how they were able to bounce back.. and they aren't trained soldiers with Power Armor. They would have been wiped out completely if not for the player finding a suit to use against the Raiders and Deathclaw.

That's just...silly.

90% of the Brotherhood is annihilated in an instant and then there's a collection of the most badass people in the Wasteland around the Sole Survivor.

The Brotherhood touting is plain old ridiculous.

The Minutemen aren't untrained civilians and the Brotherhood isn't some invincible army of super-badasses.

1. Oh, yes. And She was very open about her membership in the Brotherhood She done that undercover. And before You say anything, no DC BoS will not gather supplies incognito. Firstly they don't have qualified personell. Secondly, logistics to manage that kind of work. Thirdly, they seem to be too stuborn and prideful to do that.

2. True, the Minutemen exsists only thanks to the miracle of SS stumbling upon them.

Yes, the Minutemen are extinct after Quincy.

They only return because the Sole Survivor inspires them all to come out of retirement after the organization collapses and recruits others to join the cause. Still, it's wrong to think the organization is a bunch of untrained newcomers. They were a well-armed, well-organized body which had an impressive reputation before it was sullied and its terrible losses. They also had advanced pre-war weaponry.

Power armor is good and all but the point of the settlement mini-game with the Minutemen is building an army of supporters behind you that support your decision to go against the Brotherhood or not.

And I also hate when people try to oversell the Brotherhood. I love them to death but the games are kind about them usually being overwhelmed or taking heavy losses.

The debate over what vertibirds are fueled by is dumb.

There is a reason they produce a freaking mushroom cloud when they explode.

I confess, I was genuinely perplexed when people stated the Enclave couldn't cross the country in nuclear-powered helicopters.

EVERYTHING is nuclear-powered in Fallout.

And whose providing the money and resources for the training, weapon maintainance, and infrastructure? The scattered, junk-dwelling wastelanders?

The difference between the NCR and the Minutemen are huge. The NCR is literally a fully functioning modern nation at this point. And even THEN the Brotherhood still got some good shots in on them. how does it make any sense for the Minutemen to win against them...like...any sense at all?

*edited for politeness*

Well, it's not a war.

They're not fighting Lost Hills or a sustained campaign across California.

This is the destruction of the Prydwen and fighting off an attack on their heavily fortified bunker with Pre-War technology and artillery which has been proven to do close range assaults.

Still, if it took a modern day nation the size of California, Baja California, Oregon, parts of Nevada, and parts of Mexico to push back the Brotherhood (the war actually isn't over by the way, there's still cells in California fighting back), then how can we really believe the Minutemen can go against an entire detachment of these elite technologically superior warriors and scientists who've managed to survive against a modern nation?